For those who've had returned K1 petitions

[catknit 144]

Ok - as some of you may have seen on the AP Tracker thread - my K1 petition is being returned.

While I'm hoping that my congressman and senators may pull some political magic and have the case reopened but until I get word of how that is going I've been interviewing attorneys. Today I was posed an interesting strategy.

First - a little about our case: We had red flags the size of Texas - only 1 visit, recently divorced, and I couldn't attend the interview under threat of losing my job and trying to be the responsible one I figured with the economy I'd chance it. Bad choice - especially for New Delhi!

The proposed strategy:

Have the case return to USCIS [in my case VSC]. Follow up with any requests they have over time.

Go back to India for another trip - get tons of pics and documentation [Estimated date 3-09].

After returning from the trip refile a new K1 including in the cover letter information about the 1st petition, the 1st interview, plans made had the visa been approved, all new information from the 2nd trip, and all correspondence/emails/chats/telephone records available for the duration of the relationship.

Now here's the thought - if USCIS approves the second petition it is proving that the original relationship was true and that there is still an ongoing relationship. This attorney's thought is this is a loophole around waiting for the 1st petition to be re-adjudicated. Additionally, it will carry more wait at the interview because it will be reaffirming the 1st petition that the Consular recommended to be denied...

This attorney was anti-DCF in my case - he felt that moving to India may reek of desperation and that if the Consular officer is feeling that I've been "duped" into a fraudulent relationship, dropping everything and moving overseas would add to their fire.

So, to the experienced and the arm chair attorneys...does this strategy hold water?

[emt103c 10]

I think your attorney is avoiding the real fight at hand. This is not really an option, because, if you've read the articles I've posted here several times, if one petition gets denied and you don't fight to affirm it your second will be denied in the USCIS stage, you won't even get to the consulate.

Your real choices are: Fight for the original petition and get it approved, it has only been sent back, not revoked yet. . .this involves Senate/House liaisons and a non-"loophole" attorney. . . or your own fight.

The service center may just let the petition expire, instead of revoking it. . .then you could take a second choice, which is going ahead with your trip, getting proof of the expiration (proof of non-revocation) and getting married in India and filing as a spousal. . .

You always have your other option of moving to India, though if that is not something you are EXTRAORDINARILY keen on, I wouldn't try it. . .if you're happy to do it, then so be it.

I think your attorney is trying to find a "creative" solution to a straight-forward problem. He/she is avoiding the normal procedures. . .it just doesn't make sense.

Edited January 17, 2009 by emt103c

[catknit 144]

Thanks for the feedback - I'm just interviewing/consulting attorneys right now so that's why I wanted to get some feed back on a couple of the strategies being proposed. I have read thru the great list of resources you've provided emt103c!

Maybe I just don't have a strong grasp of the complete issue at hand, but I followed his logic with this...that if the 2nd petition is approved, we've just reaffirm the 1st petition - is a weird backward method. And, I followed that the timing would be better considering it appears that VSC isn't into letting petitions just expire. I specifically asked about having 2 "live" petition and the possible fraud/misrepresentation issues. This attorney said there is nothing fraudulant about having two petitions open at the same time specifically if it is plainly outlined in the correspondence with USCIS.

I am working diligently with my senators/congressman. Currently, we are working on getting the specific reasons [if they will give them] about the denial as well as trying to convince the consulate to allow a joint interview.

It seems the common thread I've heard from many of the people who I've had consults with is, to be blunt, the Consulate thinks I'm being duped or I'm in cahoots for a marriage of convenience - even the congressional liasons brought it up. I've also been told by each person [including the congressional people again] that pleading on the basis of love will get us nowhere. So, I've requested via phone and email to the consulate that the case be re-opened. All three congressional offices are asking for the same thing as well as requesting joint interview the 2nd week of March. Is there more I should be doing?

But I feel like my hands are tied until I get word back from the liasons...that's why I'm talking to the attoneys. It seems like everyone has a different take on what to do!

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Edited January 17, 2009 by milo75

[sara..... 371]

i dont have any advise but i hate this happened to u guys

sara

[anitacastillo 0]

Glad you are being pro-active.

