Our Fairy Tale is Over

[carpe diem 2]

Jen, from reading your post about things you would have done differently, it sounds like it would have worked better for your relationship if you had been the one to move, as opposed to David. Some people are just better at taking initiative, adjusting to unfamiliar surroundings, and persevering in the face of disappointments than others. I vaguely recall that you said somewhere it wasn't an option for you to move to Europe (I don't remember why) but it sounds like the personality traits that help you make the best out of life in foreign surroundings are more present in you than in David.

Also, I can very much relate to the point you make about you being busy and he not at all. I have been in a somewhat similar situation with my husband, when it took him about a year to find a job (I should clarify that this was not due to immigration/ adjustment issues as he is the USC). The job search turned out to be much more difficult than he ever expected, and I felt that it made him kind of passive, which I couldn't understand because I would have expressed my frustration more clearly. Although he did what he could using his network to try to learn about openings, I also felt that he was wasting a lot of time playing computer games, posting on Internet forums and doing household things that really shouldn't fill up entire days. I have always had jobs, even as a student (except when I studied here because it would be difficult with my visa) and I couldn't understand that he didn't just try to find any job. He also didn't reach out to friends, partly because of his passivity, and partly because he was ashamed about being unemployed. After work and on the weekends, I always felt I had to entertain him because he spent the days by himself, and he seemed disappointed whenever I would go out with a friend and not invite him. What didn't help matters was that I had a well-paying job in which I was miserable, and I felt that after bringing in the lion's share of our income for years while he was in training, it was my turn to look for a job I would like more even if it would pay significantly less. It was the most difficult time in our relationship, and I am embarrassed to say that I wasn't always as supportive and generous as I would like myself to be.

[JenT 0]

Jen, from reading your post about things you would have done differently, it sounds like it would have worked better for your relationship if you had been the one to move, as opposed to David....

Hi CD - very interesting observation. And your memory serves you well. I could not move to Germany due to the custody restrictions of my former marriage. My ex and I share joint physical and legal custody. At the time David and I married, my kids were 14 and 10. I could not leave them behind, nor could I uproot them to take them overseas. My ex never would have permitted it, and I couldn't have fought to take them away from their dad. Despite our differences, he is a great father and they deserve to be in each others' lives.

I've often considered the 'shoe on the other foot' so to speak.... if I had one daughter and she was on the verge of being 18 when I moved what would my answer to a proposal have been? Bottom line of that scenario is 'no'. I couldn't have left her, even though she'd be off at college and beginning her independent life. I'm too close with my daughters and without them, I would not be whole.

I don't say this to diminish David has a father... I've commented enough about his parenting perspective in this thread. I think he romanticized our relationship so much that he was overwhelmed by those feelings and unrealistically rationalized the physical distance that would be between him and his daughter.

Now, were I to have been single with no kids, I know I could have adjusted to life in Germany easier than David has adjusted here. I am not a complacent person and would have made 'things' happen. In fact, David and I discussed that one day. One of the clear distinctions between us is the fact that I MAKE things happen... he LETS things happen. That fundamental difference is VERY frustrating. And that is probably the way to clarify your situation when your husband was unemployed, CD. The use of the worst "passive" was very appropriate.

Jen

[jeff's bride 0]

Jen -

I don't want anything I say to sound like I believe you are making a mistake.

But I am going to make some observations and ask you to think about them.

Number One - If I didn't want a divorce, I wouldn't file for it.

Number Two - What might be 'dead center' to one person is not 'dead center' to another.

Number Three - Has he told you he doesn't think you are worth it?

Number One - I know. When the subject of divorce came up the last time, I told him that I wasn't going to file. If he wanted the divorce, he was going to have to file. But there are some basic aspects of his personality and our relationship that made me decide to file:

He never does anything that requires 'effort' if it doesn't please him... he'd have to research the process and make it happen. More importantly, he has NO (literally NO) money to pay for an attorney. And there's no way he'd file the paperwork himself. He has absolutely zero initiative, and that's honestly not an exaggeration. He would freely admit it. We'd be stuck in this misery forever and I can't put my kids through that. Nor do I deserve to be the recipient of any more verbal abuse. Plus, and this may sound bad, but the longer we're married, the more he'd be entitled to, financially. Since he has contributed ZERO to this marriage (emotionally and financially), I am unwilling to accept that he is entitled to anything, the law notwithstanding. Plus, him 'pushing' me to finally file gives him the ability to go home and tell everyone that it wasn't his fault, that I 'made him' leave.

