Got denied on my interview b'coz of not having my decision yet at the court from my previous marriage

[daboyz 36]

What you do or don't do is your choice. "Try to fit..." is something from your imagination. If the actions fit, they fit. No need to try to make them fit. The fact remains, the person facing a potential lifetime ban as the subject of this thread is not in the USA and not subject to US Criminal Penalties, so they are simply irrelevant to the OP's circumstances or to the circumstance of anybody not yet in the USA or who has been deported. Those people are not (presently) subject to prosecution under US criminal law. They are subject to USCIS and Immigration Judges' decisions, not US Criminal law.

What the heck do you think the US Government means when they state lying on forms can result in criminal prosecution?

Are they not saying that violation of immigration law can land you in criminal court?

A penalty is a penalty. I don't get why that is hard to understand.

I'm sorry but you must be in the USA to be subject to criminal prosecution. The OP is a foreigner who was denied a visa. She is not subject to criminal prosecution in US Criminal courts. She is subject to USCIS and Immigration Judges' rulings. As such, the penalties resulting from criminal prosecution do not apply to the OP.

On this discussion, I tend to agree with pushbrk - with one reservation. You write "I'm sorry but you must be in the USA to be subject to criminal prosecution". That's not entirely true. The US of course maintains extradition treaties with many countries, and often returns to US soil those which it wants to prosecute under its laws, both for crimes committed physically in the US before the individual fled abroad and for cases where someone living abroad commits a US crime (e.g. tax evasion). I've not heard of a case of immigration fraud in which the US extradited a USC from overseas back to the US to face trial, but I wouldn't be surprised if that has happened either in an egregious case, or in a routine case where they want to make an example of someone to keep the rest of us on our toes.

With that nit-pick out of the way, the general substance of your discussion with rebeccajo is correct.

I think the confusion is that there are two people facing possible sanctions in a K visa petition: The USC petitioner, and the non-USC beneficiary. And, there are two systems which can mete out potential penalties: the Immigration and Criminal systems.

I think pushbrk is right that the non-USC faces absolutely no jeopardy under US Criminal law. She is simply not subject to US law and it's not relevant to her.

She does face the wrath of the immigration system. Their penalties range all the way from rudeness on the telephone and RFE's.... up to multi-year bans and lifetime bans.

As to the USC, he needs to be concerned both about the Immigration and Criminal penalties.

The difference between our topic here and the news article shared by rebaccajo is that in the news article the non-USC beneficiary had already arrived on US soil, and thus became eligible for criminal prosecution as well as loss of immigration privileges. It's truly not an apples to apples case.

The law states "whoever". It does not differentiate between that person being in or out of the US.

Show me where the law states that fraudulently misstating one's marital status on a document for obtaining a visa can gain one the ban, and this conversation will be over.

Why don't you two get a room and get it over with.

[MIDUVIL 34]

The OP was on this page there was 10 minutes and didn't reply

[natty bumppo 297]

No lifetime bar. That is usually reserved for claiming to be a US Citizen.

Since the petitioner submitted the paperwork ... the least we can do is throw him a necktie party.

[rebeccajo 14]

For the record again, I have asserted the OP may be subject to up to a lifetime ban for a material misrepresentation. The principal argument against that would relate to what constitutes material misrepresention in the eyes of USCIS or ultimately an immigration judge. The immigration judge would come into the picture in case of an appeal or waiver request.

Yes you have.

And I have shown you what the penalties are IF the government cares to impose them. You contend these penalties are applicable only to those under jurisdiction of the US government.

Those applying for a visa to ENTER the US happen to be under that jurisdiction.

Again - show me where the intending immigrant can earn the lifetime ban for misstating their marital status.

The only reason I entered this thread in the first place is because I have a problem with your suggestion of the ban. The OP has enough trouble to begin with without conjecturing about the ban.

[pushbrk 12,895]

For the record again, I have asserted the OP may be subject to up to a lifetime ban for a material misrepresentation. The principal argument against that would relate to what constitutes material misrepresention in the eyes of USCIS or ultimately an immigration judge. The immigration judge would come into the picture in case of an appeal or waiver request.

Yes you have.

No, I haven't. Show me.

And I have shown you what the penalties are IF the government cares to impose them. You contend these penalties are applicable only to those under jurisdiction of the US government.

Those applying for a visa to ENTER the US happen to be under that jurisdiction.

No, only those who actually enter are under that jurisdiction.

Again - show me where the intending immigrant can earn the lifetime ban for misstating their marital status.

I have. Look at the paragraph above the signature on any visa application.

The only reason I entered this thread in the first place is because I have a problem with your suggestion of the ban. The OP has enough trouble to begin with without conjecturing about the ban.

Right, you wouldn't have entered it because of all the others who made even stronger assertions??? Really?? Anyway you having a problem with it and actually refuting it are not the same thing. Try again.

