Short-haired women are less sexy

[Brad and Vika 129]

Yeah. I think that since we have some mods (who shall remain nameless) that like to lock and move threads around, there should be a new forum - maybe called WAY off topic. Then when we depart from the OP topic say, four different directions, they can move the thread there. Also, when we lose track of a thread we all know where it probably wound up.

[Jenn! 918]

Brad, if you have something to say to one or more mods, I would suggest that you send a PM and hash out your issue rather than continually making not so thinly veiled references on the forum.

[Sister Fracas 5]

so not only your wrinkles and saggy body will say you're old, but your hair also? I don't thijnk it's tacky. Tacky is everybody reaching a certain age having to have the same short haircut, like they're announcing my days of being pretty are over so I might as well cut my hair to finish the job.

Really? I have short hair. Glad you think I've given up on looking pretty!

I'm totally not getting this from what Nessa said. To me it's the same as saying, well, I'm turning middle-age, so I might as well not wear jeans anymore, but wear what's appropriate for an older woman. Why should jeans or longer hair not be appropriate. I can't find anywhere on this thread where someone has said that short-hair can't be pretty, but perhaps just not what they prefer. I keep saying...it's the not-so-unspoken rule that women should fix themselves up in a certain way that conforms to societal norms that I have issue with.

[Brad and Vika 129]

Brad, if you have something to say to one or more mods, I would suggest that you send a PM and hash out your issue rather than continually making not so thinly veiled references on the forum.

I think I hear the message "if you don't like something, keep it to yourself, or leave it someplace where we can control it better". Let me be clear on this - Jenn! Some of you have been very helpful to me in the past, and I appreciate it. I do not have a problem with any specific moderator. The message is for all mods and admin of any ilk here. Please be fair and even-handed when moving threads or censoring members. Some folks can post the most outrageous stuff, swear, stalk others, etc. and you all give them a wink-and-a-nod. Others say "boo" and get censored. It looks to me like some folks get a pass because of their familiarity. Others don't get censored because the member(s) complaining are not well liked by the staff. Either you or Magenta made a direct reference to that recently. I am talking about Shpat, Eric, Korat, and a number of others - making no excuse for cursing or attacking another member - do the crime, do the time. Expressing oneself is different.

Several of us have tried to be very constructive about this, and we are ignored mostly. That is why I don't PM about it. And when some one (even a moderator) makes a comment or takes action on a public forum, why can't we post G-rated critical commentary publicly?

[Jenn! 918]

Brad, if you have something to say to one or more mods, I would suggest that you send a PM and hash out your issue rather than continually making not so thinly veiled references on the forum.

I think I hear the message "if you don't like something, keep it to yourself, or leave it someplace where we can control it better". Let me be clear on this - Jenn! Some of you have been very helpful to me in the past, and I appreciate it. I do not have a problem with any specific moderator. The message is for all mods and admin of any ilk here. Please be fair and even-handed when moving threads or censoring members. Some folks can post the most outrageous stuff, swear, stalk others, etc. and you all give them a wink-and-a-nod. Others say "boo" and get censored. It looks to me like some folks get a pass because of their familiarity. Others don't get censored because the member(s) complaining are not well liked by the staff. Either you or Magenta made a direct reference to that recently. I am talking about Shpat, Eric, Korat, and a number of others - making no excuse for cursing or attacking another member - do the crime, do the time. Expressing oneself is different.

Several of us have tried to be very constructive about this, and we are ignored mostly. That is why I don't PM about it. And when some one (even a moderator) makes a comment or takes action on a public forum, why can't we post G-rated critical commentary publicly?

It has always been VJ policy to not discuss moderation actions involving other members. This is why we do not have the discussion publicly. Also, keep in mind that just because something may appear a certain way to you, that does not mean that's how it is.

I think I can speak for all the moderators here when I say that we really do try our best to be fair and even-handed. A majority of the time we act on reports from members. Have you considered that the members who are most often the subjects of moderator action are those that are reported the most?

I'm not sure what you referring to when you say that we don't act on reports if we don't like the member.

If you have a problem with the lack of transparency in moderation on VJ, I'm not sure what to tell you. That's how it is. If you don't like it, you can appeal to Ewok.

[Sister Fracas 5]

A majority of the time we act on reports from members. Have you considered that the members who are most often the subjects of moderator action are those that are reported the most?

This has always been my understanding... so even if 5 people think someone is unfairly censored or banned, another 10 or 15 might hit the report button and complain. Who is to know? And I can say, to keep this board moderately friendly, I wouldn't want to know who is reporting who.

Mods, thanks for your efforts. It can't be easy with all of the interesting personalities on here.

Now...

Whether long or short... take care of your hair. LOL

[Brad and Vika 129]

Brad, if you have something to say to one or more mods, I would suggest that you send a PM and hash out your issue rather than continually making not so thinly veiled references on the forum.

I think I hear the message "if you don't like something, keep it to yourself, or leave it someplace where we can control it better". Let me be clear on this - Jenn! Some of you have been very helpful to me in the past, and I appreciate it. I do not have a problem with any specific moderator. The message is for all mods and admin of any ilk here. Please be fair and even-handed when moving threads or censoring members. Some folks can post the most outrageous stuff, swear, stalk others, etc. and you all give them a wink-and-a-nod. Others say "boo" and get censored. It looks to me like some folks get a pass because of their familiarity. Others don't get censored because the member(s) complaining are not well liked by the staff. Either you or Magenta made a direct reference to that recently. I am talking about Shpat, Eric, Korat, and a number of others - making no excuse for cursing or attacking another member - do the crime, do the time. Expressing oneself is different.

