Moving to Russia

[Amby 490]

It means jack $hit - until there is a plan on the table.

...so...when you're walking down the street and you see three guys with guns in their hands and walking toward you, the correct action to take is to wait until they stick the gun in your face and demand your money, before objecting, or taking any action to prevent this from happening.

only paranoid people think the people walking towards them with a gun are actually coming for them

Oh.....silly me. Nevermind.

[Gigli2008 70]

But this relies somewhat on stereotypes. You can't assume that people who make less money don't work hard - otherwise why are teachers and firefighters constantly lobbying the local authority for higher wages?

I think teachers and fightfighers make a lot of money, when benefits are figured in - or overtime in the case of FF - or the fact that school systems are not year-round in the case of teachers.

While its certainly the case that you can't get these things without hard work (or via inheritance - if you're lucky) the fact remains that for a lot of people it doesn't matter how much you bust your a$$ - you may still find it hard to make ends meet.

...so naturally, they're entitled to take the money of those who bust their ### and CAN make ends meet.

I don't know why anyone would believe that taxing those earning higher than $250K a year (to the same rates of the Clinton years) and tax cuts for 95% of working Americans is distributing wealth. This is just right wing rhetoric. I fall in the the 95% population and pay both income and property taxes. The rhetoric here is that people like me (alongside the 95% of working Americans) are those who don't pay taxes. That is completely untrue and I am getting sick and tired of people throwing about rhetoric without digging out for the truth about taxes and the economy.

First of all, EVERYONE who is paying taxes now will continue paying taxes. Some (95%) will experience a minimal tax reduction (of about $1000 a year) while 5% of the population (rich folks) will experience a MINIMAL tax increase (of 3% which is about $1,500 for every $50K earned over the first $250K).

Those who don't pay taxes are those who earn (I think) below $26K a year and those who earn (I think) $37K and have one or more dependent(s). Another thing, the IRS collects Tax witholdings of billions every year and they keep it and invest it before its time to refund it back to the poorer population. So even those who get back 100% tax refunds do lose on interest of the withheld monies.

You have to remember that if these kinds of tax brackets were not carefully considered we would be looking at a more majority poor, like most 2nd and 3rd world countries. If you earned $300K a year for instance only $50K would be taxed at 39% instead of 36%.

I find it hard to believe that anyone earning over $250K a year is overly concerned about a 3% tax increase. Its the rhetoric pushers that are concerned over money they don't have in the first place.

[akdiver 3]

I don't think income should be taxed AT ALL!!!!!

I think only SPENDING should be taxed.

Tax the CONSUMPTION of wealth, not the CREATION of wealth.

[Peikko 1,575]

I mean - if you run up huge credit card debts to fund a lifestyle that is beyond your means its a given that you're going to have to make sacrifices later on in order to pay it back.

So, if I run up my bills, it's OK if I go rob a bank to get the money to pay it back? You know, sort of take an involuntary "donation" from everyone else.

The national deficit belongs to everyone. There's no way around that.

...and the attitude also seems to me that my money belongs to everyone too.

Certainly gives me an incentive to earn less money and contribute less to the economy. Why bust my ### going to school, racking up student loans, and getting a good job with good benefits, when I can sit on my ###, get a crappy job, and live off the welfare state?

You go ahead and try it, and see how long you enjoy your new existance. I don't know why anyone would willingly trade a decent job for a crappy job and welfare - I know I wouldn't no matter if I do get to pay more taxes. There is absolutely no comparison.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

It means jack $hit - until there is a plan on the table.

...so...when you're walking down the street and you see three guys with guns in their hands and walking toward you, the correct action to take is to wait until they stick the gun in your face and demand your money, before objecting, or taking any action to prevent this from happening.

Please at least stop with the silly analogies, it just makes for more hysteria.

You're assuming an inevitability from this article that simply doesn't exist from what's been presented.

[Gigli2008 70]

I don't think income should be taxed AT ALL!!!!!

I think only SPENDING should be taxed.

Tax the CONSUMPTION of wealth, not the CREATION of wealth.

You want a clean society but don't want to take part in making it so. You want a first world government but don't want to pay those you elect into office. You want the Police, Ambulance and Firemen to show up at your door within 3 minutes of dialing 911 but don't care that they should be well compensated.

I ask you my fellow American. What is your role in this society.

How about you refund the IRS the last Stimulus check you received. And when the next one arrives, just say THANKS but NO THANKS.

[mawilson 2,133]

How can we pay back that tremendous deficit without raising taxes....?

Reduce spending?

[mawilson 2,133]

so you think it's only gonna be 4%, or 10k if you make 250 a year? i have a watch to sell you too.

It's going to be $0 if you make $250k a year. Supposedly.

It'll be a $10k increase if you make $500k a year. Supposedly.

$10k = ($500k - $250k) taxed at 4%

[Gigli2008 70]

How can we pay back that tremendous deficit without raising taxes....?

Reduce spending?

In Iraq for starters.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

How can we pay back that tremendous deficit without raising taxes....?

Reduce spending?

That too.

[akdiver 3]

You want a clean society but don't want to take part in making it so. You want a first world government but don't want to pay those you elect into office. You want the Police, Ambulance and Firemen to show up at your door within 3 minutes of dialing 911 but don't care that they should be well compensated.

Wow...you make a lot of assumptions about what I want (:

[Peikko 1,575]

So many people on this board in the top 5% of income earners. We are so lucky!

[Gigli2008 70]

You want a clean society but don't want to take part in making it so. You want a first world government but don't want to pay those you elect into office. You want the Police, Ambulance and Firemen to show up at your door within 3 minutes of dialing 911 but don't care that they should be well compensated.

Wow...you make a lot of assumptions about what I want (:

I saw that coming. What do you think your taxes are used for if not to form government and maintain government and it's works?

So many people on this board in the top 5% of income earners. We are so lucky!

I highly doubt it. Maybe we should take a poll.

[akdiver 3]

I saw that coming. What do you think your taxes are used for if not to form government and maintain government and it's works?

Well, it's all about how one defines government and its works, isn't it?

I do not view social programs as a fundamental aspect of government.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Its pretty weird if you ask me. Plumber joe was on TV the other night decrying socialism and how unpatriotic obama is.

Yet what exactly is his complaint? He doesn't make the sort of income to be impacted by the tax increases that obama has proposed in the campaign. Its almost as though he equates any sort of tax increase with having his dreams stolen.

Not unlike some of the arguments tossed out about healthcare reform - the idea of choice that's a relative illusion to anyone who isn't fantastically rich and that if everyone can have it that there's no reason to strive for anything.

Joe McCarthy sure did a number on this country's collective psychology..