Financial Bailout Agreement Reached

[HAL 9000 96]

You can act as an emissary to represent us. Think about it.

I'm IN!

But seriously, McCain can get back on trail again now, no?

yeah that was really worth it for a couple of hours work.

All that drama and looks like work got done without him.

[kaydee457 13]

You can act as an emissary to represent us. Think about it.

I'm IN!

But seriously, McCain can get back on trail again now, no?

yeah that was really worth it for a couple of hours work.

All that drama and looks like work got done without him.

The deal's not a "done deal" yet.....The empty suit, uh, that would be Obama is going to make a speech (what a surprise) after the meeting in the WH....

Obvoiusly, he'll be grandstanding.

[HAL 9000 96]

You can act as an emissary to represent us. Think about it.

I'm IN!

But seriously, McCain can get back on trail again now, no?

yeah that was really worth it for a couple of hours work.

All that drama and looks like work got done without him.

The deal's not a "done deal" yet.....The empty suit, uh, that would be Obama is going to make a speech (what a surprise) after the meeting in the WH....

Obvoiusly, he'll be grandstanding.

Was that grandstanding as in trying to play politics with the debates without actually trying to go to the first one?

[kaydee457 13]

You can act as an emissary to represent us. Think about it.

I'm IN!

But seriously, McCain can get back on trail again now, no?

yeah that was really worth it for a couple of hours work.

All that drama and looks like work got done without him.

The deal's not a "done deal" yet.....The empty suit, uh, that would be Obama is going to make a speech (what a surprise) after the meeting in the WH....

Obvoiusly, he'll be grandstanding.

Was that grandstanding as in trying to play politics with the debates without actually trying to go to the first one?

Um, Bill Clinton has come out defending McCain's decison to put the gloves down, delay the debates and go back to Washington and put America first in a time of crisis in a bipartisan way.....

Bill, whom I voted for BTW, is the defacto senior Democrat is he not?

John McCain's always behaved this way, and Bill knows this. Obama, having said that if they need him they can find him will likely pay for giving the appearance of having no interest in a national crisis.......

[HAL 9000 96]

You can act as an emissary to represent us. Think about it.

I'm IN!

But seriously, McCain can get back on trail again now, no?

yeah that was really worth it for a couple of hours work.

All that drama and looks like work got done without him.

The deal's not a "done deal" yet.....The empty suit, uh, that would be Obama is going to make a speech (what a surprise) after the meeting in the WH....

Obvoiusly, he'll be grandstanding.

Was that grandstanding as in trying to play politics with the debates without actually trying to go to the first one?

Um, Bill Clinton has come out defending McCain's decison to put the gloves down, delay the debates and go back to Washington and put America first in a time of crisis in a bipartisan way.....

Bill, whom I voted for BTW, is the defacto senior Democrat is he not?

John McCain's always behaved this way, and Bill knows this. Obama, having said that if they need him they can find him will likely pay for giving the appearance of having no interest in a national crisis.......

Like inner city blacks rioting in the streets from city to city if Obama loses in November, right?

Seriously- if any political capital has been lost (hardly gained) its not exactly on Obama's side of the fence.

[kaydee457 13]

You can act as an emissary to represent us. Think about it.

I'm IN!

But seriously, McCain can get back on trail again now, no?

yeah that was really worth it for a couple of hours work.

All that drama and looks like work got done without him.

The deal's not a "done deal" yet.....The empty suit, uh, that would be Obama is going to make a speech (what a surprise) after the meeting in the WH....

Obvoiusly, he'll be grandstanding.

Was that grandstanding as in trying to play politics with the debates without actually trying to go to the first one?

Um, Bill Clinton has come out defending McCain's decison to put the gloves down, delay the debates and go back to Washington and put America first in a time of crisis in a bipartisan way.....

Bill, whom I voted for BTW, is the defacto senior Democrat is he not?

John McCain's always behaved this way, and Bill knows this. Obama, having said that if they need him they can find him will likely pay for giving the appearance of having no interest in a national crisis.......

Like inner city blacks rioting in the streets from city to city if Obama loses in November, right?

Seriously- if any political capital has been lost (hardly gained) its not exactly on Obama's side of the fence.

Well, I'm a lot older than you are and you've never seen riots, I have.....

Seriously, the political capital loss is on the Obama side.....He's coming off lokking like a person that's simply disinterested. I do agree with him though, there's not much for a novice freshman Senator to do in Washington, and subsequently not much of a chance his input would be respected or solicited.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

The latest from my man at the SEC (well, he's the former chief accountant):

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

Maven - what is your 2 cents on the bailout? (I wanted to ask in UK offtopic but didn't want to bring the tone down)

[HAL 9000 96]

You can act as an emissary to represent us. Think about it.

I'm IN!

But seriously, McCain can get back on trail again now, no?

yeah that was really worth it for a couple of hours work.

All that drama and looks like work got done without him.

The deal's not a "done deal" yet.....The empty suit, uh, that would be Obama is going to make a speech (what a surprise) after the meeting in the WH....

Obvoiusly, he'll be grandstanding.

Was that grandstanding as in trying to play politics with the debates without actually trying to go to the first one?

