American President: Jackson Signs Indian Removal Act -- May 28, 1830

[one...two...tree 2,762]

[Peikko 1,575]

How can your living standards be improved if you have no rights? I guess rights are relative.

Regardless BY, are you suggesting that we can only discuss things that pertain to today, because of the financial crisis? That a president who is right on one thing can be horribly wrong on another but the being wrong, if it pertains to human rights issues is unimportant if the being right pertains to telling the financial instutions to #### off? More and more bizarre...

Dwelling on the past is moronic. It would be like me saying England should pay considering they are the one country who displaced and killed a hell of a lot of indigenous communities around the world. Out of curiosity, how many people abroad dwell on this sort of ####### as much as liberal Americans like Steven do?

Now, if we are going to talk about rights lets discuss the present where someone's safety and security is clearly less important that an individuals personal right. How many murderers and criminals are walking free because their right to freedom is obviously more important than that of the victim. How many children are abused, raped, tortured, neglected etc because the parents rights are more important than the security and safety of this helpless child. Is this something you would call progression?

Welcome to the world of Communism (as practiced as apposed to theoretical) my friend. That is my idea of hell, to subjugate the needs of the individual to the needs of the state and I am quite sure that it is not something that is going to be introduced in the US anytime soon. I think you really do need to take a few lessons in political science mate.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Madame Cleo

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Dwelling on the past is moronic.

If you define history as dwelling on the past, then you've got some serious issues. At what point do we stop dwelling on WWII, 9/11, or the Holocaust? May history continue to give us lessons over and over and may history never be forgot.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Mister Fancypants

[alienlovechild 75]

My great great (I'm not sure how many greats) was believed to have been Cherokee...who were forced under Jackson to move westward on a journey that became known as the Trail of Tears.

Poetic justice here as you've started so many Threads of Tears. This one may be one of your most irrelevant, Chief Writing Bull.

[Heracles 417]

One should give pause to the injustice that was committed to the indigenous people, even if there can be no going back and changing things now. Lessons of history and all that malarkey. The changes rendered on the wilderness due to a Western culture that could not comprehend that change might ultimately prove disadvantageous are also worth time and consideration.

Ah okay. Yeah, unfortunately I prefer to tackle today's issues affecting people actually alive in 2009 rather than ponder about the past. Like how the hell the 40,000,000+ Americans living in poverty are going to get ahead and improve their standard of living. Or how we can tackle the murder rate. Hey, that is just me though. So lets go back to discussing Jackson and how bad and stupid colonial Americans were.

[Peikko 1,575]

One should give pause to the injustice that was committed ...

Ok.

<pause>

Done.

See, that wasn't too hard now was it?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

No but now I'd like to move on. I like where Aficionado is going with this!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

My great great (I'm not sure how many greats) was believed to have been Cherokee...who were forced under Jackson to move westward on a journey that became known as the Trail of Tears.

Poetic justice here as you've started so many Threads of Tears. This one may be one of your most irrelevant, Chief Writing Bull.

Yes, the history of Native Americans is irrelevant. Let's stick with history that we choose to remember.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

How can your living standards be improved if you have no rights? I guess rights are relative.

Regardless BY, are you suggesting that we can only discuss things that pertain to today, because of the financial crisis? That a president who is right on one thing can be horribly wrong on another but the being wrong, if it pertains to human rights issues is unimportant if the being right pertains to telling the financial instutions to #### off? More and more bizarre...

Dwelling on the past is moronic. It would be like me saying England should pay considering they are the one country who displaced and killed a hell of a lot of indigenous communities around the world. Out of curiosity, how many people abroad dwell on this sort of ####### as much as liberal Americans like Steven do?

Now, if we are going to talk about rights lets discuss the present where someone's safety and security is clearly less important that an individuals personal right. How many murderers and criminals are walking free because their right to freedom is obviously more important than that of the victim. How many children are abused, raped, tortured, neglected etc because the parents rights are more important than the security and safety of this helpless child. Is this something you would call progression?

This thread doesn't amount to "dwelling" IMO. If we were "dwelling" on the subject - it would be all that we were talking about. As it obviously isn't, clearly noone is "dwelling" on the subject.

So the only point that remains is whether or not the study of history is pointless - you seem to think it is, and that is quite frankly - a bizarre view.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Paul Daniels

[Peikko 1,575]

One should give pause to the injustice that was committed to the indigenous people, even if there can be no going back and changing things now. Lessons of history and all that malarkey. The changes rendered on the wilderness due to a Western culture that could not comprehend that change might ultimately prove disadvantageous are also worth time and consideration.

Ah okay. Yeah, unfortunately I prefer to tackle today's issues affecting people actually alive in 2009 rather than ponder about the past. Like how the hell the 40,000,000+ Americans living in poverty are going to get ahead and improve their standard of living. Or how we can tackle the murder rate. Hey, that is just me though. So lets go back to discussing Jackson and how bad and stupid colonial Americans were.

It's not a question of 'either or'. Individuals have quite enough time to do both and, perhaps, learn from the past, as bizarre as that might sound. As for the idea that there is a requirement for you to 'tackle' today's issues, laughing, I am .

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

No but now I'd like to move on. I like where Aficionado is going with this!

His point seems to be that because he objects to threads discussing American History that we should change the subject to something he does want to talk about.

Why he can't just start another thread - or only participate in the ones that deal with subjects he actually wants to discuss is anyone's guess. The idea that people shouldn't talk about things that he doesn't like is pretty odd.

[Peikko 1,575]

No but now I'd like to move on. I like where Aficionado is going with this!

Apologies, I defer. Let the thread go whichever way A.J desires.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

No but now I'd like to move on. I like where Aficionado is going with this!

His point seems to be that because he objects to threads discussing American History that we should change the subject to something he does want to talk about.

Why he can't just start another thread - or only participate in the ones that deal with subjects he actually wants to discuss is anyone's guess. The idea that people shouldn't talk about things that he doesn't like is pretty odd.

He's reacting uncomfortably with this part of history. There are a few here who like to relish on some historic events while telling others to stop dwelling over less convenient historic events. History as a whole is either relevant or it's not. I don't get this cafeteria attitude towards history.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

The idea that people shouldn't talk about things that he doesn't like is pretty odd.

I hereby declare Aficionado the official agenda setter of OT.

[Peikko 1,575]

The idea that people shouldn't talk about things that he doesn't like is pretty odd.

I hereby declare Aficionado the official agenda setter of OT.

And why not? Hurray, three cheers!