GM reports $2.5B 3Q loss, could run out of cash in 2009

[Donna A 4]

Let 'em fall.

If they can't make a better product than Toyota or Honda, they deserve to fail.

Taxpayers should not be bailing out yet another bunch of rich assho|es who want a fat pension check. Nor should they be bailing out workers from third world countries.

excuse me...but im one of those gm autoworkers and thats my job on the line. they are cutting 1100 jobs from my plant starting in january. i might be one of them. so screw u and ur let them fall theory.

no one in america likes to keep cars very long anyway because everyone wants to show off in new cars so why not build them cheap and disposble since no one keeps them long anyway.

my last gm car lasted me 12 years and was still running strong when i got rid of it...i hardly spent any money on it so tell me again how they are not a good product.

people in general just want an excuse to buy foreign cars without looking like the trader themselves so they just use the excuse gm cars are junk. thats how they justify their buying of foreign products.

[pedroh 21]

Such small mindedness.

All that needs to happen is a shift in the way "they" do business.

Like I said, bring those economical designs/models they sell in Europe here.

Stop asking for bail-outs.

It is not for you to ask.

It is for you to shift your consciousness.

It is still a good time for business, just think "green" instead of continually raping and poisoning Mother Earth.

Ha!

Have at it.

unfortunately.. GM listens too much to the customer.. i read several months before the gas hike.. that most americans didn't care a lot about the prices, and they still wanted gas-guzzler monster trucks and suvs just cuz they liked them.. (specially the I buy a pick up truck even though I don't need it for its intended purpose segment).. so they weren't in a hurry to bring the efficient models from europe.. well.. that's what they get.. give them big-### cars that aren't being bought because of the gas prices..

I think they should have been more careful regarding production.. and now they are investing in new efficient tehcnologies, but it's too late.. and I agree.. if they are not efficient/profitable enough, why does the taxpayer have to deal with it?

Edited November 7, 2008 by pedroh

[Amby 490]

No worries, Nancy Pelosi will bail it out.

$30 billion here, $50 billion there.

I'll start sending her my bills too, she won't even notice.

If she ends up on Faux News being raked over the coals by Billo the Clown for writing checks for $20,000 worth of arugula and soy lattes, we'll know it's you.

[NickD 203]

Let 'em fall.

If they can't make a better product than Toyota or Honda, they deserve to fail.

Taxpayers should not be bailing out yet another bunch of rich assho|es who want a fat pension check. Nor should they be bailing out workers from third world countries.

excuse me...but im one of those gm autoworkers and thats my job on the line. they are cutting 1100 jobs from my plant starting in january. i might be one of them. so screw u and ur let them fall theory.

no one in america likes to keep cars very long anyway because everyone wants to show off in new cars so why not build them cheap and disposble since no one keeps them long anyway.

my last gm car lasted me 12 years and was still running strong when i got rid of it...i hardly spent any money on it so tell me again how they are not a good product.

people in general just want an excuse to buy foreign cars without looking like the trader themselves so they just use the excuse gm cars are junk. thats how they justify their buying of foreign products.

Ha, I actually own and drive three GM vehicles, pleased with them, do have a prime 88 Supra Turbo, but GM doesn't make anything like that, but my wife and dog are imported, they don't make them like that here.

GM was looking for a better battery with the EV1, and still looking for a battery for the Volt, but they haven't figured out in over 200 years, no one has been able to make a good battery. Some use very expensive exotic metals, but highly chemically active, so they eat themselves up for breakfast, lunch, and supper. Also can get quite nasty with the environment and can really get angry with an internal short circuit, burning themselves up and the vehicle with it. If you drive a hybrid the way you are suppose to, to get a gain in fuel economy, would find yourself parked up the guys' ahead of you exhaust pipe. Or the guy behind you will be parked up yours.

And speaking of idiots on the road, would you rather be driving a Yukon or a Geo Metro?

Wisconsin taxpayers have spent millions on the Janesville plant, but GM is moving anyway leaving 4,000 people unemployed, not happy with that.

I can live with the higher cost of gas, but it's killing the airliners, truckers, and automotive manufacturers and they can't seem to do anything about it, so why should I b!tch about it. Bush says he is helpless, but sure doing a good job of teeing off anyone that sells us oil.

[IAMX 3,055]

Let 'em fall.

If they can't make a better product than Toyota or Honda, they deserve to fail.

