Should Someone Who Lies About Their Education Be Fired?

[britty 1]

It has always puzzled me on how much emphasis is put on degrees in the US. Some of the richest people I know only have a high school education. Just look at the athletes, singers, entrepreneurs and entertainers who earn more in a year each than 100 MBA graduates will earn in a lifetime.

Performance in the classroom does not automatically equate to success in the real world. How many of the world's billionaires are educated, let alone highly educated? not many actually.

I totally agree! Working in HR I could tell so many stories of the ding dongs with advanced degrees I spend more time with explaining policies, helping with performance managment, etc. I'm not knocking education I think its important but there is TOOOO much emphasis on it these days and university does not teach real world experience.

My answer to your original post would be "No" he should not be fired provided his performance over his years of service is/was stellar. There are other ways to discipline an employee...no raise, no bonus, required to take university classes, etc.

yep totally agree. A degree is absolutely no measure of intelligence. By the way Nawal, I think you win the "Most Beautiful VJ Baby Photos" award. They are stunners - congrats.

[Caladan 19]

I don't think a degree is necessarily indicative of intelligence or aptitude, but if you lie on your resume, you should be gone.

[JeanneVictoria 55]

Lying is lying. I'd say fire them.

[jundp 191]

I think it boils down to integrity. If the lie was made to obtain the position when the qualifications weren't met....that to me shows a lack of integrity.

It doesn't matter if there are "hardworking people without a degree." I'm a hardworking person with more than one degree and I don't think I'm better than someone without a degree. But I do think integrity matters a great deal.

[Niels Bohr 72]

I remembered somebody who worked in Bell Labs who lied that he had a doctorate degree was fired. Reason, the Ethic Policy enforced was regarding to termination if someone withheld information to the organization in regards to their employment.

[SaadBell 0]

Depends on the job, I sure don't want them prescribing medications, or perform open heart surgery, but if it is something like business, than let him stay if he is doing a great job. I work with people who have been in college for over 8 years and believe me I know junior high students that know more, but just because they have the degree and licenses, people think they know something, in reality they know NOTHING.

[Reba 2]

I think they should be fired, whether or not the position requires a particular level of education. They lied, and who's to say whta else they've lied about, and how much they'll continue to lie. Its a reflection on the company as well as the individual. Who can trust him/her now that its been discovered? Who can trust anything that the company produces/sells/services, now that everyone knows its being run by a liar? Whether the guy dropped out of highschool in 10th grade, or just got too drunk in college to finish is not the issue. Integrity and believability is. If the company does not fire this person then they look stupid to the public IMO, and they'll lose credibility in the market.

But then I'm the sort who won't frequent a shop/business who can't be bothered to proof read their advertising.

[jundp 191]

But then I'm the sort who won't frequent a shop/business who can't be bothered to proof read their advertising.

Me too

[Teacher Mark 53]

But then I'm the sort who won't frequent a shop/business who can't be bothered to proof read their advertising.

Me too

Why not? If they are careless enough to allow a typo they may be underpricing merchandise, or would it be unethical for me to take advantage?

[When2RNLove 6]

A conversation came about after reading about a VP of a company who was outed for saying he had a masters degree when he in fact never even had a bachelors! Do you think someone should be fired if it is found out much after hiring that they lied about their education? Even if they have been doing a great job?

I say yes, and he brought it upon himself.. It's an insult to those who play by the rules when sitting in front of an Interviewer telling the truth and spilling our history out to this person only to find out later you didn't get the job.

[Dr. Obvious 49]

I am not sure where the debate is about this. I don't understand what being able to do the job without a degree has to do with lying about having one in order to get the job. The former is not the point. The point is that this kind of gross misrepresentation should always be a fireable offense.

I mean, I have a BA. A job I want requires an MBA. I just say, "OK, whatever, I can do that job, so I will just slap down that I have an MBA with a 4.0 GPA from Imadeitup Univerisity, even though I have not taken an economics or business course since high school and I got Cs and Ds in those. They won't check and I know I can do it, so it is all cool."

Riiiiiiiggggggghhhhttttt.

Edited December 6, 2008 by Wacken

[LaL 418]

I am not sure where the debate is about this. I don't understand what being able to do the job without a degree has to do with lying about having one in order to get the job. The former is not the point. The point is that this kind of gross misrepresentation should always be a fireable offense.

I mean, I have a BA. A job I want requires an MBA. I just say, "OK, whatever, I can do that job, so I will just slap down that I have an MBA from Imadeitup Univerisity, even though I have not taken an economics or business course since high school. They won't check and I know I can do it, so it is all cool."

Riiiiiiiggggggghhhhttttt.

This is my thinking as well. This has zero to do with someone being brilliant at what they do despite lack of education. As far as Bridgit's anecdote about it not being fair to those without a degree who would otherwise be a perfect fit, well, who said life is fair? Embellishing a resume/educational background is still misrepresentation, and in this case its wasnt even just one degree that was falsified, it was a bachelors and a masters. Not a small detail.

If the company sees an opportunity for a perfect fit in a less than adequate applicant, they can choose to bend some rules, but they need to know what the facts are.

[Ling Ling 22]

Hmmmm, I made a few comments (starting with post #71) with rational that hasn't been debated.

Everyone seams to think that the key factor in termination should be based wholly on the fact of misrepresentation.

Adding to my other points....if you were taking a certain medication that was entirely unique, and said drug either sustains your life,

or enhances it, and you found out that the manufacturer knowingly made a false representation about the drug, but the false representation

has no otherwise adverse effect, and in no other way affects you or your use of the drug...would you stop taking the medication?

What if they spelled something wrong in the literature? What if you found out that one of the patent holders had lied about their education?

Would you be willing to give up a life sustaining medication purely based on one of these factors, for yourself, your child, or your parent?

Would you say, sorry Mum, you're going to have to die because of my personal ethics policy?

If you review my prior posts, you will see that I am not an advocate of misrepresentation, but I feel that both hiring and termination decisions

should be looked at on a case by case basis, and that while their are many (perhaps most) instances whereas a misrepresentation would warrant termination,

the needs of the business (as with the analogy of the need to sustain ones life) have to be considered over the myth that anyone is devoid of embellishment, lack of full

disclosure, or have never told an untruth to gain favor or position.

Edited December 6, 2008 by Ling Ling

[sereia 0]

I totally agree! Working in HR I could tell so many stories of the ding dongs with advanced degrees I spend more time with explaining policies, helping with performance managment, etc. I'm not knocking education I think its important but there is TOOOO much emphasis on it these days and university does not teach real world experience.

My answer to your original post would be "No" he should not be fired provided his performance over his years of service is/was stellar. There are other ways to discipline an employee...no raise, no bonus, required to take university classes, etc.

Total professional HR answer, imho!

[*Robert* 2]

A lie is a lie. What else did they lie about, or will lie about?

Fire them. Automatic.

As far as having a degree, if they aren't as important as some people want you to believe, there should be no reason to lie and say you have one, when in fact you don't.