Edited February 7, 2009 by pushbrk

[rebeccajo 14]

Post #43, Mike.

You really can't stand to be challenged, can you?

I mean, nobody is right all the time.

Not even me..............

[Loolie 56]

i hope people here wont make a nonsense issue about someones serious issue. thank you.

Madzcarl2008 was here but she never replied or clear the issue bacause maybe its too much page to read...hehhehehhe.

God bless everyone..just always keep the discussion cool ok.

[Old Dominion 26]

Wow, this subject is still alive?

[cristeta 0]

you should have waited for your decree first before you had your interview...if you receive it try to call the embassy if you can submit it to them and continue the case but i dont think that will work coz you are not really free when you filed so thats a hit.

next time be very careful so you wont go through this over and over again...waste of time, money and it kills you both softly from waiting and waiting and worrying. thats it.

we have the same problem i had my interview last nov 26, 2008 {for CR1 visa) and the consul gave me 221 g requesting for the other divorce papers of my husband the prob is my husband misplaced his papers now my petition was on hold i feel so helpless and hopeless been married for two years and the separation so frusrating and depressing the uscis and nvc should determine and evaluate everything before they submit the petition in the embassy just right now i dunno what will happen to my marriage with this kind of ssituation,,

[daboyz 36]

you should have waited for your decree first before you had your interview...if you receive it try to call the embassy if you can submit it to them and continue the case but i dont think that will work coz you are not really free when you filed so thats a hit.

next time be very careful so you wont go through this over and over again...waste of time, money and it kills you both softly from waiting and waiting and worrying. thats it.

we have the same problem i had my interview last nov 26, 2008 {for CR1 visa) and the consul gave me 221 g requesting for the other divorce papers of my husband the prob is my husband misplaced his papers now my petition was on hold i feel so helpless and hopeless been married for two years and the separation so frusrating and depressing the uscis and nvc should determine and evaluate everything before they submit the petition in the embassy just right now i dunno what will happen to my marriage with this kind of ssituation,,

Why does your profile show "AOS Pending?" Shouldn't it be CR-1/IR-1?

[pushbrk 12,895]

Post #43, Mike.

You really can't stand to be challenged, can you?

I mean, nobody is right all the time.

Not even me..............

So I did. I must have been typing too fast and left out the "up to" contained in several other posts. I stand corrected and reaffirm that my position is that the OP is subject to "up to a lifetime ban". The OP is definitely not subject, in the present tense, to any criminal penalty, imprisonment or fine and that although her USC petitioner could be, prosecution is unlikely.

Nevertheless, the OP is not subject to the penalties of any US Criminal court because no such court has jurisdiction over people who are already forbidden from appearing before it. Well, some don't think that's such a small thing. I suggested earlier, you think "Guantanimo" because things change once people actually arrive on US soil. They then become subject to our criminal courts, not just a new set of penalties but the protections that go with them. Read again the paragraphs affirmed by signing the DS-230 particularly the part that states, "and, if I am admitted to the United States, may subject me to criminal prosecution..."

A lifetime ban is the most serious penalty the OP can face under US law without actually entering the USA. That penalty is not imposed by any US Criminal court. The penalty can be "up to" a lifetime ban. As we know, there are shorter bans as far as I know, all bans are appealable and some waiverable under some circumstances.

If you want to argue about what the OP may be subject to and why, you'll need to chose another premise other than Criminal Law. It simply doesn't apply to the OP.

[Ban Hammer 13,344]

Wow, this subject is still alive?

unfortunately, yes. i'm still waiting for the wake for this thread.

[morocco4ever 63]

you should have waited for your decree first before you had your interview...if you receive it try to call the embassy if you can submit it to them and continue the case but i dont think that will work coz you are not really free when you filed so thats a hit.

next time be very careful so you wont go through this over and over again...waste of time, money and it kills you both softly from waiting and waiting and worrying. thats it.

we have the same problem i had my interview last nov 26, 2008 {for CR1 visa) and the consul gave me 221 g requesting for the other divorce papers of my husband the prob is my husband misplaced his papers now my petition was on hold i feel so helpless and hopeless been married for two years and the separation so frusrating and depressing the uscis and nvc should determine and evaluate everything before they submit the petition in the embassy just right now i dunno what will happen to my marriage with this kind of ssituation,,

All he has to do is go to the courts and request another one. I left mine with my husband, and I couldn't find my copy. It took only about an hour.

[luckytxn 2,264]

Charles. Where's the popcorn? I have the feeling that neither will stop until they have the last word.

[scandal 951]

Charles. Where's the popcorn? I have the feeling that neither will stop until they have the last word.

Aw, cmon... this is the most fun I'm gonna have this weekend now that football season is over. Besides what's the harm in hijacking a thread and belaboring a point? Personally I think we've gotten somewhere, and clarified the core issues.