Lawyer advised to file Single, even though Married

[elkfarmer 4]

From what I gathered from the IRS, once you are married, you can not file as single. The IRS told me to file out the tax form and apply for an ITIN with a W-7, when you send in the tax 1040. Your attorney is not fimiliar with the situation.

[pushbrk 13,133]

From what I gathered from the IRS, once you are married, you can not file as single. The IRS told me to file out the tax form and apply for an ITIN with a W-7, when you send in the tax 1040. Your attorney is not fimiliar with the situation.

Except you "can" because I "did" and so have many others. It's not the proper filing status but the return will be accepted and any refund transmitted. The lawyer is probably familiar with the fact that there's more to a W7 than "filling it out" which you too would understand if you read the previous 3 pages of responses.

[cp2000 0]

From what I gathered from the IRS, once you are married, you can not file as single. The IRS told me to file out the tax form and apply for an ITIN with a W-7, when you send in the tax 1040. Your attorney is not fimiliar with the situation.

Except you "can" because I "did" and so have many others. It's not the proper filing status but the return will be accepted and any refund transmitted. The lawyer is probably familiar with the fact that there's more to a W7 than "filling it out" which you too would understand if you read the previous 3 pages of responses.

To be clear, you "can" file that way because you were not caught, just like you "can" break any other law if you are not caught.

What Pushbrk doesn't state is that filing properly will for many, but not all, people change the amount of taxes you owe to the government. There may or may not be consequences if you are caught. If filing properly would not have made a difference in your tax liability or if it would have actually decreased your tax liability, than there probably will not be tax consequences (I don't know whether there might be immigration consequences, but you never know when you might get a picky interviewer who notices that you filed incorrectly and cares). The tax authorities don't care if you overpaid your taxes. If filing properly would have increased your tax liability, than you have effectively underpaid your taxes. If the tax authorities catch this type of underpayment in time, then at you will at least owe the underpayment, interest on the underpayment and potentially penalty charges on the underpayment. Notice that Puskbrk filed an amended tax return to fix this later after his/her spouse got the SSN. If you fix an underpayment of tax liability by an amended tax return, you will at least owe interest on the underpayment.

This is similar to the tax problems experienced by recent Obama nominees--Tim Geithner (did not pay self employment taxes associated with World Bank employment), Tom Daschle (did not report a free car service as income), and Nancy Killefer (nonpayment of unemployment taxes associated with household help). These are all areas of tax law where many individuals do not correctly file their income taxes and are rarely caught. But if you do get caught, there may be consequences just like they experienced consequences.

To be fair, this is probably closer to (but not the equivalent of) jay walking than murder on a continuum of tax infractions. However, I would never advocate an improper course of action.

[maadams2004 0]

Why not get it directly from the horse's mouth?

http://www.irs.gov/help/article/0,,id=96730,00.html

Telephone Assistance

Live Telephone Assistance

When calling, you may ask questions to help you prepare your tax return, or ask about a notice you have received.

Telephone Assistance for Individuals:

Toll-Free, 1-800-829-1040

Hours of Operation: Monday – Friday, 7:00 a.m. – 10:00 p.m. your local time (Alaska & Hawaii follow Pacific Time).

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Toll-Free, 1-800-829-4933

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Toll-Free 1-800-829-4059 (TDD)

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For further information, see Tax Topic 102.

Telephone Assistance for Individuals who believe they may be a victim of Identify Theft: No Tax Administration Impact - Did not receive a notice from the IRS. Toll-Free 1-800-908-4490 (Automated and live assistance)

Hours of Operation: Monday – Friday, 8:00 a.m. – 8:00 p.m. your local time (Alaska & Hawaii follow Pacific Time). For additional information, refer to our Identity Theft and Your Tax Records page.

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[payxibka 10,047]

except the "horses mouth" is well known to not provide correct information, particularly when it is beyond normal or a "simple" issue. In addition, reliance on information supplied by the IRS helpline is not a viable defense come audit.

[Waldo 0]

I was reading through here and I was curious as to how some of the people for the ITIN did their Power of Attorney. Did you get it notarized in the US or in the foreign country and then translate it into English?

I don't know if it was mentioned before but on page 2, right hand side, very last bullet states if your country is classified under the Hague Convention you can send a COPY of your passport

Here's a link to the Hague Convention to see if your country applies.

Also do you have to show SO income?

