SAWASDEE 3 (2009 Thai thread restarted)

[HYENA 4]

thanks for the info. she's no stunner; we're not far of agewise and she needs someone to support her hopefully finding a decent husband. having said that, I don't see a lot of work ethic and a bit too much trailer park attitude....realizing they could be in a different situation but some are poor because of lack of desire. I offered to put some through school. One clepto kid said no (prefers to steal, sell and drink at 11 years old). The others said OK but it turned from school in Isaan to an apartment in BKK and expensive schools in a matter of weeks. #######, can't they jsut take what's offered without one upping it? Likely what the Jones kids do..I could care less. It was a simple offer not to be expanded like that. I just think she's got a jaded perception of a functional relationshiT. Once married, you can lay into your spouse and reduce them to nothing then expect them to be happy the next day. Not my cup of tea. The hard part is the heartbreak. Sure she loves me but long term, I can only take so much when that time of the month rolls around. My last trip I left her...she promised not to do it again but it's happened monthly after every month and I've had it. She doesn't ask for much but every once in a while, I get irritated at the laziness. She helps me with my business but that takes up a couple days a month. No bf at home or anything...no cheating, just jaded perception and a serious aversion to romance and functional loving relationship. I told her if she's coming here, she's going to school (and quell the ignorance that's so prevalent that only education can quash). I'm just finding it more of an egocentric culture more concerned with what everyone else thinks when our culture could care less what anyone thinks as long as #1 is happy. The distance is taking its toll...just don't want to be amidst a mistake. If there were an easy way out, I'd be out. Then she says bring me to the US and we not marry. She simply doesn't understand. I think she's got a good heart but has had too much bad luck in her life not to want to sabotage a good thing--too good to be true in her own eyes likely so she's working on a self fulfilling prophecy. I need someone who's ready for good things to happen and ready to accept a decent man who doesn't drink, beat his wife or ever speak poorly to one you see as a princess regardless of what her culture previously thought. I've been told I'm too nice but #######, what's wrong with being a nice guy? Just tired of getting walked on. I told her if she wants dysfunction, keep on lookin cause it ain't me.

Edited February 12, 2009 by HYENA

[BishopMnA 0]

Hello All,

Well, there is some truths for sure in these posts regarding the culture clashes etc between farang and Thai. Some good personal experiences have been posted.

I thought I'd post a comment from my own experience as well.

For myself and AAm, our experience has been exactly the dream come true that we all imagine it can be...

I guess that sums it all up. It can happen, and it can be as beautiful as you imagine. I wouldn't trade one minute of it, and feel blessed to have gone (and still going) through the experience....lifting of conditions comes up in a few months for us.

Peace...and patience...to all!

God bless!

Mark-N-AAm

[ThaitoUSA 15]

If you go to a noodle cart on the streets of Bangkok, you expect to eat noodles. If you go to Cowboy you can expect...

No big surprises, nor a big deal. It simply is what it is.

My fiancee comes from a modest background as well. Her parents are farmers too, yet she made the choice to go to an all girl's high school in the main town about an hour and a half from her home. She was 13 at that time and made the decision herself. "What did your parents say about that?" I inquired, almost in disbelief that she took it upon herself to seek out the best education she could. She replied "They don't know much about education, so they trusted me to pick the best and entirely supported my decision." In order to pay for her high school and college education, she agreedafter graduating to work for seven years in the public school system. That contract shall end this July. In the meantime she decided to pursue a Master's degree and has established herself as a fair and fun English language tutor, both to kids and adults. Though she has had support from others, she's done all this herself.

Of course I am proud of her, but I mention this to show how one's situation, one's background, does not make the person. She is highly ambitious and that is what allowed her to succeed and that is more of what really defines her. So regardless of one's station in life, I believe one's character is fundamental. I appreciate and enjoy the company of those of high character. To those of more questionable character, I say "Live and let live," but I prefer not to keep company with such folk.

Is this person's character someone you respect, admire, and want to be like? I believe that answer says it all.

For all Thai-Farang couples I recommend www.geoffandamy.com It is a site of, by and for thai-farang couples. I have frequented the forum and it was there that I learned about VJ from a fellow member.

