American women vs Arab women raising children

[palilover 1]

S and S,

I hope you got something out of this thread, to help you deal with this woman at your work. Per the norm, it somehow turned into a little zoo lol

Good luck in however you decide to handle it.

Lisa

Thanks Lisa, I think I got some good ideas and support here. Also, if nothing else, it felt good to get the frustration out with people who have an idea of what I am talking about and how it feels. I am one of those people that tries to see the good in all people. Its not to say I'm perfect and don't slip, but I honestly try. If I hear an arab bash on America then I defend it. For instance, when I was visiting some of my husband's cousins the conversation turned to politics and the US. Of course they are Iraqi and living as refugees just trying to survive so I really understand they aren't going to be very happy. Yet I took me "okay" arabic and told them all about our health care issues here in the US. By the end of the conversation they were feeling sorry for American's! lol, just telling them how much it costs to have a baby without insurance here blew their minds.

On another note, I get tired of hearing people bash on the Iraqi people and say Americans would never act like them in time of war or disaster. Iraqis are doing the best they can while living in constant violence, limited electricity and contaminated water. Even going to work is taking your life into your hands and thousands have died from doing that alone. Then I point out how things turned in New Orleans after Katrina. Lawlessness can happen anywhere under the right circumstances and it is not on us to judge until we live through it. Just like those kids we see begging on the streets over in the middle east, take a look at our past and during the depression. Parents were doing the same thing with their kids. We just live better right now so you rarely see it (or at least for the moment).

I do believe Americans are the most giving and helpful (on the whole). We are raised with the idea of helping others and giving from the time we can walk and talk. It isn't even just a "Christian" thing. I've had athiest friends help me out in a time of need. In fact, if you look at some mosques around the US, they are helping out with habitat for humanity, health clinics, food drives, etc. I like to think "helping" is an American thing and has little to do with religion. Many churches will certainly help you, but there are some that don't really help so much. Also, I can't tell you how many Iraqis have done their best to help me while trying to get my husband here. They give me the best advice they can, I have been given free food, some of the women (including the Iraqi woman I mentioned before) has been a shoulder to cry on when I got frustrated with waiting for my husband. I believe there is good everywhere if you just look for it. Yet sometimes we do have to face the bad as that was the case in my original post for this thread. It isn't going to turn me against all the other arabs out there. I think we have to judge everyone on an individual basis and only was we are well informed.

You know I've learned to love Iraqis!!!! The first Muslim I ever talked to who made what I consideree to be real dawah-meaning not forced and he was just being himself and he did not even discuss Islam with me at all. He was just naturally a nice guy and he treated me ewll and I thougth to myself "He is not like the Muslims on tv". Of course the more I got into Islam and got around them all, I learned there really are Muslims like on tv:) But this guy he was so nice. We talked at the beginning of the Iraq war online as he was still in baghdad. But then he came up missing for 7 months. Even though there was no love thing or anything like that going on between us, I learned to care about someone who was not from my culture...in a platonical way of course. I was relieved to know he resurfaced in another country!!!

Did your husband ever have to wrok in a "danger znoe"? Or how do people deal with it? Like you have to go to work, but then if you go to work, you risk being shot. And those people are persistent when they really wanna shoot someone! I need to talk to more women in war zones actually cuz I have to get used that that idea of being shot:(

My husband lived in Baghdad for the first few years of the war, but he only mentions small things here and there. Honestly, you can tell it bothers him to talk about it. He has mentioned a couple things like you get used to passing by dead bodies on the street right after an explosion or shooting. Eventually and hopefully, the family will collect the body so not much you can do. He talked about how numb you get to it all. For instance he told me about seeing one store owner that calmly cleaned someone's brains off his store sign shortly after an explosion. Cleaning such things off your store front becomes a regular thing you don't think about much after awhile. My husband says you just have to deal with it because it happens over and over. Freaking out or going crazy isn't going to help you as you have to life your life somehow. You try to be cautious and careful and limit your exposure to danger, but sitting in your house all the time for years gets old so sometimes you just risk it to get out.

It's unfortunate and sad to think about someone "getting used to" cleaning brains off of store signs.