Edited February 11, 2009 by Waldo

[Carlos and Jocel 2]

I was reading through here and I was curious as to how some of the people for the ITIN did their Power of Attorney. Did you get it notarized in the US or in the foreign country and then translate it into English?

I don't know if it was mentioned before but on page 2, right hand side, very last bullet states if your country is classified under the Hague Convention you can send a COPY of your passport

Here's a link to the Hague Convention to see if your country applies.

Also do you have to show SO income?

I FILED MINE SINGLE BECAUSE OF THE TIMING AND THE W7 TO GET MY WIFE TO MAIL IT TO THE IRS AND I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WILL MAKE IT ON TIME. I WAS ADVICED TO AMMEND MY IRS RETURN ONCE MY WIFE GET HER OWN SSN. SO IF I GET STIMULUS CHECK THIS YEAR AS A SINGLE, THEN WHEN AMMENDED MY STATUS TO MARRIED THEN I WILL GET THE OTHER HALF IN A LATER TIME.

[MMW 2]

I just spoke to my attorney about the filing status I should for my 2008. He told me to file as single since my wife is in Pakistan, and in order to file married I would need her SS#. So, I guess it's ok to file as single for those people whose husband/wife is abroad. Can anyone share their opinion? Thanks.

Smart attorney. That's the easy option I used. Then, we filed an amended return after she had a tax ID number.

Thanks, but wouldn't it be a problem at the NVC or the embassy, when they see that I am married but I filed as single? I just want to be sure before I go ahead and file my taxes.

No problem that, if asked about can't be solved with by answering, "My husband's attorney told him to file as single since his wife is in Pakistan, and in order to file married He would need my SS#."

Here is what I did. I filed married and when I sent in my taxes, I also filled an application for a ITIN (tax ID number). You will need a notarized copy of your spouse's passport bio page to do this. It was simple and easy. I actually went to HR Block and they took care of every thing for me. I just had to get the notarized copy of the passport bio page. I did have to send the ITIN app and a POA form to my husband to sign and he sent that back to me and then I was able to sign our joint return for the both of us. It took one afternoon not including the couple weeks of mail time to get documents signed by my husband and returned to me. Cost at HR Block was 219 dollars at a Premium office that deals with special situations. I filed joint as further evidence of a financially-obligated marital relationship which can only help us during the interview process. I don't claim to be an expert but I am an Master's Public Administration and my BA is in Political Science. I more or less know how bureaucracy works and its always been rather safe than sorry with me. It doesn't matter how many copies of text messages, lovey-dovey emails and phone bills you submit of evidence of a true relationship. They want to see that you're willing to spend money on your spouse, put him/her beneficiary on bank accounts, have joint checking/credit accounts, as insurance beneficiary etc. They want a paper trail. Invest the 200 dollars and afternoon. It can only help you.

Getting an ITIN requires a US Notary certifying a copy of the immigrant's passport. That means sending a passort from Pakistan. Pretty cumbersome for most people and highly risky.

The W-7 application doesn't require that that the notary be one from the US, what is says that it needs to be a certified copy of the the Bio page (Certified by the issuing office in the immigrants home country) OR notarized by a US notary (ie. post office court officer ect.)

[Teacher Mark 53]

I just spoke to my attorney about the filing status I should for my 2008. He told me to file as single since my wife is in Pakistan, and in order to file married I would need her SS#. So, I guess it's ok to file as single for those people whose husband/wife is abroad. Can anyone share their opinion? Thanks.

Smart attorney. That's the easy option I used. Then, we filed an amended return after she had a tax ID number.

Thanks, but wouldn't it be a problem at the NVC or the embassy, when they see that I am married but I filed as single? I just want to be sure before I go ahead and file my taxes.

No problem that, if asked about can't be solved with by answering, "My husband's attorney told him to file as single since his wife is in Pakistan, and in order to file married He would need my SS#."

Here is what I did. I filed married and when I sent in my taxes, I also filled an application for a ITIN (tax ID number). You will need a notarized copy of your spouse's passport bio page to do this. It was simple and easy. I actually went to HR Block and they took care of every thing for me. I just had to get the notarized copy of the passport bio page. I did have to send the ITIN app and a POA form to my husband to sign and he sent that back to me and then I was able to sign our joint return for the both of us. It took one afternoon not including the couple weeks of mail time to get documents signed by my husband and returned to me. Cost at HR Block was 219 dollars at a Premium office that deals with special situations. I filed joint as further evidence of a financially-obligated marital relationship which can only help us during the interview process. I don't claim to be an expert but I am an Master's Public Administration and my BA is in Political Science. I more or less know how bureaucracy works and its always been rather safe than sorry with me. It doesn't matter how many copies of text messages, lovey-dovey emails and phone bills you submit of evidence of a true relationship. They want to see that you're willing to spend money on your spouse, put him/her beneficiary on bank accounts, have joint checking/credit accounts, as insurance beneficiary etc. They want a paper trail. Invest the 200 dollars and afternoon. It can only help you.