Number 2 - True... everyone has a different tolerance level for what they will accept and what they won't. He'd say he was through but would never do anything about it. Last Sunday, I asked him for the final papers that he'd had in-hand for 4 days. His response was, "Are you sure YOU want to do this?" I resented the insinuation that it was all ME.... and if THAT was his attempt at breaking the ice and seeking to reconcile, it was pathetic. That was the one and only time he ever questioned anything about the separation/divorce.

Number 3 - Not in so many words. But he never disputed it when I mentioned it through tears....

Dear Jen,

I don't know you, and I don't know your story, but I've had similar situations. I was pregnant when my first husband and I split up, he left, I didn't want the divorce, but I ended up asking him to leave, because living with him walking around the house like a zombie was not good for him, it was not good for me, and it was not good for the baby. Though I didn't want the divorce, I filed it (he was surprised, even though he'd been living out of the house for 3 months and had a girlfriend). I filed to protect myself and the rights of my child (I filed the day the fetus was viable if born, to protect her rights to child-support as it's retroactive to the date of filing or the date of birth, whichever is later).

As I said, I don't know your whole story, but I feel for you. I am now re-married, and I am fairly sure that should we have to go through a divorce, this one would tear me apart even more than the first, and I was pregnant the first time. Please take care of yourself, and take care of your kids...and, if you can ever find it in your heart, try a little to take care of him too, despite him wanting the end result, I'm sure he's hurting too.

Best of luck to you.

[*JG* 2]

A friend of mine phoned this morning to offer some moral support. He said that I should 'make peace' with David before he leaves. (Right now, we're barely speaking.) I'm conflicted about that. Part of me wants to stay angry and bitter (for now) and pledge to never speak to him again because it will be easier to watch the door close behind him if I do. I have really been a b!tch these last few weeks.

The other part of me wants to make peace and 'try to' part as friends. I'm just so hurt right now that the idea of being 'just friends' seems all the more painful.

I am 'friends' to some extent with the father of my kids. We don't exchange 'life news' but we are civil and can communicate well when it comes to the kids. When David leaves, I will really have no 'reason' to speak with him again.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Jen

Jen, I personally believe we should try and make peace with as many people as we can in our lifetimes. There is no point in holding on to the negative feelings forever. You either make peace between yourselves and move on or you just move on and try and forget about them.

That being said, it's fresh and it's raw. If you or he is not ready to make that peace yet, don't push the issue. That time will come when it is right for both of you. There is no time limit on when you have to do it. There are no rules for this. If and when you feel ready, approach him on the subject. If he is ready and willing, it will happen.

[rebeccajo 14]

I agree with Kelly insofar as making peace. But....sometimes you just can't. My ex and I never have. But my bitterness isn't to do with the years we were married. It is to do with the way he handled himself towards our son during the divorce, and the way he continues to punish him.

Which brings me to something I've been wanting to say since I started reading this 'blog'. Children.

Everybody who has read me for any length of time at all knows I have one son; that he is the apple of my eye; and that I love him ferociously. I know Jen has three daughters and she has devoted herself to them as well.

Whenever I try to describe how I feel about raising children, I find I have to go back to something my Mother said to me on the day Zach was born. She was getting ready to leave my hospital bedside after my long labor. She said - "Remember, he doesn't belong to you. He belongs to himself." Some people have told me that was a cruel thing to say, but I never took it that way. I took it for the fundamental truth that it was. I had, on that day, brought new life into the world. Life that I would nurture; that I would try to shape into a good and decent human being; life that would give me great happiness and great tribulations; life that I would eventually release into the world.

Children leave us. I've struggled with that knowledge daily since my Mother spoke it to me so plainly. We do what we can and must - but we must always remember they have lives of their own which will spin off from ours.

So - while I would do nearly anything for my son - I have never put him first. Rather I have put family first and what is in the best interest of all of us. Sometimes one of us comes first; sometimes another. Last fall, I sold the family home my son was raised in. It liked to kill him. I wil never forget him standing in the driveway (on his last visit in from college before the closing which would take place while he was away) looking up into the woods he loved. I remember the arguments we had about the house - about how he loved it and how it was home to him. And I remember hugging him, and asking him if he understood why we had to do what we were doing. He looked at me through tears, and said he did. And I knew he meant it. Because he knew that together we were all stronger than we were separate.