I don't know how those people do it though really. The men who go out and the women who kiss theirh usbands good bye eacfh day not knowing if they will see them again.

[Simply_Uno 1]

UNO and Charles- thats my faith!! by no means u have to believe it nor believe in it loool

yep, whatchoosed

bwaahhaaaaa, I was waiting for that also...roflmao

UNO

[palilover 1]

UNO and Charles- thats my faith!! by no means u have to believe it nor believe in it loool

yep, whatchoosed

bwaahhaaaaa, I was waiting for that also...roflmao

UNO

never takes long for someone to bite!

[HLM 1]

UNO and Charles- thats my faith!! by no means u have to believe it nor believe in it loool

yep, whatchoosed

bwaahhaaaaa, I was waiting for that also...roflmao

UNO

never takes long for someone to bite!

The thing is .... i dont know whats funny! but i get what kind of person she is!

Peace

[Aymsgirl 0]

UNO and Charles- thats my faith!! by no means u have to believe it nor believe in it loool

yep, whatchoosed

bwaahhaaaaa, I was waiting for that also...roflmao

UNO

never takes long for someone to bite!

The thing is .... i dont know whats funny! but i get what kind of person she is!

Peace

HLM....just ignore it....its not worth it.

[ginny20 0]

I have to agree with you and most likely would have blown up at her too. I think its hysterical how someone can say these things and have had hardly any contact w/ an American family (other than the one their son/daughter married into) and then they pass judgment. Perhaps she watched it in a movie...typically any ignorant comment I have been confronted w/ by others not raised here has come from their watching movies, etc.

I have NEVER let our babies cry and wasn't raised this way by my family either. I also babysat as you did and the instructions I received from the family I worked for was to not let their son cry. The funny thing is what I have viewed overseas is the opposite of what she has said. I have seen children running around in the streets much younger than I'd care to admit without parent supervision.

IMHO, I think Americans spoil their children too much and we over do it with the picking them up, over feeding them, over stimulating, etc. The actual opposite of what she claimed was the American way.

I was just at a family's house in rural Morocco who has a newborn and his grandmother was telling me that her and her daughter believe it is not good to pick up the baby very often, because he will become spoiled. In fact they swaddle him (which I think is a great idea) and leave him by himself on the floor or bed most of the day. They did tell me that babies don't cry until they are six months old (because of swaddling) and were surprised that they do in the US! Anyways--just goes to show that parents in the 'Arab world' also have all different kinds of ideas about how the should raise their children and there are no set rules. I think most parents most places in the world are pretty good--we're wired instinctively to empathize with our kids and understand what they need--and then there are always the few who are unfortunately too consumed with their own pathology to be able to do so!

[SaadBell 0]

My husband lived in Baghdad for the first few years of the war, but he only mentions small things here and there. Honestly, you can tell it bothers him to talk about it. He has mentioned a couple things like you get used to passing by dead bodies on the street right after an explosion or shooting. Eventually and hopefully, the family will collect the body so not much you can do. He talked about how numb you get to it all. For instance he told me about seeing one store owner that calmly cleaned someone's brains off his store sign shortly after an explosion. Cleaning such things off your store front becomes a regular thing you don't think about much after awhile. My husband says you just have to deal with it because it happens over and over. Freaking out or going crazy isn't going to help you as you have to life your life somehow. You try to be cautious and careful and limit your exposure to danger, but sitting in your house all the time for years gets old so sometimes you just risk it to get out.

Sounds like living in south central in the 70's and 80's, talk about running for your life, and not crossing certain lines, and going into different gang lands. Hearing gun shots, police in the air, oh what childhood memories.

[palilover 1]

My husband lived in Baghdad for the first few years of the war, but he only mentions small things here and there. Honestly, you can tell it bothers him to talk about it. He has mentioned a couple things like you get used to passing by dead bodies on the street right after an explosion or shooting. Eventually and hopefully, the family will collect the body so not much you can do. He talked about how numb you get to it all. For instance he told me about seeing one store owner that calmly cleaned someone's brains off his store sign shortly after an explosion. Cleaning such things off your store front becomes a regular thing you don't think about much after awhile. My husband says you just have to deal with it because it happens over and over. Freaking out or going crazy isn't going to help you as you have to life your life somehow. You try to be cautious and careful and limit your exposure to danger, but sitting in your house all the time for years gets old so sometimes you just risk it to get out.