Getting an ITIN requires a US Notary certifying a copy of the immigrant's passport. That means sending a passort from Pakistan. Pretty cumbersome for most people and highly risky.

The W-7 application doesn't require that that the notary be one from the US, what is says that it needs to be a certified copy of the the Bio page (Certified by the issuing office in the immigrants home country) OR notarized by a US notary (ie. post office court officer ect.)

Wrong. That's actually where The Hague Convention comes in. If the Nation is a member of the convention the papers can be notarized or certified by a local. If not the papers must be verified by a notary at the Consulate or the Embassy. I just went through all of this. When my Wife took in the papers the Consulate knew exactly what she was doing and guided her.

Edited February 18, 2009 by Joe Six-Pack

[MMW 2]

I just spoke to my attorney about the filing status I should for my 2008. He told me to file as single since my wife is in Pakistan, and in order to file married I would need her SS#. So, I guess it's ok to file as single for those people whose husband/wife is abroad. Can anyone share their opinion? Thanks.

Smart attorney. That's the easy option I used. Then, we filed an amended return after she had a tax ID number.

Thanks, but wouldn't it be a problem at the NVC or the embassy, when they see that I am married but I filed as single? I just want to be sure before I go ahead and file my taxes.

No problem that, if asked about can't be solved with by answering, "My husband's attorney told him to file as single since his wife is in Pakistan, and in order to file married He would need my SS#."

Here is what I did. I filed married and when I sent in my taxes, I also filled an application for a ITIN (tax ID number). You will need a notarized copy of your spouse's passport bio page to do this. It was simple and easy. I actually went to HR Block and they took care of every thing for me. I just had to get the notarized copy of the passport bio page. I did have to send the ITIN app and a POA form to my husband to sign and he sent that back to me and then I was able to sign our joint return for the both of us. It took one afternoon not including the couple weeks of mail time to get documents signed by my husband and returned to me. Cost at HR Block was 219 dollars at a Premium office that deals with special situations. I filed joint as further evidence of a financially-obligated marital relationship which can only help us during the interview process. I don't claim to be an expert but I am an Master's Public Administration and my BA is in Political Science. I more or less know how bureaucracy works and its always been rather safe than sorry with me. It doesn't matter how many copies of text messages, lovey-dovey emails and phone bills you submit of evidence of a true relationship. They want to see that you're willing to spend money on your spouse, put him/her beneficiary on bank accounts, have joint checking/credit accounts, as insurance beneficiary etc. They want a paper trail. Invest the 200 dollars and afternoon. It can only help you.

Getting an ITIN requires a US Notary certifying a copy of the immigrant's passport. That means sending a passort from Pakistan. Pretty cumbersome for most people and highly risky.

The W-7 application doesn't require that that the notary be one from the US, what is says that it needs to be a certified copy of the the Bio page (Certified by the issuing office in the immigrants home country) OR notarized by a US notary (ie. post office court officer ect.)

Wrong. That's actually where The Hague Convention comes in. If the Nation is a member of the convention the papers can be notarized or certified by a local. If not the papers must be verified by a notary at the Consulate or the Embassy. I just went through all of this. When my Wife took in the papers the Consulate knew exactly what she was doing and guided her.

The HAGUE CONVENTION directly from the website.

Scope and application

A convention on jurisdiction, applicable law, recognition, enforcement and co-operation in respect of parental responsibility and measures for the protection of children

With the signature and ratification by the Member States of the 1996 Hague Convention on Jurisdiction, Applicable Law, Recognition, Enforcement and Cooperation in respect of Parental Responsibility and Measures for the Protection of Children, the European Union would be contributing to the protection of children at international level.