However, I'm not sure if hiring an attorney is the best use of your $$. IMO, there are equally/more knowledgable people here on VJ (I think you have already gotten some bad advice about having 2 petitions of the same type open). Especially those with specific India experience. Someone said, an attorney will never care as much about your case as you. You will respond to every request quickly, while you are "just a case" in an office.

I think it has already been mentioned - there is a sticky in the MENA forum for returned petitions.

Good Luck!!

[rebeccajo 14]

Glad you are being pro-active.

However, I'm not sure if hiring an attorney is the best use of your $$. IMO, there are equally/more knowledgable people here on VJ (I think you have already gotten some bad advice about having 2 petitions of the same type open). Especially those with specific India experience. Someone said, an attorney will never care as much about your case as you. You will respond to every request quickly, while you are "just a case" in an office.

I think it has already been mentioned - there is a sticky in the MENA forum for returned petitions.

Good Luck!!

When a petition has been returned it's a bad idea to hire an attorney to help you? There are plenty of people on VJ who can help you?

I'm really glad to see the OP has counsel assisting them. I hope the OP has 'checked out' the counsel they have hired and that this is an EXPERIENCED family-based immigration attorney. Because it is true that not just ANY lawyer can help.

And I certainly hope we don't run around this community telling people NOT to seek legal advice because VJ members are 'knowledgeable'.

This post stuns me.

[emt103c 10]

milo76--

I am glad to hear that you are aggressively pursuing this. A lot of people don't take it seriously enough. I hate when the consular officers try to pretend that they know more about our relationships than we do. At the border once, one of the officers tried to convince me that I was just young and naive and that my Pakistani fiancee had me "duped" into believing him. He literally thought I was just being stupid, and basically told me so.

People like this are just plain insulting and I am glad that your are fighting it. Keep working. It may take another try, but you WILL win.

[freedom45 0]

QUESTION IF MY PETITION EXPIRES WHAT HAPPENS WILL IT BE FORGOTTEN I AM TRYING TO FIGHT IT MY CONGRESSMAN GOT THE SAME ANSWER I GOT. DOES ANY ONE KNOW WHATS NEXT OR WHAT IF REVOKED WHATS THE NEXT STEP.

[Twisted K 2]

Ok - as some of you may have seen on the AP Tracker thread - my K1 petition is being returned.

While I'm hoping that my congressman and senators may pull some political magic and have the case reopened but until I get word of how that is going I've been interviewing attorneys. Today I was posed an interesting strategy.

First - a little about our case: We had red flags the size of Texas - only 1 visit, recently divorced, and I couldn't attend the interview under threat of losing my job and trying to be the responsible one I figured with the economy I'd chance it. Bad choice - especially for New Delhi!

The proposed strategy:

Have the case return to USCIS [in my case VSC]. Follow up with any requests they have over time.

Go back to India for another trip - get tons of pics and documentation [Estimated date 3-09].

After returning from the trip refile a new K1 including in the cover letter information about the 1st petition, the 1st interview, plans made had the visa been approved, all new information from the 2nd trip, and all correspondence/emails/chats/telephone records available for the duration of the relationship.

Now here's the thought - if USCIS approves the second petition it is proving that the original relationship was true and that there is still an ongoing relationship. This attorney's thought is this is a loophole around waiting for the 1st petition to be re-adjudicated. Additionally, it will carry more wait at the interview because it will be reaffirming the 1st petition that the Consular recommended to be denied...

This attorney was anti-DCF in my case - he felt that moving to India may reek of desperation and that if the Consular officer is feeling that I've been "duped" into a fraudulent relationship, dropping everything and moving overseas would add to their fire.

So, to the experienced and the arm chair attorneys...does this strategy hold water?

Wow, that is a very interesting take on the subject. I am leary about having 2 petitions opened with the USCIS. As far as they are concerned, until they say it is expired/denied/revoked/readjudicated, the first one is still good to go. They are the only ones who have the very last say so. There is a very interesting link on here of someone who got their case sent back to the usa, and instead of letting USCIS do what they were supposed to do (expiring/denying/revoking/readjudicating) they went to their SO's home country, got married, and filed the I-130, which was immediately denied, and never made it to the consulate, a waste of time and money.