Taxpayers should not be bailing out yet another bunch of rich assho|es who want a fat pension check. Nor should they be bailing out workers from third world countries.

excuse me...but im one of those gm autoworkers and thats my job on the line. they are cutting 1100 jobs from my plant starting in january. i might be one of them. so screw u and ur let them fall theory.

no one in america likes to keep cars very long anyway because everyone wants to show off in new cars so why not build them cheap and disposble since no one keeps them long anyway.

my last gm car lasted me 12 years and was still running strong when i got rid of it...i hardly spent any money on it so tell me again how they are not a good product.

people in general just want an excuse to buy foreign cars without looking like the trader themselves so they just use the excuse gm cars are junk. thats how they justify their buying of foreign products.

That doesn't explain why the Prius has sold so extremely well, which is.. because you can't argue with 450-600 miles per tank at a measly $30, plus far less frequent maintenance. GM products have sucked, and those Toyota and Honda brand cars (including subsidiaries) are simply superior. Hell, I even had a Saturn, myself, and they are the worst piles of ####### engineering known to man. Ever try replacing a window in any of the GM line of Saturn SL-series cars made after 1990?

If the expectation is I wish for GM to stay alive because some people work there, then no, that makes no sense at all. I would find another job, myself. GM has been, unfortunately, fighting technology, and now finds itself behind. I might have felt bad had they not bowed down to big oil and destroyed the EV1 and progress. In fact, they'd likely be drowning in more money because it pre-empted the Prius. Too bad. Maybe you can get a job at Honda or Toyota.

[Donna A 4]

to get a job at toyota or honda would require moving...selling house is impossible these days. any more ideas?

[IAMX 3,055]

to get a job at toyota or honda would require moving...selling house is impossible these days. any more ideas?

Start a business, like Joe the Plumber.

[pedroh 21]

or tito the.. what the #### was tito? a roofer?

or be like handy manny!

[SpiritAlight 1]

It is disheartening to hear the about personal losses....what with possibility of no more work at the way things have been.

The thing is, is the shift I keep talking about.

The shift to "green" thingies instead of a "whocares" attitude of the products we are making and buying/consuming.

We all knew that it would end one day.

That day is now.

Shift to a new type of business, or a new way of doing the old business.

We will need cars still for a while longer and so why not shift the plants to creating a more environmentally friendly vehicle?

What if the front page of all corporate media started telling/showing the truth; imagine the headline(s):

We are Killing Ourselves with the Poisoning of the Environment and Depleting all Natural Resources

What you can do about it, section A, B, C and D. Yes our entire paper is here to help.

Bahaha!

Oh, yes such an idealist....indeed.

[NickD 203]

Ni-Cad batteries need nickel, and Toyota imports theirs from Canada.

http://www.minesandcommunities.org/article.php?a=940

To learn about the hazards of making hybrid cars, a steep price to pay. Toyota does make these batteries in Japan, retail replacement cost is around $7,000.00, but Toyota as an act of good will as charges as little as $1,800.00. A sealed unit, so not easy to replace just one defective cell, and one defective cell is all it takes to wreck the entire battery. Only 180,000 Prius's have been sold in the USA last year, almost impossible to buy one, but let's talk about the Toyota Land Cruiser or Four Runner for some of the worse fuel economy vehicles in the world. The body rust on these things are a bad joke, their pickup trucks with rusting out are really a bad joke.

I did work for Honda for a couple of years, wanted to hire good American engineers to show them how to make a good car, but was only long enough for them to pick our brains. Japanese are a very racist lot, and as a blue eyed white guy, knew exactly how black people felt in the early south. Screw the Japanese is my motto now, but they are doing a much better job of screwing us.

Have you priced Toyota or Honda parts recently? You really have to bend over. Only ten per cent of the Japanese have permanent corporate jobs, the rest have to eat crumbs off the floor and really hurting now as they are also taking advantage of the cheap labor in China. Don't tell me how great the Japanese are, or their cars.

[SMOKE 1,426]

Auto industry collapse would crush U.S. economy: study

Nicolas Van Praet, Financial Post

Published: Wednesday, November 05, 2008

Scott Olson/Getty Images

A leading think-tank has drawn a doomsday picture for the North American auto industry that shows that if Detroit's automakers shrink further - even fail - the U.S. economy would suffer a crushing blow, losing at least 2.46 million jobs in the first year alone.

In a report released Wednesday, the Center for Automotive Research in Ann Arbor, Mich., outlined what would happen in two separate scenarios if General Motors Corp., Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC were forced to scale back or shut entirely.

If all three Detroit manufacturers were to cease operations, the U.S. economy would lose 2.95 million direct and indirect jobs in the first year. Governments would lose at least US$156.4-billion in taxes over the first three years.