The 1996 Convention, which entered into force on the international plane on 1 January 2002, has huge potential to bring justice and relief to parents and children dispersed over EU territory and third States of all continents, including countries from within the Islamic tradition (Morocco is already a Party to the 1996 Convention). It will help prevent international child abduction and provide a secure legal framework for cross-border contact between children and their parents when families separate. It will help, worldwide, to establish a framework for the co-ordination of legal systems, and for international judicial and administrative co-operation, which will further many objectives of the almost universally ratified United Nations Convention on the Rights of Children of 20 November 1989, and complement the widely ratified Hague Conventions of 25 October 1980 on Child Abduction and of 29 May 1993 on Inter-country Adoption.

What we are talking about is not involving children it a tax related document.

[Teacher Mark 53]

Maybe you should read the W7 instructions.

c Have the copies notarized by a foreign notary. However, foreign

notaries are only acceptable as outlined by the Hague Convention.

The Hague Convention provides for the simplified certification of

public (including notarized) documents to be used in countries that

have joined the Convention. A certification will be issued in the form

of an "apostille," which will be attached to the copy of the

document.

Note. The apostille must stay attached to the copy of the document

when it is sent to the IRS.

[MMW 2]

Maybe you should read the W7 instructions.

c Have the copies notarized by a foreign notary. However, foreign

notaries are only acceptable as outlined by the Hague Convention.

The Hague Convention provides for the simplified certification of

public (including notarized) documents to be used in countries that

have joined the Convention. A certification will be issued in the form

of an "apostille," which will be attached to the copy of the

document.

Note. The apostille must stay attached to the copy of the document

when it is sent to the IRS.

Actually i have read the W-7 and btw have received the ITIN for my wife using it. And my information came directly from an IRS officer not a call center receptionist because i specifically asked to speak to an Agent I did the homework before replying to a post. But I am no expert on the Hague Treaties nor do i claim to know the specifics of how it is applied to a given situation. I just know personal experience with obtaining an ITIN for my spouse for tax purpose.

[Teacher Mark 53]

Maybe you should read the W7 instructions.

c Have the copies notarized by a foreign notary. However, foreign

notaries are only acceptable as outlined by the Hague Convention.

The Hague Convention provides for the simplified certification of

public (including notarized) documents to be used in countries that

have joined the Convention. A certification will be issued in the form

of an "apostille," which will be attached to the copy of the

document.

Note. The apostille must stay attached to the copy of the document

when it is sent to the IRS.

Actually i have read the W-7 and btw have received the ITIN for my wife using it. And my information came directly from an IRS officer not a call center receptionist because i specifically asked to speak to an Agent I did the homework before replying to a post. But I am no expert on the Hague Treaties nor do i claim to know the specifics of how it is applied to a given situation. I just know personal experience with obtaining an ITIN for my spouse for tax purpose.

Some of you have got lucky. I know what it says and I followed the instructions to the t. There's at least one post in this thread that had their ITIN rejected.

Personally I think this thread is a perfect example of why you should have a professional do your taxes. I used Block even though they came to exactly the same conclusions I had, including the notarization. It's on them if I'm audited.

[rin and john 71]

Edit: Payxibka - HOH is the choice if "unmarried"; single is not.

Payxibka has never said anything to the contrary...

The reason I think they may be able to be included for 2006:

1) Rin was considered a US Resident for tax purposes for 2006;

2) Per Pub 501, page 12: "Child's place of residence: Children usually are citizens or residents of the country of their parents"

3) Presence must be at least six months, unless in cases of certain exceptions such as attending school. This is why Rin's children were allowed in 2007 as they remained in Thailand to finish school before coming to the USA.

Item 2) is what I have a hard time getting a handle on. I'd be interested to hear a tax experts take on it.

That is for maintaining tax residency... not for establishing tax residency in the first place

I have replied elsewhere on VJ, but wanted to reply here, as well. I submitted an amended return (1040X) in March for TY 2006 claiming Rin's children as dependents even though they did not arrive in the USA until 2007. Today I received a letter from the IRS accepting the amended return and stating the additional refund (almost $5,000) will be sent within the next two weeks.

On the amended return explanation section, I indicated that our children resided in Thailand and were there attending school (true statements), thus they met the definition of dependents absent from home. And as I was their "parent/step-parent" they were considered residents of the USA.

John

[AFZ212 0]

HI/ I DONT THINK SO FILE SINGLE WHILE MARRIED ....MY WIFE DID HEAD OF THE HOUSE LAST YEAR AND MY LAWYER TOLD ME TO CHANGE PUT MARRIED FILED SEPARATE...SO DOUBLE CHECK...