Edited February 12, 2009 by ThaitoUSA

[daboyz 36]

Not really relevant to the current conversation, but this post cracks me up for some reason:

"A warning. I had a regular tgf last year who like all of them was resisting my kiss goodby to her when i wanted to end our relationship. to cut a long story short she ended up putting a beer bottle through a tv screen and we where off to the monkey house(cop shop if you dont know). After talking with the room owner and police captain about paying the cost of tv, the nice little girl said to the cop,"he have picture of me, I want memory card from his camers". I am sure the cops eyes lit' up. well it ended up me being threatened with a court case accused of have indecent pictures in my possetion, or paying a "fine" of 80.000bt. I had to give the police my passport, ended up missing my flight and staying another month. Did you guys know, if the police make you stay over your visa time they will still fine you the overstay fine for every day.

So if you and g/f are happy, snap away, just dont fall out and end up in the monkey house like I did. "

[afisher 0]

If you go to a noodle cart on the streets of Bangkok, you expect to eat noodles. If you go to Cowboy you can expect...

No big surprises, nor a big deal. It simply is what it is.

My fiancee comes from a modest background as well. Her parents are farmers too, yet she made the choice to go to an all girl's high school in the main town about an hour and a half from her home. She was 13 at that time and made the decision herself. "What did your parents say about that?" I inquired, almost in disbelief that she took it upon herself to seek out the best education she could. She replied "They don't know much about education, so they trusted me to pick the best and entirely supported my decision." In order to pay for her high school and college education, she agreedafter graduating to work for seven years in the public school system. That contract shall end this July. In the meantime she decided to pursue a Master's degree and has established herself as a fair and fun English language tutor, both to kids and adults. Though she has had support from others, she's done all this herself.

Of course I am proud of her, but I mention this to show how one's situation, one's background, does not make the person. She is highly ambitious and that is what allowed her to succeed and that is more of what really defines her. So regardless of one's station in life, I believe one's character is fundamental. I appreciate and enjoy the company of those of high character. To those of more questionable character, I say "Live and let live," but I prefer not to keep company with such folk.

Is this person's character someone you respect, admire, and want to be like? I believe that answer says it all.

For all Thai-Farang couples I recommend www.geoffandamy.com It is a site of, by and for thai-farang couples. I have frequented the forum and it was there that I learned about VJ from a fellow member.

I agree, it's not about the background, it's the character of the person, something that is in them.

My girl comes from a poor background, parents are rice farmers in Isarn. She has watched as girls from her village went and worked the bars, gotten gold and rich old men, but she chose to go to college. She almost has a bachelor degree now.

When I met her I was fighting muay Thai in the stadiums in the South. I was broke, the only money I had was what I made from fighting. (which isn't much, 5000-7000 baht per fight) I was basically living like a Thai. She knew this and still chose to be with me. We lived in a hut and slept on the floor. She got a job that paid 3500 baht a month, and we lived off of my prize money and her wages for a year. We ate a lot of MaMa!

One time she went back to Isarn to see her mom and wanted to give her mom some money. So she took an extra 2000 baht. When she came back home, she gave me the 2000 baht back. I asked if she forgot to give it, she said that when she gave the baht to her mom her mom gave it back to her because we needed it more than she did.

How's that for character!

[ThaitoUSA 15]

If you go to a noodle cart on the streets of Bangkok, you expect to eat noodles. If you go to Cowboy you can expect...

No big surprises, nor a big deal. It simply is what it is.

My fiancee comes from a modest background as well. Her parents are farmers too, yet she made the choice to go to an all girl's high school in the main town about an hour and a half from her home. She was 13 at that time and made the decision herself. "What did your parents say about that?" I inquired, almost in disbelief that she took it upon herself to seeek out the best education she could. She replied "They don't know much about education, so they trusted me to pick the best and supported me entirely." In order to pay for her high school and college education, she agreedafter graduating to work for seven years in the public school system. That contract shall end this July. In the meantime she decided to pursue a Master's degree and has established herself as a fair and fun English language tutor, both to kids and adults. Though she has had support from others, she's done all this herself.

