Schwarzenegger tells backers of gay marriage: Don't give up

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The governor expresses hope that Proposition 8 would be overturned as protesters continued to march outside churches across California.

By Michael Rothfeld and Tony Barboza, LA Times

Reporting from Sacramento and Lake Forest — Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger on Sunday expressed hope that the California Supreme Court would overturn Proposition 8, the ballot initiative that outlawed same-sex marriage. He also predicted that the 18,000 gay and lesbian couples who have already wed would not see their marriages nullified by the initiative.

"It's unfortunate, obviously, but it's not the end," Schwarzenegger said in an interview Sunday on CNN. "I think that we will again maybe undo that, if the court is willing to do that, and then move forward from there and again lead in that area."

With his favorable comments toward gay marriage, the governor's thinking appears to have evolved on the issue.

In past statements, he has said he believes that marriage should be between a man and a woman and has rejected legislation authorizing same-sex marriage. Yet he has also said he would not care if same-sex marriage were legal, saying he believed that such an important societal issue should be determined by the voters or the courts.

Schwarzenegger publicly opposed Proposition 8, which amends the state Constitution to declare that "only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California."

On Sunday, he urged backers of gay marriage to follow the lesson he learned as a bodybuilder trying to lift weights that were too heavy for him at first. "I learned that you should never ever give up. . . . They should never give up. They should be on it and on it until they get it done."

The governor's position on the fate of the existing same-sex marriages aligns him with California Atty. Gen. Jerry Brown, who has said he believes that the state Supreme Court will uphold the existing marriages as valid.

The 14-word constitutional amendment does not state explicitly that it would nullify same-sex marriages performed before the Nov. 4 election, although proponents say it will. Legal experts differ on this point.

Schwarzenegger's comments came as protesters took to the streets for a fifth day in a row, sometimes marching to Catholic and Mormon churches that supported passage of the ballot measure.

Hundreds of Proposition 8 protesters in Orange County gathered down the hill from Saddleback Church in Lake Forest as several thousand congregants attended services inside the sprawling religious campus.

Martijn Hostetler, 30, of West Hollywood held a sign that read "Purpose Driven Hate," a dig at the church's celebrity Pastor Rick Warren, author of the bestseller "The Purpose-Driven Life,"who backed the ballot measure. "I don't think Jesus would approve of a gay-marriage ban," he said. "I don't think God discriminates."

While demonstrators received supportive honks from motorists, many members of the mega-church said they had little sympathy for the protesters because the matter had already been settled by voters.

"We're a democracy and our strength is that the majority wins the vote," said John Kirkpatrick, a church member.

Sherrie Derriko, a longtime Saddleback Church member and hair salon owner from Mission Viejo, said she was bothered that protesters had targeted houses of worship. As she drove by, she rolled down her window to offer some advice.

"Read the Bible. God made man and woman, and that's what a marriage is," she called from inside her SUV.

Derriko recounted the incident after attending services. "When we saw them out there, we thought, 'Why are they not over this? Do they think they're going to change anything, or are they just stirring up trouble at our church?' "

But for Sally "Sal" Landers, 52, a Saddleback Church member from Lake Forest, her participation in the protest was a deeply personal matter. Landers and her female partner of three years plan to marry and adopt children. When she received an e-mail from Warren urging a "yes" vote on Proposition 8, she said, "I felt like I was kicked in the stomach by someone who loves unconditionally."

So on Sunday, Landers joined the protesters outside the church rather than the parishioners inside. "We really love him and respect his opinion," Landers said of Warren. "I need some reassurance that I'm welcome here as a gay American citizen."

Other protests were staged outside Mormon temples or churches in Oakland, Yucca Valley and other cities.

In downtown Los Angeles, 150 protesters congregated in front of the Cathedral of Our Lady of the Angels, chanting, among other things, "What would Jesus say?" The crowd was joined later in the day by protesters who marched from Lincoln Park on the city's Eastside.

Some churches, to be sure, assailed Proposition 8 as discriminatory.

"We will continue to bless same-sex unions here until we can legally celebrate same-sex unions again," the Rev. Ed Bacon told 1,000 congregants during Sunday services at All Saints Episcopal Church in Pasadena, which has blessed same-sex unions for 16 years.

After the service, Bacon and other clergy members held a news conference on the church steps. They were surrounded by gay and lesbian couples, some standing with young children.

"I know these couples. I know their relationships," Bacon said, addressing a phalanx of television cameras. "They should be celebrated, rather than disparaged. . . . In the eyes of God, these people are married."

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-pr...story?track=rss

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

So an elected official is asking the courts to overrule the voters?

I don't think that's right. If this is to be overturned, I strongly feel it should be through another ballot initiative.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

So an elected official is asking the courts to overrule the voters?

I don't think that's right. If this is to be overturned, I strongly feel it should be through another ballot initiative.

Three years ago: (discrimination can't override our constitutional protections)

Judge Richard A. Kramer of San Francisco Superior Court held, in an opinion that will surely be appealed, that "no rational purpose exists for limiting marriage in this state to opposite-sex partners."

While many aspects of history, culture and tradition are properly embedded in the law, Judge Kramer wrote, the prohibition against same-sex marriage is not. "The state's protracted denial of equal protection cannot be justified simply because such constitutional violation has become traditional," he wrote.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/14/national...artner=homepage

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

You're technically correct. All I'm saying is if you want equality for the gheys you have to wage the battle with the voters. Once you have them, you win. Without them this just see-saws back and forth ad infinitum.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

It will probably be overturned again...

You're technically correct. All I'm saying is if you want equality for the gheys you have to wage the battle with the voters. Once you have them, you win. Without them this just see-saws back and forth ad infinitum.

I think this is already happening - Prop 8 passed by a slimmer margin than the previous vote that was overturned by the court.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

It will probably be overturned again...

You're technically correct. All I'm saying is if you want equality for the gheys you have to wage the battle with the voters. Once you have them, you win. Without them this just see-saws back and forth ad infinitum.

I think this is already happening - Prop 8 passed by a slimmer margin than the previous vote that was overturned by the court.

The U.S. Supreme Court will have to decide on this matter and I'm confident that they would regard that any law or attempt to amend a state's constitution, violates a person's fundamental right of equal protection under the law. Hopefully, the court will look into this issue within the next year.

[Mononoke28 135]

Poor people, they've done this twice already and there's always the bigot who can't stand to see other people happy.

Let it rest and give them equal rights like the rest of us.

Diana

Edited November 10, 2008 by Mononoke28

[Niels Bohr 72]

As Arnold puts it, "I'LL BE BACK"

[spookyturtle 9,466]

Arnold is really gay.

[mawilson 2,133]

Poor people, they've done this twice already and there's always the bigot who can't stand to see other people happy.

Let it rest and give them equal rights like the rest of us.

As they say, gays won't be happy until they can be miserable like the rest of us.

[Nagishkaw 510]

Arnold is really gay.