Serious Doubts

[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

True, but she's claiming to be a Muslim but at the same time rejecting things that are a part of being Muslim, is she not? So the debate got started about whether or not you can just reject something. It's like saying "I'm Christian but I don't accept Jesus Christ as my saviour"...a Christian would then say "Then you're not following Christianity"... Muslims can't accept anything in the religion being changed. This is why Muslims are at war with the world...we will not change our religion regardless of how modern, liberal, or advanced the rest of the world becomes. That is a fact and the politics and the way Muslim countries are today, prove that fact.

I think that comment is way out there. Do you mean you are saying that all muslims are at war with the world? Or that muslims have a valid reason to fight the world? - whatever you meant to say, the words I bolded for you, really didnt need to be said.

OR .. Perhaps it is that the WORLD is fighting Muslims...hmmmmmm. and that The world or the west who thinks its the world. is fighting Muslims.

No, that is not what SHE said, she said ... this is why muslims are at war with the world. I find her comment and your comment unnecessary.

[Ban Hammer 13,342]

[Y's_habibitk 2]

One thing that you have to remember about all of this, is that with your husband this isn't just about Islam, this is about culture. His culture. For so many MENA men and women, too, they cannot and would never even think about separating their religion from their culture, it is ingrained - it is their life. When your husband met you, you were a devout hijabi wearing muslima. That is how you presented yourself to him, that was who he fell in love with. Now that he's here in America with you, his worst fear has come true. He's now in your culture, and the devout muslima wife he married but months ago has taken off her hijab and is now questioning the Qur'an and the Hadiths. I'm sure he's freaking the hell out - in his world, in his culture, I'm sure not too many women sit there and question the Qur'an and the Hadiths. You didn't just marry a Moroccan man, you married his family, his culture, and his religion, too.

He needs to be tolerant of you, but you also need to be tolerant of him - by you taking off your hijab in the USA he probably feels like he lost control, not of you but of other men. Other men can check you out, and he sees you as exposed. His whole world just turned around...give him a moment to digest all of this.

This is all I was trying to get across in my posts

[notime4haterz 0]

True, but she's claiming to be a Muslim but at the same time rejecting things that are a part of being Muslim, is she not? So the debate got started about whether or not you can just reject something. It's like saying "I'm Christian but I don't accept Jesus Christ as my saviour"...a Christian would then say "Then you're not following Christianity"... Muslims can't accept anything in the religion being changed. This is why Muslims are at war with the world...we will not change our religion regardless of how modern, liberal, or advanced the rest of the world becomes. That is a fact and the politics and the way Muslim countries are today, prove that fact.

I think that comment is way out there. Do you mean you are saying that all muslims are at war with the world? Or that muslims have a valid reason to fight the world? - whatever you meant to say, the words I bolded for you, really didnt need to be said.

OR .. Perhaps it is that the WORLD is fighting Muslims...hmmmmmm. and that The world or the west who thinks its the world. is fighting Muslims.

Yeah well if I accuse the west of fighting Muslims I would have been attacked even more LOL But you went there, so now the ball is in your court LOOOOOL Go Merijan!

Edited November 17, 2008 by narina77

[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

Quote: Muslims can't accept anything in the religion being changed. This is why Muslims are at war with the world

since this is what she stated, it makes me think that this is exactly what she means

I have muslim family and friends. I have no problems with muslims.

I have problems with terrorists regardless of if they claim to be Muslim, Christian, or American, Russian, Korean or Iranian.

[Y's_habibitk 2]

True, but she's claiming to be a Muslim but at the same time rejecting things that are a part of being Muslim, is she not? So the debate got started about whether or not you can just reject something. It's like saying "I'm Christian but I don't accept Jesus Christ as my saviour"...a Christian would then say "Then you're not following Christianity"... Muslims can't accept anything in the religion being changed. This is why Muslims are at war with the world...we will not change our religion regardless of how modern, liberal, or advanced the rest of the world becomes. That is a fact and the politics and the way Muslim countries are today, prove that fact.

I think that comment is way out there. Do you mean you are saying that all muslims are at war with the world? Or that muslims have a valid reason to fight the world? - whatever you meant to say, the words I bolded for you, really didnt need to be said.

OR .. Perhaps it is that the WORLD is fighting Muslims...hmmmmmm. and that The world or the west who thinks its the world. is fighting Muslims.