Of course I am proud of her, but I mention this to show how one's situation, one's background, does not make the person. She is highly ambitious and that is what allowed her to succeed and that is more of what really defines her. So regardless of one's station in life, I believe one's character is fundamental. I appreciate and enjoy the company of those of high character. To those of more questionable character, I say "Live and let live," but I prefer not to keep company with such folk.

Is this person's character someone you respect, admire, and want to be like? I believe that answer says it all.

[HYENA 4]

I really appreciate all the comments, experiences and advice here. It's completely different than other forums where the nasty, unhelpful comments would be the majority...

OK...Yes, I own ThaiFever and it's a good read-learned a lot; heard all the bar/non bar stories, etc. I have asked many other Thais some questions and I conclude she is jaded more than most due to her childhood, etc (without getting too psychological here) but she's got issues which is OK but addressing them is impossible as it may disrespect parents, etc.

I also really appreciate the post about the self determination/motivation of an individual, etc. I also believe you can do what you want if you want. I put myself through college; ran away from home at 17, finished hs never looked back. I also admit to being a sucker for sweet talk, poverty and sadness.

In the end, my happiness is paramount so I need to prevail against my softheartedness, etc. Too many times have I heard her say horrible, disrespectful things to me (and I don't demand hardly any)...but I'm used to building up my mate and helping them achieve their highest desired potential not tearing them down even below the belt for kicks. She claimed I never listened to her, so for the first time i told her the time and day she said xxx (some comments were downright horrible)...she acted surprised, claimed I misunderstood but I asked how word z and word s come in the same sentence and how can it be misunderstood? She claimed she never said such things, etc. Tired of all that face saving BS, I told her I could no longer continue such a dysfunctional relationship since she values me as zero by her treatment and expects support in return...for what? She claims Thais aren't romantic, etc but I can recall the day and date she abruptly stopped the I love you's and I miss you's, etc. and why. It existed but I believe it died just as quickly. I told her 6 months ago to start emailing me for visa since she'd stopped but no such motivation. After seeing a lack of email denial here, I told her basically her lack of willingness to write a few lines a week may have blown it but lucky for me because if it was in her heart, she'd have done so and continued to do so, so the system works even if people can't see themselves there's not reciprocated affection and they've been carrying the relationship on a dream and a hope.

Her standards are lower than mine when it comes to a spouse but at the same time expectations would come out not common with typical Thai culture and I'd hear it for that, also...so I truly believe she was sabotaging it or trying to evoke a response...even asking me to light up into her a few times when she felt she made a mistake (and the one's I can think of were unwarranted-company mistakes she had nothing to do with) but she wanted me to go on a tirade against her which just isn't my style (same stuff can be said two ways)...so she'd get angry since I didn't berate her...some strange game she's played tomeet her self image...bottom line I told her I believe she's used to a certain amount of harsh temper and harsh treatment between spouses, likely role models for her and she's uncomfortable with a guy who is affectionate and I asked if her parents ever told her they loved her (the answer was no, she knew she was hated) bingo...but she recoiled into Thai parental respect and the topic was dead soon as it began.

She'd say she feels sick seeing couples googly eyed at each other in love, etc and it makes her angry but I couldn't get beyond that to help her so it's a dead horse at that point. She likely thinks also I'm so boring I just plain love her, call her his Isaan princess, etc when she feels ugly, uneducated, low, etc. I was willing to change all that (education, have her fun the business) but her self esteem, I believe felt it didn't deserve a good, boring thing overflowing with affection she likely felt was completely undeserved.