Sounds like living in south central in the 70's and 80's, talk about running for your life, and not crossing certain lines, and going into different gang lands. Hearing gun shots, police in the air, oh what childhood memories.

south central what?

[doodlebugg 10]

UNO and Charles- thats my faith!! by no means u have to believe it nor believe in it loool

yep, whatchoosed

bwaahhaaaaa, I was waiting for that also...roflmao

UNO

never takes long for someone to bite!

The thing is .... i dont know whats funny! but i get what kind of person she is!

Peace

HLM....just ignore it....its not worth it.

[Simply_Uno 1]

UNO and Charles- thats my faith!! by no means u have to believe it nor believe in it loool

yep, whatchoosed

bwaahhaaaaa, I was waiting for that also...roflmao

UNO

never takes long for someone to bite!

The thing is .... i dont know whats funny! but i get what kind of person she is!

Peace

I was laughing becuz I KNEW/anticipated that sort of response.

when it happened, I LAUGHED. no harm/no foul...geesh

UNO and Charles- thats my faith!! by no means u have to believe it nor believe in it loool

yep, whatchoosed

bwaahhaaaaa, I was waiting for that also...roflmao

UNO

never takes long for someone to bite!

The thing is .... i dont know whats funny! but i get what kind of person she is!

Peace

HLM....just ignore it....

its not worth it.

not worth what, YOU not understanding my humor????

Edited October 9, 2008 by UNO...

[sereia 0]

My husband lived in Baghdad for the first few years of the war, but he only mentions small things here and there. Honestly, you can tell it bothers him to talk about it. He has mentioned a couple things like you get used to passing by dead bodies on the street right after an explosion or shooting. Eventually and hopefully, the family will collect the body so not much you can do. He talked about how numb you get to it all. For instance he told me about seeing one store owner that calmly cleaned someone's brains off his store sign shortly after an explosion. Cleaning such things off your store front becomes a regular thing you don't think about much after awhile. My husband says you just have to deal with it because it happens over and over. Freaking out or going crazy isn't going to help you as you have to life your life somehow. You try to be cautious and careful and limit your exposure to danger, but sitting in your house all the time for years gets old so sometimes you just risk it to get out.

Sounds like living in south central in the 70's and 80's, talk about running for your life, and not crossing certain lines, and going into different gang lands. Hearing gun shots, police in the air, oh what childhood memories.

south central what?

Los Angeles.

[Sandrila 1]

with 10 pages of responses i see you touched a nerve and certainly something everyone has their own views about

me, i have 3 children, 2 of whom have become very difficult to tolerate and discipline, it doesnt get any easier as they grow, and only worse because once you have lost control, it is very hard to regain it

i feel that if i had had an involved serious father such as my current husband the children may have been a lot more respectful and fearful of their parents.

i dont think children should be beat but from a young age you need to let them know what is expected and tolerated

being their "friend" as often times we see here in US is not the best approach, especially living in the society these kids are growing up in now a days.

when i tell my husband of the things i have endured with these children and just their language alone he is shocked and when he advises me on what to do, i am amazed at the respect I have gotten even when i have had to be HARD on them

I was definitely a young mother with a husband, at the time, who was very laxadasical and whifty

not at all on the same page as me, but unfortunately it took years to come to that realization

anyhow i have seen the children in other countries, including morocco and india and I was stunned by their impeccable behavior, respect and proper place ....i am sorry maybe a little old fashioned but whatever they are doing over there, works..not to say they are all CORRECT but as earlier stated, not every one AMERICAN parent or MOROCCAN OR MUSLIM OR WHATEVER parent is the same

Edited October 9, 2008 by sandrila

[palilover 1]

Firstly, let me say that I don't agree with kids being talked down to. I believe that if you want them to grow up responsibily, you must treat them with responsibility and while letting them be kids, still give them responsibility to grow so they learn things at an early age so when they are older, they can will hopefully be better equipped to handle things. I don't know if I explained that right or not.

