I-864

[OfWolfAndMan 0]

Hi everyone. My wife filed an I-130 petition for me at the US Consulate in Amsterdam, Netherlands. I have my interview and medical examination within the next 3 weeks.

We have a question regarding form I-864. We filed joint taxes for 05, 06 and 07 in August this year. For 06 and 07 the income listed is my income from NL. My wife did not work here during our stay here. For 05 it also shows my wife's US income which greatly exceeds the poverty guidelines as well.

Is it necessary for me to fill in a separate form I-864 in addition to my wife's I-864?

She now has a job in the US with an income that exceeds the poverty guidelines. However, as mentioned above, the income on our joint tax return is my income in NL and not continuing in the US.

We've kind of started to second guess what we're doing so any light anyone could shed on this would be greatly appreciated.

We have a letter from her employer and paystubs since she started as well as a letter from herself stating she did not work during her/our stay in NL.

Anything else we need? We don't want to rely on others to meet the requirements.

Also, what does she put under "current annual income" on the I-864 if she started working in the US in July of this year?

[YuAndDan 153]

Only the person who is SPONSORING the immigrant provides I-864, that is the US citizen petitioner, and they are required to have US Domicile, Joint sponsors and members of household can provide an I-864 or I-864A ONLY if they are US Domiciled.

You CANNOT provide an I-864 as beneficiary because you DO NOT YET have US Domicile.

Good info about I-864 and it's US domicile requirements.

http://travel.state.gov/pdf/I-864GenInfo-FAQ-Final.pdf

[OfWolfAndMan 0]

Okay, so her using the numbers on the 07 return, which are my income over here from last year are sufficient without me filling in a seperate I-864 (obviously since I'm not living in the US yet)?

We just want to make sure that her using my income from over here doesn't result in a problem, even though it is a joint tax return.

Thank you for your help!

:insecure:

[YuAndDan 153]

Okay, so her using the numbers on the 07 return, which are my income over here from last year are sufficient without me filling in a seperate I-864 (obviously since I'm not living in the US yet)?

We just want to make sure that her using my income from over here doesn't result in a problem, even though it is a joint tax return.

Thank you for your help!

:insecure:

Keep in mind they are more interested in current and future income for the Affidavit of support, they will want evidence that income will continue AFTER arrival to the USA, past income only shows a pattern, but does not indicate that it will continue. They may want evidence of a job in the USA that will provide support, or assets that are 3 times the required income level that are in the USA.

Having a Joint sponsor in the USA may be a good idea, unless your US Citizen spouse is already in the USA, and has a job that will be sufficient to provide support.

[OfWolfAndMan 0]

Okay, so her using the numbers on the 07 return, which are my income over here from last year are sufficient without me filling in a seperate I-864 (obviously since I'm not living in the US yet)?

We just want to make sure that her using my income from over here doesn't result in a problem, even though it is a joint tax return.

Thank you for your help!

:insecure:

Keep in mind they are more interested in current and future income for the Affidavit of support, they will want evidence that income will continue AFTER arrival to the USA, past income only shows a pattern, but does not indicate that it will continue. They may want evidence of a job in the USA that will provide support, or assets that are 3 times the required income level that are in the USA.

Having a Joint sponsor in the USA may be a good idea, unless your US Citizen spouse is already in the USA, and has a job that will be sufficient to provide support.

That's the case.

[trailmix 77]

Hi,

If I am understanding you - you filed joint returns and are going to include your earnings on the I-864, even though you are the beneficiary?

If so, that is not correct, you need to separate your income from your wifes and state only her income.

You state your income will not 'continue from the same source' once you arrive in the U.S. - so it cannot be counted (if it was you could).

I-864 - page 2:

Can the Intending Immigrant Help Me Meet the Income Requirements?

If certain conditions are met, the intending immigrant's income can help you meet the income requirement. If the intending immigrant is your spouse, his or her income can be included if it will continue from the same source after he or she obtains lawful permanent resident status.

So, you will need to state her U.S. income (alone) for 05 and her 06 and 07 income will be stated as zero.

While they do look at past years to ascertain whether or not the sponsor will be able to support the beneficiary, the fact that your wife did have income in 05 and that they only reason she had zero income in 06 and 07 is that she was overseas - it shouldn't really be a problem.

You mention she has pay stubs and a letter of employment etc from her current job, and that her pay now exceeds 125% of the poverty guidelines. This should be sufficient.

As for the 'current annual income' item - this would be your wife's current expected annual income, although she has not worked there a year, just state what her annual income will be.

Edited October 21, 2008 by trailmix

[OfWolfAndMan 0]

Okay, thanks a lot.

I guess the best thing for her to do is call the Consulate and ask them about the specifics as I don't have the tax returns in my posession.

A lady at the Consulate actually did tell me she could list our joint income (meaning basically my entire income in NL) for 07 and 06. This is really confusing.

[trailmix 77]

Okay, thanks a lot.

I guess the best thing for her to do is call the Consulate and ask them about the specifics as I don't have the tax returns in my posession.

A lady at the Consulate actually did tell me she could list our joint income (meaning basically my entire income in NL) for 07 and 06. This is really confusing.

Unless the woman at the consulate was confused and thought that you were the sponsor?

We both lived in Canada when we filed (me the sponsor). We didn't DCF - but when filling out the I-864 the NVC requested that I state my Canadian income - which I did, converted to U.S. dollars.

There was never any mention of including my Husband's income. Unless your consulate is completely different from any other I have read about - the woman at the consulate is wrong.

[OfWolfAndMan 0]

No, she even said it was positive that we declared my income from NL during our stay here on our US tax returns for 06 and 07. She said that if my income already met the poverty guidelines it would cover it.