She pushed and pushed me so hard for 2 hours even after my warning her it's over if she continues and she pushed it. I stopped taking her calls till today and she acted surprised when I wasn't perfectly happy (the norm after she does this). I finally recited all the things she's said to me yesterday and all year. She acted completely shocked, denied it but after some really low blows she knew were inexcusable, she said (first her normal "OK I bad wife OK maybe you leave me forever" almost like a dare) after I spoke more and she knew this time was different, she said "better we finish then, better you not come Thailand OK" and I said, "Yes, I think that's best..." "I tried to ignore it or pretend it was an accident but I can't have this in a marriage; it's not what I want and I won't be happy having wife not nice to me a lot." Of course she's horribly sad, devastated, etc like every other time but she's done this and we broke up for a couple days (over her anger) but this is different. Her mom even talked to her and told her you don't treat a good husband or any husband by chewing them out top of your lungs all their faults on a monthly basis just because (her mom has told her to knock it off many times) but this time no end of week call and how can we work this out. I'm tired of the pattern. She's a sweetheart who loves me on some level but I can't have this in my life or around my kids.

So My worry is this visa. I have to wait 5 years to reapply with another even if I cancel it? She likely thinks I'll take her back but I told her I've been far to stupid dragging it on this long and should have quit the first out of the blue hatred rage attack (I asked her if she wanted a ribeye or a tbone steak not knowing she didn't know the difference rather than communicating quietly, she flew into a rage in the cab, all the way home, all evening and the next day, still in silence I packed my bags and left her). I told her to COMMUNICATE but saving face I guess put her in the position? I have no clue and I don't care but ending any romantic dinner by screaming in a cab isn't for me (she could have whispered since it was only us 2, geez). OK...back to visa...I'll wait a few days, then cancel it. Previous break ups she's asked to come anyway (love marriage or not..obviously not understanding a k-1) which tells me it's the ticket, benefits and prestige, escape, not me she wants. I'm not spending my hard earned money to keep up with the jonses or to feed any ego's. I hate ego's which is what I "thought" a Buddhist country had little of.

So it's future visa preservation time and closing this one out time for me having learned a good midlife crisis lesson. Best of luck to you all..I'll keep looking but after reading, I'm not so sure Thais are the best given all parts equal relationship marriage wise (nearby cultures don't do the sin sod and don't feed ego's for the most part from what I've read which is a relief)!

[daboyz 36]

I really appreciate all the comments, experiences and advice here. It's completely different than other forums where the nasty, unhelpful comments would be the majority...

OK...Yes, I own ThaiFever and it's a good read-learned a lot; heard all the bar/non bar stories, etc. I have asked many other Thais some questions and I conclude she is jaded more than most due to her childhood, etc (without getting too psychological here) but she's got issues which is OK but addressing them is impossible as it may disrespect parents, etc.

I also really appreciate the post about the self determination/motivation of an individual, etc. I also believe you can do what you want if you want. I put myself through college; ran away from home at 17, finished hs never looked back. I also admit to being a sucker for sweet talk, poverty and sadness.

In the end, my happiness is paramount so I need to prevail against my softheartedness, etc. Too many times have I heard her say horrible, disrespectful things to me (and I don't demand hardly any)...but I'm used to building up my mate and helping them achieve their highest desired potential not tearing them down even below the belt for kicks. She claimed I never listened to her, so for the first time i told her the time and day she said xxx (some comments were downright horrible)...she acted surprised, claimed I misunderstood but I asked how word z and word s come in the same sentence and how can it be misunderstood? She claimed she never said such things, etc. Tired of all that face saving BS, I told her I could no longer continue such a dysfunctional relationship since she values me as zero by her treatment and expects support in return...for what? She claims Thais aren't romantic, etc but I can recall the day and date she abruptly stopped the I love you's and I miss you's, etc. and why. It existed but I believe it died just as quickly. I told her 6 months ago to start emailing me for visa since she'd stopped but no such motivation. After seeing a lack of email denial here, I told her basically her lack of willingness to write a few lines a week may have blown it but lucky for me because if it was in her heart, she'd have done so and continued to do so, so the system works even if people can't see themselves there's not reciprocated affection and they've been carrying the relationship on a dream and a hope.