What I've seen from arabs is that the kids sit with the adults and act as if they are the adults. They talk back to their parents if they get out of line and if they try to say what goes where and how. They actually have the nerve to talk down to adults as if they own the place! I've seen this with Palestinian neighbors and my sister in law's son who acts like he is the man of the house since his father left the family. (it does not help that teh sister in law cannot do anything without him holding her hand)

If I was to EVER talk to my family or their friends/other adult family members in that maner, I would have been beat for sure and certainly sent to my room with no furtehr interuptions from me for the remainder of the time. And when teh guests/otehr family members have left the house, all hell with break loose with my parents and I. While I do not condone beating or anything like htat, I think that kids should be taught to respect older people, especially relatives, and not talk down to them as if they are nothing AND CERTAINLY NOT TALK DOWN TO THEM BECAUES THEY ARE WOMEN!!! That reminds me more of the TALIBAN!!!!!

But yet, it is the arabs who brag that they have so much respect for elders? HAHA

[S and S 12]

My husband lived in Baghdad for the first few years of the war, but he only mentions small things here and there. Honestly, you can tell it bothers him to talk about it. He has mentioned a couple things like you get used to passing by dead bodies on the street right after an explosion or shooting. Eventually and hopefully, the family will collect the body so not much you can do. He talked about how numb you get to it all. For instance he told me about seeing one store owner that calmly cleaned someone's brains off his store sign shortly after an explosion. Cleaning such things off your store front becomes a regular thing you don't think about much after awhile. My husband says you just have to deal with it because it happens over and over. Freaking out or going crazy isn't going to help you as you have to life your life somehow. You try to be cautious and careful and limit your exposure to danger, but sitting in your house all the time for years gets old so sometimes you just risk it to get out.

Sounds like living in south central in the 70's and 80's, talk about running for your life, and not crossing certain lines, and going into different gang lands. Hearing gun shots, police in the air, oh what childhood memories.

Minus the suicide bombers, car bombs, mortors, rockets, military checkpoints, militia checkpoints, etc.

[palilover 1]

My husband lived in Baghdad for the first few years of the war, but he only mentions small things here and there. Honestly, you can tell it bothers him to talk about it. He has mentioned a couple things like you get used to passing by dead bodies on the street right after an explosion or shooting. Eventually and hopefully, the family will collect the body so not much you can do. He talked about how numb you get to it all. For instance he told me about seeing one store owner that calmly cleaned someone's brains off his store sign shortly after an explosion. Cleaning such things off your store front becomes a regular thing you don't think about much after awhile. My husband says you just have to deal with it because it happens over and over. Freaking out or going crazy isn't going to help you as you have to life your life somehow. You try to be cautious and careful and limit your exposure to danger, but sitting in your house all the time for years gets old so sometimes you just risk it to get out.

Sounds like living in south central in the 70's and 80's, talk about running for your life, and not crossing certain lines, and going into different gang lands. Hearing gun shots, police in the air, oh what childhood memories.

Minus the suicide bombers, car bombs, mortors, rockets, military checkpoints, militia checkpoints, etc.

um...yeah. Even though we do have issues in this country, it is nothing like what they face over there. When I was in Palestine during a curfew where there was shooting outside, my sister in law over there asked me if we had problems in America. I was kinda dumbfounded as to what to say. Clearly it was not like what they experience, but for some odd reason I did not want to just blurt out "No your the only one who goes through that". You know, kinda like when you are over here and you are facing a problem you wanna feel like someone else has the same problem as you right? I don't know if I explained that properly. In fact, I do not remember what I said in response to her question. I was in total shock she asked it really. I dont know why.

What makes me mad too is how people who have nevert been in that environment bllindly judge. And yes, I used to be one of them before i met that iraqi guy and discovered that hey, these people have hopes and families and dreams like we do in America. There are great people there and why are they suffering becaues of corrupt government, ignorant people, people who want to kill for greed, money, whatever. Or worese in some areas, why are they dying because a certain few feel that their Islam is superior to that of the rest ? People's ignorance of the region when they only read books or news but have not actually seen what people go through (talking about civilians, not working in the Green Zone with the embassy) makes me mad.