Not sure if you read it yet, but here is the link...

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry2504274

I wish you luck, my friend. I am still convinced that we will all be with our loved ones before we leave this life

[anitacastillo 0]

Glad you are being pro-active.

However, I'm not sure if hiring an attorney is the best use of your $$. IMO, there are equally/more knowledgable people here on VJ (I think you have already gotten some bad advice about having 2 petitions of the same type open). Especially those with specific India experience. Someone said, an attorney will never care as much about your case as you. You will respond to every request quickly, while you are "just a case" in an office.

I think it has already been mentioned - there is a sticky in the MENA forum for returned petitions.

Good Luck!!

When a petition has been returned it's a bad idea to hire an attorney to help you? There are plenty of people on VJ who can help you?

I'm really glad to see the OP has counsel assisting them. I hope the OP has 'checked out' the counsel they have hired and that this is an EXPERIENCED family-based immigration attorney. Because it is true that not just ANY lawyer can help.

And I certainly hope we don't run around this community telling people NOT to seek legal advice because VJ members are 'knowledgeable'.

This post stuns me.

Guess I have heard too many stories of immigration attorneys who really didn't know the process or a specific country's uniqueness or didn't turn documents around in a timely matter. The OP has already gotten bad advice -- start another K-1 petition. That would be a waste of money and the OP has to pay for it.

Opinions .... we all have them.

[Ann 26 1]

Ok - as some of you may have seen on the AP Tracker thread - my K1 petition is being returned.

While I'm hoping that my congressman and senators may pull some political magic and have the case reopened but until I get word of how that is going I've been interviewing attorneys. Today I was posed an interesting strategy.

First - a little about our case: We had red flags the size of Texas - only 1 visit, recently divorced, and I couldn't attend the interview under threat of losing my job and trying to be the responsible one I figured with the economy I'd chance it. Bad choice - especially for New Delhi!

The proposed strategy:

Have the case return to USCIS [in my case VSC]. Follow up with any requests they have over time.

Go back to India for another trip - get tons of pics and documentation [Estimated date 3-09].

After returning from the trip refile a new K1 including in the cover letter information about the 1st petition, the 1st interview, plans made had the visa been approved, all new information from the 2nd trip, and all correspondence/emails/chats/telephone records available for the duration of the relationship.

Now here's the thought - if USCIS approves the second petition it is proving that the original relationship was true and that there is still an ongoing relationship. This attorney's thought is this is a loophole around waiting for the 1st petition to be re-adjudicated. Additionally, it will carry more wait at the interview because it will be reaffirming the 1st petition that the Consular recommended to be denied...

This attorney was anti-DCF in my case - he felt that moving to India may reek of desperation and that if the Consular officer is feeling that I've been "duped" into a fraudulent relationship, dropping everything and moving overseas would add to their fire.

So, to the experienced and the arm chair attorneys...does this strategy hold water?

Wow, that is a very interesting take on the subject. I am leary about having 2 petitions opened with the USCIS. As far as they are concerned, until they say it is expired/denied/revoked/readjudicated, the first one is still good to go. They are the only ones who have the very last say so. There is a very interesting link on here of someone who got their case sent back to the usa, and instead of letting USCIS do what they were supposed to do (expiring/denying/revoking/readjudicating) they went to their SO's home country, got married, and filed the I-130, which was immediately denied, and never made it to the consulate, a waste of time and money.

Not sure if you read it yet, but here is the link...

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry2504274

I wish you luck, my friend. I am still convinced that we will all be with our loved ones before we leave this life

They were denied by the USCIS, becasue probably there was something wrong in their relationship, which was descovered by readjujating their returned K-1 petiton.

Now when they filed thier second petition, I-130 the adjudicator had to pull back their expired and retunred K-1 petiton and found the reasons for accusing their relationship being fraud. If the ongoing relationship had been established USCIS would ahve approved the new petition.