Her standards are lower than mine when it comes to a spouse but at the same time expectations would come out not common with typical Thai culture and I'd hear it for that, also...so I truly believe she was sabotaging it or trying to evoke a response...even asking me to light up into her a few times when she felt she made a mistake (and the one's I can think of were unwarranted-company mistakes she had nothing to do with) but she wanted me to go on a tirade against her which just isn't my style (same stuff can be said two ways)...so she'd get angry since I didn't berate her...some strange game she's played tomeet her self image...bottom line I told her I believe she's used to a certain amount of harsh temper and harsh treatment between spouses, likely role models for her and she's uncomfortable with a guy who is affectionate and I asked if her parents ever told her they loved her (the answer was no, she knew she was hated) bingo...but she recoiled into Thai parental respect and the topic was dead soon as it began.

She'd say she feels sick seeing couples googly eyed at each other in love, etc and it makes her angry but I couldn't get beyond that to help her so it's a dead horse at that point. She likely thinks also I'm so boring I just plain love her, call her his Isaan princess, etc when she feels ugly, uneducated, low, etc. I was willing to change all that (education, have her fun the business) but her self esteem, I believe felt it didn't deserve a good, boring thing overflowing with affection she likely felt was completely undeserved.

She pushed and pushed me so hard for 2 hours even after my warning her it's over if she continues and she pushed it. I stopped taking her calls till today and she acted surprised when I wasn't perfectly happy (the norm after she does this). I finally recited all the things she's said to me yesterday and all year. She acted completely shocked, denied it but after some really low blows she knew were inexcusable, she said (first her normal "OK I bad wife OK maybe you leave me forever" almost like a dare) after I spoke more and she knew this time was different, she said "better we finish then, better you not come Thailand OK" and I said, "Yes, I think that's best..." "I tried to ignore it or pretend it was an accident but I can't have this in a marriage; it's not what I want and I won't be happy having wife not nice to me a lot." Of course she's horribly sad, devastated, etc like every other time but she's done this and we broke up for a couple days (over her anger) but this is different. Her mom even talked to her and told her you don't treat a good husband or any husband by chewing them out top of your lungs all their faults on a monthly basis just because (her mom has told her to knock it off many times) but this time no end of week call and how can we work this out. I'm tired of the pattern. She's a sweetheart who loves me on some level but I can't have this in my life or around my kids.

So My worry is this visa. I have to wait 5 years to reapply with another even if I cancel it? She likely thinks I'll take her back but I told her I've been far to stupid dragging it on this long and should have quit the first out of the blue hatred rage attack (I asked her if she wanted a ribeye or a tbone steak not knowing she didn't know the difference rather than communicating quietly, she flew into a rage in the cab, all the way home, all evening and the next day, still in silence I packed my bags and left her). I told her to COMMUNICATE but saving face I guess put her in the position? I have no clue and I don't care but ending any romantic dinner by screaming in a cab isn't for me (she could have whispered since it was only us 2, geez). OK...back to visa...I'll wait a few days, then cancel it. Previous break ups she's asked to come anyway (love marriage or not..obviously not understanding a k-1) which tells me it's the ticket, benefits and prestige, escape, not me she wants. I'm not spending my hard earned money to keep up with the jonses or to feed any ego's. I hate ego's which is what I "thought" a Buddhist country had little of.

So it's future visa preservation time and closing this one out time for me having learned a good midlife crisis lesson. Best of luck to you all..I'll keep looking but after reading, I'm not so sure Thais are the best given all parts equal relationship marriage wise (nearby cultures don't do the sin sod and don't feed ego's for the most part from what I've read which is a relief)!

Why would you have to wait 5 years to file for another visa?

[birch- phuk_beer 0]

Why would you have to wait 5 years to file for another visa?

You dont have to wait at all. Especially, there is no down side if she never got to the US.

I'm on my second in 6 years and filed within that 5 year range. And, the first one is still here int he US...(legally)

Youre fine in that are HYENA......

[scandal 951]

Hello All,

Well, there is some truths for sure in these posts regarding the culture clashes etc between farang and Thai. Some good personal experiences have been posted.

I thought I'd post a comment from my own experience as well.

For myself and AAm, our experience has been exactly the dream come true that we all imagine it can be...

I guess that sums it all up. It can happen, and it can be as beautiful as you imagine. I wouldn't trade one minute of it, and feel blessed to have gone (and still going) through the experience....lifting of conditions comes up in a few months for us.