Um, Bill Clinton has come out defending McCain's decison to put the gloves down, delay the debates and go back to Washington and put America first in a time of crisis in a bipartisan way.....

Bill, whom I voted for BTW, is the defacto senior Democrat is he not?

John McCain's always behaved this way, and Bill knows this. Obama, having said that if they need him they can find him will likely pay for giving the appearance of having no interest in a national crisis.......

Like inner city blacks rioting in the streets from city to city if Obama loses in November, right?

Seriously- if any political capital has been lost (hardly gained) its not exactly on Obama's side of the fence.

Well, I'm a lot older than you are and you've never seen riots, I have.....

Seriously, the political capital loss is on the Obama side.....He's coming off lokking like a person that's simply disinterested. I do agree with him though, there's not much for a novice freshman Senator to do in Washington, and subsequently not much of a chance his input would be respected or solicited.

Assumptions need to be backed up with fact. Age and wisdom do not always go hand in hand.

Fact begs realism, and according to what I've seen in the news, it appears the input of the freshman Senator from Illinois was just as profound as the input from the maverick Senator from Arizona.

The latest from my man at the SEC (well, he's the former chief accountant):

At least it doesn't earmark the entire $700B for immediate, blank use.

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Well, generally, I'm more interested in the fact that Clay Aiken 1) is gay and 2) has a rabid fan base that makes up odd pins of him, but I think the whole deal is a bit of a curate's egg. I like the idea of drawdowns as opposed to a lump sum, and I like that there have been some safeguards placed on the Treasury Secretary. However, I was having coffee this morning with a friend who's a governance hack like me (we were at the Bourgeois Pig, which is so fitting in retrospect) and we were discussing the executive compensation control aspect of it. Her thoughts were that curbing excessive golden handshakes are going to be very difficult indeed. The government would require the companies to go into every affected contract, amend the language, and then have the language certified by the Treasury that it is compliant. But what standards would companies need to achieve to reach "compliance"?

Pay for performance is a very tricky nugget, and something I feel strongly about. Back when I worked in the UK, the mantra was "exceptional pay for exceptional performance" and I totally agree. Your company makes me, the shareholder, a lot of money, fine, pay yourself a few million if what you did was a truly exceptional turn. It's all relative -- you could have a company that makes a lot of money on paper, but then compare them to their peers and they did not do so well. If they made a decent return for investors but not as much as a rival company could have, how should this be quantified in terms of performance-related pay? I think most people agree payment for failure is not acceptable, and that's what we have here with these banks, no question. But is it really the role of the government to step in and renegotiate terms of private contracts? I have a very, very hard time with this idea. It should have been the investors stepping up to the plate much earlier and being active owners (yes, OWNERS) of these companies, asking at the time of introducing a new incentive plan whether the criteria involved for large payouts encouraged excessive risk-taking. Too many US shareholders don't know or don't care about voting their proxies intelligently, whether on an individual or institutional basis.

This is not to say it is the shareholders' fault we are in this mess; indeed I think their role is small (but not insignificant). The US system of financial oversight is broken in just about every place, and the stress of the current situation has caused the whole wall to fall down.

Edited September 25, 2008 by elmcitymaven

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

But is it really the role of the government to step in and renegotiate terms of private contracts? I have a very, very hard time with this idea. It should have been the investors stepping up to the plate much earlier and being active owners (yes, OWNERS) of these companies, asking at the time of introducing a new incentive plan whether the criteria involved for large payouts encouraged excessive risk-taking. Too many US shareholders don't know or don't care about voting their proxies intelligently, whether on an individual or institutional basis.

Wow - thanks for your response! Basically - I agree with you on much (and my job is not corporate governance but discussing whether an actress should whiten her teeth, so I like to be smart sometimes).

I think what you say happening at the Walt Disney company a few years ago after there was a shareholder revolt in response to Eisner's excessive bonus in a year when they reduced the workforce by 4% and the shares hit an all-time low and he severed relationships with the only partners that were making the company money (Pixar). As well as making several bone-headed creative decisions.

But with regard to the bit in bold - I agree with you, but when you are asking the government to come in and bail you out otherwise the economy will implode I have a hard time believing that demands about executive compensation are a "dealbreaker." Hang on - I thought the economy was going to implode? The executives would prefer economic apocalypse to not getting the appropriate severance packages?

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Robin -- you'd be very, very surprised. It's all about d!cks on the table with some of these guys.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

Robin -- you'd be very, very surprised. It's all about d!cks on the table with some of these guys.

Actually, that doesn't surprise me at all. Though I would have thought the d*cks would be, uh, a little limp when you have to go crying to Uncle Sam,

[elmcitymaven 9,712]

Robin -- you'd be very, very surprised. It's all about d!cks on the table with some of these guys.

Actually, that doesn't surprise me at all. Though I would have thought the d*cks would be, uh, a little limp when you have to go crying to Uncle Sam,

[kaydee457 13]

Well the empty suit, "the one" now says it's imperative that he remain in Washington tonight and perhaps tomorrow as there's serious business that needs to be done....

No $hit, dumba$$!