If Detroit cut output and employment by 50% to meet ever-shrinking market share, which would mean contraction by two of the automakers, 2.46 million jobs would be lost initially. Governments would lose US$108-billion in revenue over three years, according to the analysis.

"The circumstances are such that either of these scenarios is possible, and indeed one or the other is probable, within the next 12 months," the non-profit think-tank said.

The report bolsters the case that the government of president-elect Barack Obama needs to act decisively to speed up financial aid to the domestic industry.

Its authors argue the newly-elected government of Prime Minister Stephen Harper will also have to get involved if it wants to preserve Canada's auto sector.

"The cost of a failure on a cash basis is a lot greater than the cost of keeping these guys in the game," CAR chairman David Cole said in an interview. "There is a real high sense of urgency in the middle of this. We think that [lawmakers] will recognize that a failure here is something that is just not good in any way shape or form for the economy."

U.S. auto sales have slid to lows not seen in 25 years, contributing to combined losses totalling US$28.6-billion for GM, Ford and Chrysler in the first half of 2008. The Detroit manufacturers have been hit worst as they struggle to add more small cars and fewer big trucks to their lineups and their financing arms scale back loans and leasing to customers. GMAC Financial Services, GM's auto loans unit, on Wednesday reported a third-quarter loss of US$2.5-billion.

GM's U.S. auto volumes dropped 45% in October. The automaker, burning through more than US$1-billion a month, is in talks to buy Chrysler from its owner, Cerberus Capital Management. Analysts estimate the automaker needs US$10-billion to engineer a merger with Chrysler.

Chrysler U.S. sales fell 35% in October. It is "very likely" the company will file for bankruptcy protection if it does not find a buyer or alliance partner, consultants at AutomotiveCompass LLC said in a recent report.

Shares in GM rose as high as 7% in New York trading Wednesday from Tuesday's close, to $6.12, on speculation by investors that Mr. Obama's administration would push for an expanded loan program for carmakers beyond the US$25-billion already earmarked to help them build more fuel-efficient vehicles. Ford stock rose as much as 3% to $2.23 but shares in both companies retreated by the close.

The president-elect said in a speech last month that aid to car manufacturers should be on a "fast track" and that more funding should be given if required.

"What we need is to make sure that a vital industry like autos... which is such a big part of the overall economy, doesn't lead us into a deeper and harsher downturn," John Snow, chairman of Cerberus, told CNBC. "The collapse of the auto industry at this time would be devastating for a new president."

http://www.financialpost.com/story.html?id=935684

[Amby 490]

or tito the.. what the #### was tito? a roofer?

or be like handy manny!

I think tito was just "the builder"

[Peikko 1,575]

It is disheartening to hear the about personal losses....what with possibility of no more work at the way things have been.

The thing is, is the shift I keep talking about.

The shift to "green" thingies instead of a "whocares" attitude of the products we are making and buying/consuming.

We all knew that it would end one day.

That day is now.

Shift to a new type of business, or a new way of doing the old business.

We will need cars still for a while longer and so why not shift the plants to creating a more environmentally friendly vehicle?

What if the front page of all corporate media started telling/showing the truth; imagine the headline(s):

We are Killing Ourselves with the Poisoning of the Environment and Depleting all Natural Resources

What you can do about it, section A, B, C and D. Yes our entire paper is here to help.

Bahaha!

Oh, yes such an idealist....indeed.

Madame Cleo approves this message.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

[i would run my company responsibly and plan for a rainy day.

Of course then the government would want to take more money away from me.

The idea seems to be, "if you suck, we'll give you money; if you're successful, we'll take it away from you".

Ok, so you and SRVT are have superior knowledge and business management skills than the American auto industry. Maybe the two of you could turn it around? And I have never once stated that I think the gov. should bail out GM. I merely stated that it would have a devasting effect on an already collapsing economy. Those who say ** GM have not given much thought to what will happen. Oh, that's right, run to get a job with Toyota or Honda. Send more money overseas.

[Otto 83]

Oh, that's right, run to get a job with Toyota or Honda. Send more money overseas.

Part of GM's (if not all US automakers) problem is the overseas thing - they don't make cars (for the most part) that the rest of the world wants - relying solely on US sales - when/if this slumps, there's nothing to fall back on.

Take the Ford F150 for example - the number one selling vehicle in the world yet is almost only sold in the US. Imagine if they made a similarly selling vehicle that was truly a 'global' vehicle...