Peace...and patience...to all!

God bless!

Mark-N-AAm

OK, I wanted to jump back into this discussion too. It's really interesting to hear about all the Thai/Farang couples here.

Hyena - seems like you're really going through a rough time. But since it's not working out I think you're much better off ending it now, rather than waiting till she would come to the US and you guys got married and then have it fall apart. I'm sure it hurts now, but it's probably for the best. Good luck, however things turn out!

Mark-n-Aam - thanks for sharing. It's great to hear of the happily-ever-after stories! We're so used to hearing about stereotypical Thai/farang couples where he's a lazy drunk and she's a golddigger, and it's doomed from the start. Great to hear of just a normal, happy couple that's got it together and is obviously very much in love. Congrats! I honestly feel that my relationship with my fiancee is going to work out that way. I hope to be able to post a message similar to yours in a few years once she's here and we're establishing our joint lives together.

That's kind of what I was trying to get at in my earlier comments about the Thai/Farang divide not being as important as the basic man/woman divide. Or for that matter, person-person divide. Everybody's different, everybody has to figure out what works for them. Add a relationship, now you need to take into account somebody else. That's always hard. I'm not minimizing the difficulties of the vastly different culture and society that is Thailand, as compared to US and western countries. Sure that adds an extra element of stuff to be worked on. I'm just saying, EVERY relationship needs that kind of work, to greater or lesser extent.

One thing I'm enjoying in this discussion is that while it's mostly us Farang guys talking about our relationships with our Thai girls, we have some female voices in our midst as well. We've got "Thai mom", an American mother to a US born son + Thai daughter in law. We've got Noi, an American woman with a Thai husband. And "Mommy", a Thai woman with farang husband. It's great to have the mix of opinions everybody brings here.

[eric_f 0]

Wow this took off like a rocket. I just wanted to pop in and say that my case is still in AP @ the embassy. No word as of yet. It's quite frustrating.

As for the relationship issues, I've been lucky I guess. I've heard a number of horror stories about a select few Thai women and their hulk rage, much like my fiancee's sister has. It's had its share of ups and downs and now is a very trying time as we have planned on spending our lives together but it all teeters on the verdict of this AP. I am no stranger to stress being in the Marines and even this has me pulling my hair out. Some days I feel like it would be better if I didn't talk to her because I'm just so wound up tight about the whole situation I'd lose it.

I know it's worth the wait because she is the only girl I've been with who didn't try to change something about who I was, which is my number one put-off. I really enjoy the lack of 'mind games' with her. She doesn't hold grudges, but has an uncanny ability to tease about my goof-ups at the most 'convenient' times to put me in check. "OK, you remember that time you ....." oops! After, we have a good laugh It makes me smile just thinking about it.

Edited February 13, 2009 by eric_f

[HYENA 4]

Ughh I hate this part..looking forward to 4 months down the road. I'll let myself cool off before canceling it. I feel horribly sad for her. She's devastated but then again she's been actively pushing me away like there's no tomorrow so subconsciously she's not ready for good things to happen, either. Interesting, she's been through this with a Scottish guy, as well. She told me they broke up often and now knowing her, I guarantee she lit into him like there's no tomorrow digging up any inconvenient dirt to make it sting more...every month like clockwork. I can be quite sympathetic and If I keep myself aware, do something special to make the time go and it usually pays off a few days later...but it's no excuse to rip apart the one you love when you should be building each other up with encouraging words, etc.