No, that is not what SHE said, she said ... this is why muslims are at war with the world. I find her comment and your comment unnecessary.

Im gonna go ahead and jump in here becasue this argument is clearly none of my business lol

Im sure Narina is coming from the thought that (practicing,born and raised..culturally imbedded) muslims are one of the only religions that follows EVERYTHING in their holy book. They dont pick and choose like so many of us christians do. The fact that they havent changed the beliefs and texts since they came to be is quite different than the other major religions. Christian women are supposed to cover their heads when praying. I dont think many christians do that... execpt the greek orthodox. Christians arent supposed to get drunk... many do.

I dont think that anyone who is practicing good deeds,praying to one god and helping others is going to hell for not following every word in their religious texts. I dont think muslims think that either, BUT... I know that they do not pick and choose, and they have a hard time accepting that some muslims do.

My point? not sure.. i guess i just had to say all of that. lol

They were harsh words, but I just dont think she meant it the way it sounded. Sorry if Im way off base narina.

Lisa

[merijan 0]

Quote: Muslims can't accept anything in the religion being changed. This is why Muslims are at war with the world

since this is what she stated, it makes me think that this is exactly what she means

I have muslim family and friends. I have no problems with muslims.

I have problems with terrorists regardless of if they claim to be Muslim, Christian, or American, Russian, Korean or Iranian.

I know you dont Tamera and I know you yourself are very open minded and I have not seen you being disrespectfull to Islam. However I think the point here is that in the West most think its the only way of life, not allowing for other cultures or thinking. to be considered "civilized" and sometimes Muslims want to make excuses for things in Islam that dont quite "jell" with Western thinking. As if the only way to think is the Western way. So many times we try to make excuses for the way we want to live ourlifes, raise our kids , etc. But we can not change the Quran to fit the West.

And yes this country is at war with Islam, not Terroism as we are many time fooled in to believing.

[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

Muslims are NOT the only ones who follow everything in their holy book. I know alot of muslims here. I work with them. I am in a family of them. My friends date muslim guys. In the different people I know, there are people that are from several different countries, born into islam and very culturally clear on their family ways. However, they play the lottery. Or drink, curse. Eat pork. but pray 5 times a day and follow ramandan.

Muslims are not perfect people and neither do they follow everything. The same for any religion. No perfect people and none that follow exactly either.

Isnt that why sunnis are killing shias and so forth. Their way is right to them and their brothers and sisters in islam are wrong? So they go around my friends home country of Pakistan or my brother in laws country of India and suicide bomb? I dont desire to go around killing or bombing those I spiritually disagree with.

[notime4haterz 0]

True, but she's claiming to be a Muslim but at the same time rejecting things that are a part of being Muslim, is she not? So the debate got started about whether or not you can just reject something. It's like saying "I'm Christian but I don't accept Jesus Christ as my saviour"...a Christian would then say "Then you're not following Christianity"... Muslims can't accept anything in the religion being changed. This is why Muslims are at war with the world...we will not change our religion regardless of how modern, liberal, or advanced the rest of the world becomes. That is a fact and the politics and the way Muslim countries are today, prove that fact.

I think that comment is way out there. Do you mean you are saying that all muslims are at war with the world? Or that muslims have a valid reason to fight the world? - whatever you meant to say, the words I bolded for you, really didnt need to be said.

OR .. Perhaps it is that the WORLD is fighting Muslims...hmmmmmm. and that The world or the west who thinks its the world. is fighting Muslims.

No, that is not what SHE said, she said ... this is why muslims are at war with the world. I find her comment and your comment unnecessary.

Im gonna go ahead and jump in here becasue this argument is clearly none of my business lol

Im sure Narina is coming from the thought that (practicing,born and raised..culturally imbedded) muslims are one of the only religions that follows EVERYTHING in their holy book. They dont pick and choose like so many of us christians do. The fact that they havent changed the beliefs and texts since they came to be is quite different than the other major religions. Christian women are supposed to cover their heads when praying. I dont think many christians do that... execpt the greek orthodox. Christians arent supposed to get drunk... many do.

I dont think that anyone who is practicing good deeds,praying to one god and helping others is going to hell for not following every word in their religious texts. I dont think muslims think that either, BUT... I know that they do not pick and choose, and they have a hard time accepting that some muslims do.

My point? not sure.. i guess i just had to say all of that. lol

They were harsh words, but I just dont think she meant it the way it sounded. Sorry if Im way off base narina.