Based on my own experience, once we filed the new petition , I-130 petiton, it was approved, which means that USCIS didn't find anything fraud in our relationship. But each case is different and I can't tell anyone to follow our example. It is better to fight , but K-1 is something very tricky and only 10% of the returned K-1 petitions are ever readjudicating or even reaffirmed. I have never heard that expired and returned K-1 petiton was reaffirmed. They usually cancel that.

Good luck to anyone who is in the same situtation . That's really a long, troubled way which should be gone with hope and patience.

[brnidokiegurl 0]

i didnt read all post but our k1 was return but to calif. Calif does let most expire, vermont has been known to actually review ,one i know within months one i know going on 3 years still nothing for the later. Ours expired and my congressperson got them to email this statement of expired and we were free to refile. (per them) I returned and married filed cr1 refiled. We never were told exact reason could have been one of a few things. But these things that could have stopped the first were still there with 2nd, (age, divorces) but i did add 2nd trip. He now has the visa and actually at the interview they ask what the reason for the first return and he told them we were never told. Im sure she had all that in her hand when she ask but we still dont know.

Now i do know of another did k1 it was returned and she was advised per well know lawyer to refile immediately. None of us were used to this as always being told wait for the letter etc. She actually got the return notice saying they got the returned case within a few days from the time she got the letter saying they had the new one. They combined the cases proceded on and he got a visa. So it really is hard to know what to do. There certainly is no set standard set of rules to follow for all.

[Sylvia_n_Joseph 3]

According to Marc Ellis you never want to cancel the first petition. You address it in the second one. Like mine where he was asked for the details of my DOD SECRET work and it was sent back because he didn't know . And you can file a second k1 right over the first expired k1. They may combine and reaffirm the first one or just process the second one but that is cheaper than appealing the first one and so much quicker. Especially when the consulate was so wrong with what they did the first time. I made a report to security that they were trying to find out about my work so all is even.

[Ann 26 1]

i didnt read all post but our k1 was return but to calif. Calif does let most expire, vermont has been known to actually review ,one i know within months one i know going on 3 years still nothing for the later. Ours expired and my congressperson got them to email this statement of expired and we were free to refile. (per them) I returned and married filed cr1 refiled. We never were told exact reason could have been one of a few things. But these things that could have stopped the first were still there with 2nd, (age, divorces) but i did add 2nd trip. He now has the visa and actually at the interview they ask what the reason for the first return and he told them we were never told. Im sure she had all that in her hand when she ask but we still dont know.

Now i do know of another did k1 it was returned and she was advised per well know lawyer to refile immediately. None of us were used to this as always being told wait for the letter etc. She actually got the return notice saying they got the returned case within a few days from the time she got the letter saying they had the new one. They combined the cases proceded on and he got a visa. So it really is hard to know what to do. There certainly is no set standard set of rules to follow for all.

We involved the senator in our case as well. We also got the notice that they receieved our K-1 petition. After that we received notice that our new I-130 was approved by California Service Center. We never received the notice that our K-1 was expired or soemthing like that. But we are sure that they pulled back our returned K-1 petition before they approved new one.

My husband is coming here for the 4 th time now. The reason of my denial was probably the age difference, so Con.Off suspended the case. We never knew what was the actual reason for the case to be returned. But I am very happy to know that ppl got lucky and got approved for the second trial. I hope my case will be the next one to be approved.

[Ann 26 1]

According to Marc Ellis you never want to cancel the first petition. You address it in the second one. Like mine where he was asked for the details of my DOD SECRET work and it was sent back because he didn't know . And you can file a second k1 right over the first expired k1. They may combine and reaffirm the first one or just process the second one but that is cheaper than appealing the first one and so much quicker. Especially when the consulate was so wrong with what they did the first time. I made a report to security that they were trying to find out about my work so all is even.

Once you get married your finace visa(k-1 petition) is cancelled as you will never be able to use it. And actually refiling the second K-1 petition is not that clever. Marrying your fiance actually vanishes the doubts of the Con.Off. Most cases are returned for the reason that Con.Off was not assured in our true intentions. But as I noticed each case in unique and God knows what's is going on there