Thanks for the comments also.. I thought I had to wait 5 years from application time or 10 years or something but if she doesn't come i assume it doesn't count, then from what I gather (doubt Siam legal could have figured all this out so quickly)...they've cost me 6 weeks delay total gold whoopdedoo hang up on your fiancee 6 or 7 times package (I'll have to check my notes for the number when I write it all up). I get the feeling each case is like they've never done one when some of you could do one flawlessly the first time around...I'm just surprised to hear all the mistakes they still make having been at this so long but you've got a different work ethic and strong attitudes of this is how it's done regardless of what USCIS updated rules say and you're not to ask questions, just pay and quiet please.. (for example their guide said B&W pics OK but USCIS says color only and they're just learning this now but not before I get an RFE for it?...not to mention translation errors that should never happen once, etc. But you're only as good as your local help and that's who's running the show there when you could do it free with a shot of confidence here (my gf really was sweet and unassuming on the phone and a kind soul mostly but I'm reviewing more and discovering more the more i open my eyes. I'm coming to the realization although there is true love, it's a jaded, dysfunctional sort not meant to be and any farang could fill in the blank spot to fit the bill so not much effort goes into the relationship from her end.....but I guess it's all for the better...or maybe she would have turned up the heat earlier the sooner it came...I think likely.

It's sad, horrible, devastating, shocking but we've broken up 6 times. Her ex likely 5 times that amount but reviewing their relationship and my actually emailing him helped me realize she just wants a ticket more than she wants to work on a relationship and work on herself...cart before the horse. Next round I'm not seeking a culture where you have to pay any amount just to marry (pay for what, really...other than ego feeding...showing people you can take care, showing people how weatlthy you are or the worth of the woman, etc). Tired of the materialistic subculture so I need to review posts I lost who recommended nearby countries that don't do the sin sod, therefore don't have the prime focus on money at least to this degree. Someone wrote on a Thai board they couldn't find one suspected scamster from India but more than 50% of the Thai fiancee/gf/wife posts had to do with being taken for money mixed right up there with the rewarding relationships gone good.

Beauty-India, Motivation...I think China has it? Laos...Buddhist culture (versus lack of true Buddhism Thais have... I see exchanged for self serving...keep up with the Jones's, wear your gold to rub their noses in it; you have arrived...pressure to build a house "like all farang make for wife family", etc...) I'll be happy to be done with living everyone else's expectations and be able to focus on wife and me not village opinion, show off to someone who passed by and said "why you not have big house yet...you still poor, why you not wear gold, what, farang she find too poor" etc.. That jealousy/self serving face saving/feeding subculture nauseates me to no end. This will be a welcome change to get away from that nasty undercurrent but I'll miss the food with my next try somewhere some day in Asia....I just can't remember where I found the general comparisons to cultures, pros and cons....(individuals excluded, just generalizations) since many rural areas I can still find some stuff to sell to shoppes here.

[AaronLV 12]

First off, I am sorry about your problems.

However, I think the problems with your Fiancee being hung up on at Siam Legal are fabricated. My Fiancee is from Issan and I asked her what problems she had with Siam when she talked to them, and she said there was none. She said they were polite and the nicest people, with any of the questions she asked. I think your fiancee is playing the "I am from Issan. so I am dirt" card to you. I sat with Nina (Paralegal) for close to 4 hours at the bus stop outside the embassy, she was so nice, and then sat with the attorney for over 3 hours outside on the second time I was waiting, and they were supportive and helpful. I don't think it was the attorney's I really think it is your Fiancee with a chip on her shoulder cause she is from Issan. My fiancee's mother is from Issan aslo and she has several successful businesses.

Just my 2 cents, please don't bash the law firm for your Fiancees short comings.

[HYENA 4]

First off, I am sorry about your problems.

However, I think the problems with your Fiancee being hung up on at Siam Legal are fabricated. My Fiancee is from Issan and I asked her what problems she had with Siam when she talked to them, and she said there was none. She said they were polite and the nicest people, with any of the questions she asked. I think your fiancee is playing the "I am from Issan. so I am dirt" card to you. I sat with Nina (Paralegal) for close to 4 hours at the bus stop outside the embassy, she was so nice, and then sat with the attorney for over 3 hours outside on the second time I was waiting, and they were supportive and helpful. I don't think it was the attorney's I really think it is your Fiancee with a chip on her shoulder cause she is from Issan. My fiancee's mother is from Issan aslo and she has several successful businesses.

Just my 2 cents, please don't bash the law firm for your Fiancees short comings.