[trailmix 77]

No, she even said it was positive that we declared my income from NL during our stay here on our US tax returns for 06 and 07. She said that if my income already met the poverty guidelines it would cover it.

What I would recommend is that you perhaps email the consulate and see if you don't get a different answer - I would be very concerned that her answer is not correct and you will show up for the interview and be denied until you get an additional sponsor.

I would also recommend that you read the instruction on the I-864, so you understand it all yourself and are quite comfortable with it. Everything she has told you is expressly different in the instructions for the I-864 and the Field Manual.

(4) Use of Intending Immigrant’s Income . If the sponsor does not meet the income requirement on the basis of his or her own income and/or assets, the sponsor may also count the intending immigrant’s income if (1)(a) the intending immigrant is either the sponsor’s spouse or b. has the same principal residence as the sponsor, and (2) the preponderance of the evidence shows that the intending immigrant’s income results from the intending immigrant’s lawful employment in the United States or from some other lawful source that will continue to be available to the intending immigrant after he or she acquires permanent resident status. The prospect of employment in the United States that has not yet actually begun does not count toward meeting this requirement.

I do wish you luck with this

[OfWolfAndMan 0]

Basically, just being the spouse is not enough in order for my income to be counted as well, since my income won't continue in the US (?). The lady at the Consulate basically said that my income could be used because I was the spouse and it was a joint filing. She mentioned nothing about the fact that it should continue in the US or anything like that.

[OfWolfAndMan 0]

I've been in touch with the Consulate and they told me the following;

My wife fills in the I-864, but uses our 2005 tax return as the most recent one as she did not work in 2006 and 2007, when she was living here in NL and did not earn an income here (stay-at-home mom). We weren't even obligated to file returns for those particular years as the income we reported to IRS was my income here in NL when I had already lost my previous US resident status. The numbers reported on our 2006 and 2007 returns are my income from NL and basically list her as the dependent (they are filed under our Dutch address).

The consular employee said that in addition to the 2005 return (my wife worked in the US through december of that year) along with a letter from her current employer and paystubs should be sufficient to meet the requirements.

One question we're still not sure about; she started her new job in mid July of this year. What # does she put on the I-864 at question 23;

My current individual annual income is:

......

Is it a problem if she lists her annual salary as if she has already worked there for the entire year? She only started in mid July and her monthly salary is roughly $5500. If she multiplies that number times 12, which would make her annual income roughly $66,000 even though she started in July, could this result in a problem at the interview or should she take the income she has earned since mid July through December of this year?

The other question we have is about the letter of employement. It does not state that it is a permanent position or that it's of indefinte duration. It lists date employment began, amount of hours per month, position and monthly salary. Would this be sufficient?

Thanks for your patience and expertise!

[Penguin_ie 5,993]

I think what you have in terms of documentation, including the employment letter, is plenty- I am even surprised the CO said to use the 2005 return, cosnidering it is pretty irrelevant by now. In our case, they didn't even ask for the documentation of the income, just accepted form.

The annual income is current income x12 because it is looking at the USC's income going forward and seeing if she makes enough to support you when you get there- so yes, put 66'000 in there. The letter and form she filled in on recent jobs will explain that she only started the job recently.

[trailmix 77]

One question we're still not sure about; she started her new job in mid July of this year. What # does she put on the I-864 at question 23;

My current individual annual income is:

......

Is it a problem if she lists her annual salary as if she has already worked there for the entire year? She only started in mid July and her monthly salary is roughly $5500. If she multiplies that number times 12, which would make her annual income roughly $66,000 even though she started in July, could this result in a problem at the interview or should she take the income she has earned since mid July through December of this year?

As I mentioned earlier, you would list this as the $66,000. They are asking you what her current annual salary is - not what it has been. Regardless of how long a person has been working at a position, when asked for their current annual salary it is the yearly amount.

The other question we have is about the letter of employement. It does not state that it is a permanent position or that it's of indefinte duration. It lists date employment began, amount of hours per month, position and monthly salary. Would this be sufficient?

No one can answer this one for you. The letter does not meet the guidelines. Does this mean it won't be accepted? Maybe yes, maybe no, it's up to the CO at the interview.

[YuAndDan 153]

I've been in touch with the Consulate and they told me the following;

My wife fills in the I-864, but uses our 2005 tax return as the most recent one as she did not work in 2006 and 2007, when she was living here in NL and did not earn an income here (stay-at-home mom). We weren't even obligated to file returns for those particular years as the income we reported to IRS was my income here in NL when I had already lost my previous US resident status. The numbers reported on our 2006 and 2007 returns are my income from NL and basically list her as the dependent (they are filed under our Dutch address).

The consular employee said that in addition to the 2005 return (my wife worked in the US through december of that year) along with a letter from her current employer and paystubs should be sufficient to meet the requirements.

One question we're still not sure about; she started her new job in mid July of this year. What # does she put on the I-864 at question 23;

My current individual annual income is:

......

Is it a problem if she lists her annual salary as if she has already worked there for the entire year? She only started in mid July and her monthly salary is roughly $5500. If she multiplies that number times 12, which would make her annual income roughly $66,000 even though she started in July, could this result in a problem at the interview or should she take the income she has earned since mid July through December of this year?

The other question we have is about the letter of employement. It does not state that it is a permanent position or that it's of indefinte duration. It lists date employment began, amount of hours per month, position and monthly salary. Would this be sufficient?

Thanks for your patience and expertise!

This one of those wait and see what the interviewing officer has to say about the attached evidence for the I-864, if it is convincing enough that income will continue, they probably will accept it.

US embassy in the Netherlands is NOT as harsh as other consulates like China or Philippines.