Lisa

No Lisa, you said it perfectly. Tamara is just having a problem with one sentence and I guess not really paying attention to the rest. Look at the world today. Where are the wars? Chechnya, Palestine, Afghanistan, Iraq...in the future maybe Iran and Syria. Yeah, the world is at war with Muslims. This is a fact. Why is this such a problem?

Oh God, I just read her last message...next she'll be calling me a terrorist! LOL

No one said to kill people we don't agree with...I'm just saying don't come into my religion and then try to change it. I'm sure the above mentioned countries feel the same way too...don't come to our country and tell us how to live...Don't marry someone and then tell them they have to change to suite you... it's all the same.

Edited November 17, 2008 by narina77

[Y's_habibitk 2]

I realize that not all muslims follow the religion... im sure you know i meant the majority.

What other religion can you say that 8/9 (ok maybe 7, if you factor in the US muslims)out of 10 follow exactly what is in their texts?

I didnt say they were perfect. Im not saying one religion is better than the other.. I respect everyones belief systems, Thats their choice and right and if they want to worship the doorknob, or 18 different entities..i dont care as long as they dont harm me or my family.

My point was that, the difference of picking and choosing is hard for most muslims to swallow

and terrorism was never mentioned here, but you have incorporated it somehow.....i find that interesting.

[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

Im telling ya'll straight up. To me, its not about war with muslims. - I personally love them, related to them, work with them and so forth. But Im tired of the muslim ladies on here critizing each other on each others religious beliefs. As well as bombings every other day going on in Palestine where I have friends. Pakistan where I have friends and my friends bfs family. India where my brother in laws family is at. And any other country where I have to see almost daily on the news blood baths of suicide bombers killing their own brothers and sisters in islam or brothers and sisters of their own country. Every time I have to see that and read the story of the mothers and families weeping for their loss of sons and husbands, or I see pools of blood- I shed tears.

Yah that makes me pretty ticked.

[Ban Hammer 13,342]

[notime4haterz 0]

Muslims are NOT the only ones who follow everything in their holy book. I know alot of muslims here. I work with them. I am in a family of them. My friends date muslim guys. In the different people I know, there are people that are from several different countries, born into islam and very culturally clear on their family ways. However, they play the lottery. Or drink, curse. Eat pork. but pray 5 times a day and follow ramandan.

Muslims are not perfect people and neither do they follow everything. The same for any religion. No perfect people and none that follow exactly either.

Isnt that why sunnis are killing shias and so forth. Their way is right to them and their brothers and sisters in islam are wrong? So they go around my friends home country of Pakistan or my brother in laws country of India and suicide bomb? I dont desire to go around killing or bombing those I spiritually disagree with.

Well if they do that, it's one thing...but are they saying that it's not a sin in Islam to drink, eat pork, and curse? Because if they do something it's one thing...if they say "What I'm doing is not a sin" then it's a completely different story. Did you read all my posts? Because I think you're missing the whole point I was trying to make...

and I didn't mention terrorists, you did. Again, a subject that I wasn't even touching upon.

[merijan 0]

Muslims are NOT the only ones who follow everything in their holy book. I know alot of muslims here. I work with them. I am in a family of them. My friends date muslim guys. In the different people I know, there are people that are from several different countries, born into islam and very culturally clear on their family ways. However, they play the lottery. Or drink, curse. Eat pork. but pray 5 times a day and follow ramandan.

Muslims are not perfect people and neither do they follow everything. The same for any religion. No perfect people and none that follow exactly either.

Isnt that why sunnis are killing shias and so forth. Their way is right to them and their brothers and sisters in islam are wrong? So they go around my friends home country of Pakistan or my brother in laws country of India and suicide bomb? I dont desire to go around killing or bombing those I spiritually disagree with.

Look we could go on about this, and if you want to start another topic about the reality of the war in Iraq and Afghanistan and so on we can. I wont because its alot to say and this was a thread about a husband who did not agree if his wife took off hijab, and her feelings about it.

And if You think we dont do that in this country? I dont. I wouldnt. but we do have people who shoot each other all the time, kill, and so on. Its called gangs, KKK, white supremist. all believing they know how society should be run.

[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

I have every right to mention Terrorists bcz they exist. In any religion, in any country. its not about muslims. so everyone needs to clear their head and see that.