Thanks for your message. Not completely fabricated since some is factual and the refusal to answer/glare I did witness. i guess it was the hanging up (twice when I was there I asked her to call, then i called back since she was standing there telling me they hung up twice)...not sure who did that...then sitting at the table she said "I'm from Roi Et, what part of Isaan are you from" and a cold stare back. Now there could be other things going on I don't know about...and it could very well all be her (since they focus on facial expressions, etc) she does have the race card going on a bit but I've seen it in action against her unprovoked and I have no idea why so if I were her, I'd be irritated by the mal treatment, as well (in the sky train a lady told her she wasn't allowed to sit down) little things like that I'd never see here I'd seen done to her so maybe I had been sensitive to it.

I'll just keep it to the facts since the rest is opinion but not provable. ..I did get the run around when asking one question I thought would be easy to answer, though. That's what surprised me about the lack of knowledge (when she can get her eligibility to marry certificate and if they know if it expires). Never did get an answer so I had her go do that not knowing. It is a fact they still don't know how long the single certificate is good for (3 months is the answer) and how early you're allowed to get it (still unknown) and the B&W pics in their guide vs USCIS rules and the 3 week translation error they made, so paying for the "gold package" I would have expected far different and expected more willingness to help when I've spoken to (only some) of the staff. Some don't want to help, others are gems. Granted this is all early in the process and I hadn't experienced the full package and I've only dealt with 4 staff. The guy is great and one of the ladies is excellent but one wants to get you off the phone asap.

Edited February 13, 2009 by HYENA

[Mountain Climber 186]

First off, I am sorry about your problems.

However, I think the problems with your Fiancee being hung up on at Siam Legal are fabricated. My Fiancee is from Issan and I asked her what problems she had with Siam when she talked to them, and she said there was none. She said they were polite and the nicest people, with any of the questions she asked. I think your fiancee is playing the "I am from Issan. so I am dirt" card to you. I sat with Nina (Paralegal) for close to 4 hours at the bus stop outside the embassy, she was so nice, and then sat with the attorney for over 3 hours outside on the second time I was waiting, and they were supportive and helpful. I don't think it was the attorney's I really think it is your Fiancee with a chip on her shoulder cause she is from Issan. My fiancee's mother is from Issan aslo and she has several successful businesses.

Just my 2 cents, please don't bash the law firm for your Fiancees short comings.

Thanks for your message. Not completely fabricated since some is factual and the refusal to answer/glare I did witness. i guess it was the hanging up (twice when I was there I asked her to call, then i called back since she was standing there telling me they hung up twice)...not sure who did that...then sitting at the table she said "I'm from Roi Et, what part of Isaan are you from" and a cold stare back. Now there could be other things going on I don't know about...and it could very well all be her (since they focus on facial expressions, etc) she does have the race card going on a bit but I've seen it in action against her unprovoked and I have no idea why so if I were her, I'd be irritated by the mal treatment, as well (in the sky train a lady told her she wasn't allowed to sit down) little things like that I'd never see here I'd seen done to her so maybe I had been sensitive to it.

I'll just keep it to the facts since the rest is opinion but not provable. ..I did get the run around when asking one question I thought would be easy to answer, though. That's what surprised me about the lack of knowledge (when she can get her eligibility to marry certificate and if they know if it expires). Never did get an answer so I had her go do that not knowing. It is a fact they still don't know how long the single certificate is good for (3 months is the answer) and how early you're allowed to get it (still unknown) and the B&W pics in their guide vs USCIS rules and the 3 week translation error they made, so paying for the "gold package" I would have expected far different and expected more willingness to help when I've spoken to (only some) of the staff. Some don't want to help, others are gems. Granted this is all early in the process and I hadn't experienced the full package and I've only dealt with 4 staff. The guy is great and one of the ladies is excellent but one wants to get you off the phone asap.

I am really sorry to hear about your problem. As we all know, all of us bring baggage from our past into our relationships. If BOTH partners really, truly want the relationship to work, they will make the necessary changes within themselves to accomplish this goal. It is not easy to face our inner demons but it is necessary if we want to live a happy life with our significant others. It sounds like she is not ready, able or willing to do this necessary work. Hope everything works out for you and whatever you decide to do. Good luck!

Edited February 14, 2009 by Mountain Climber