Several of us have tried to be very constructive about this, and we are ignored mostly. That is why I don't PM about it. And when some one (even a moderator) makes a comment or takes action on a public forum, why can't we post G-rated critical commentary publicly?

It has always been VJ policy to not discuss moderation actions involving other members. This is why we do not have the discussion publicly. Also, keep in mind that just because something may appear a certain way to you, that does not mean that's how it is.

I think I can speak for all the moderators here when I say that we really do try our best to be fair and even-handed. A majority of the time we act on reports from members. Have you considered that the members who are most often the subjects of moderator action are those that are reported the most?

I'm not sure what you referring to when you say that we don't act on reports if we don't like the member.

If you have a problem with the lack of transparency in moderation on VJ, I'm not sure what to tell you. That's how it is. If you don't like it, you can appeal to Ewok.

Thanks Jenn! I do think that you all generally do a good job with all of this. You can see however my reluctance to accept that the situation is not what it appears, when you just said there will be no discussion or transparency. Because that is exactly what I am saying - it appears that the moderation process is fairly subjective, and that standards of conduct are not consistently applied to members. Actions will not be discussed, nor will results. Appeals may be made, privately, but appeals or complaints are preferred off the public forums - and neither the complaint or action will be discussed or explained neccessarily. And if we don't like it, we can appeal to Ewok, who may or may not respond (I read he is just very busy somewhere) - and his response or lack thereof will not be explained either.

I don't intend this commentary to be as harsh as it probably sounds, and thank you very much for responding tactfully and publicly Jenn!

[morocco4ever 63]

Boo!

[mox 298]

If you have a problem with the lack of transparency in moderation on VJ, I'm not sure what to tell you. That's how it is. If you don't like it, you can appeal to Ewok.

I think the moderation team does a pretty good job, and I've said as much several times in exchange for money. And I agree that there are just some things that can't be shared with the general population, especially when it comes to actions against other members. But I do think Brad makes a good point in that a certain amount of dialogue, even criticism, is healthy and really just needs to be tolerated. I don't think any of the moderators have such a thin skin as to expect that any and all criticism should be relegated to private messages. I think it's a healthy part of being a community. And criminy, if passive-aggressiveness were relegated to personal messages, my post count would be something like 3.

The "organizer program," or whatever it's called, on the other hand, is a mess and needs to be fixed. And I don't say this just because of my most recent run-in. Either the rules are not clear enough, or the organizers are not trained enough, or (and this is my current operating theory) there is absolutely no criteria applied to the selection of organizers other than "I see you have lotsa hearts, would you like to be an organizer?" Obviously this doesn't apply to all organizers, and in fact some of them do a very good job, but I'm constantly amazed that some of the most unqualified people continue to represent VJ in an "organizer" capacity. Organizers *are* staff (despite what has been argued before), they need to be treated as staff, and they need to be held to the same standards as staff.

Anyway, to summarize, short hair is teh sexah.

[Brad and Vika 129]

Boo!

YOU ARE HEREBY CENSORED!!!! (He said, overstepping his authority).

[morocco4ever 63]

Boo!

YOU ARE HEREBY CENSORED!!!! (He said, overstepping his authority).

Neh...Jenn likes me....neener neener.

[mox 298]

YOU ARE HEREBY CENSORED!!!! (He said, overstepping his authority).

You're gonna need more hearts than that to be an organizer my friend.

[Sister Fracas 5]

If you have a problem with the lack of transparency in moderation on VJ, I'm not sure what to tell you. That's how it is. If you don't like it, you can appeal to Ewok.

I think the moderation team does a pretty good job, and I've said as much several times in exchange for money. And I agree that there are just some things that can't be shared with the general population, especially when it comes to actions against other members. But I do think Brad makes a good point in that a certain amount of dialogue, even criticism, is healthy and really just needs to be tolerated. I don't think any of the moderators have such a thin skin as to expect that any and all criticism should be relegated to private messages. I think it's a healthy part of being a community. And criminy, if passive-aggressiveness were relegated to personal messages, my post count would be something like 3.

The "organizer program," or whatever it's called, on the other hand, is a mess and needs to be fixed. And I don't say this just because of my most recent run-in. Either the rules are not clear enough, or the organizers are not trained enough, or (and this is my current operating theory) there is absolutely no criteria applied to the selection of organizers other than "I see you have lotsa hearts, would you like to be an organizer?" Obviously this doesn't apply to all organizers, and in fact some of them do a very good job, but I'm constantly amazed that some of the most unqualified people continue to represent VJ in an "organizer" capacity. Organizers *are* staff (despite what has been argued before), they need to be treated as staff, and they need to be held to the same standards as staff.

Anyway, to summarize, short hair is teh sexah.

There IS a place to discuss board issues... http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showforum=14.

All of these people, mods, organizers, Ewok ARE volunteers it needs to be remembered.

[Brad and Vika 129]

Boo!

YOU ARE HEREBY CENSORED!!!! (He said, overstepping his authority).

Neh...Jenn likes me....neener neener.

I know... that's why I had to say it myself. No one with real authority is going to weigh in

THAT WAS A JOKE!!

[mox 298]

All of these people, mods, organizers, Ewok ARE volunteers it needs to be remembered.

Not true. They are paid in the bitter, bitter tears of those whose threads are locked. They covet this currency of the damned like greedy, greedy vampires. It's true. Ewok pm'd me in a krugeresque dream.

Also, short-haired women are teh sexah.

Edited December 9, 2008 by mox