He still comes home from school now and then. He calls home to check on me. And he is growing from the tiny infant I held in my arms 20 years ago, to the man my Mother saw in the future. And that man has three men from whom he takes his life lessons. His own father - whom he loves but despises; his step-father - a sweet man who treats his mother well and makes her happy; and his grandfather - who taught him to look in the mirror for the true measure of his self.

I hope he looks to his Mother also. Who never put him first all the time - but put him on the road to learning that being first isn't real life. That being part of the whole is where real strength is found. And where real fulfillment will begin.

[Chocolot 0]

Hi JenT, I too am sad for you, it sounds as if you made a real attempt to get it all working. Your story is a reminder that we all have cultural differences and even though speaking the language may help, as someone already said there are just so many adjustments, from the family differences, the food, the way things are done and yes the language.

As one who also has changed countries before, I really didnt anticipate a problem and thought this time would be similar, and found to my surprise how wrong I was. Luckily I too have a supportive husband, who understands my complete and utter misery when i get so homesick. We have had our trips 'home' to check up on the family there but there are always the concerns due to the system, like will we have difficulties returning through immigration while waiting for USCIS to get its act into gear.

Like others before me, I would never have realised the strain that living under the US immigration system would add to the mix, but the fact that it does add to the stress can not be denied.

I am so sorry that your daughters have been hurt, but I agree with you that they deserve the best role model or they may reach adulthood with a poor understanding of what a good relationship is.

I do hope you are in a good place now, your posts will, I believe be incredibly helpful for others, and I commend you for your braveness and thoughtfulness in your description.

Thanks for sharing

jayde

((()))

Thank you so much for saying this. I thought it was me.....that there was something wrong because after all this time, I am still having to explain stuff. 7 years......EGADS!!!!

Nah, it's not you. This past weekend, I dealt with some personal issues relating to 'settling in' -- I've been here almost 4 years and still dealing with it. I have finally let go of some things, and feel much better about things as a whole, but it still doesn't feel like home to me. My hubby is extremely supportive, which helps, but I can't but help to feel bad about it a bit. At least when we make the move to Canada, I will know exactly what he is feeling like!

JenT, I am truly sorry to hear what has happened to you. I wish you nothing but the best.

[Mrs.J06 4]

Jen, you mentioned something earlier that struck me as very important. You said you didn't want a partner who was dependent on you for happiness.

I think us immigrants do for some time after the move solely depend on our spouses for happiness if we want to or not, due to the fact that our spouses usually are the only people we know, we can talk to, we can ask questions and we can spend time with.

The crucial step is to break away from this at some point during our adjustment period and try to get our "own" lifes on track again.

One good example I experienced is making friends. My husband has only a few (like, two) "friends" he stays in touch with and every once in a blue moon does things with. These guys are terrific people and I like them a lot, but they are not "my" people, and their wives have nothing in common with me. While we get a along well when we meet every once in a while, I knew these friends would never be my friends.

So the two options I had was either be miserable, have no friends and nag about the ones my husband has, or go out and try to make new friends, which can be a lengthy, frustrating and depressing process.

I think this is only one example where the immigrants have to make an effort to establish a new life rather then depending on their spouses and just "share" their life.

I know I'm a much happier person now that I have a very small circle of friends and a job, and I actually know certain things about our area better than my husband and get to show him things about his city.

From what you wrote, I sounds like David eventually made the decision not to try too hard anymore, but rather stay miserable and make your life miserable too. At that point, I'm not sure what you could have done to change it, I doubt you had much influence on it.

As to staying friends, I think that takes a while. It has to happen when there are kids involved, but if there are no kids and people end up living in different countries, I don't see why you should if it is too painful. At least for a while I think I would step back and let it be.

[Emancipation 2]

I agree with Kelly insofar as making peace. But....sometimes you just can't. My ex and I never have. But my bitterness isn't to do with the years we were married. It is to do with the way he handled himself towards our son during the divorce, and the way he continues to punish him.

Which brings me to something I've been wanting to say since I started reading this 'blog'. Children.

Everybody who has read me for any length of time at all knows I have one son; that he is the apple of my eye; and that I love him ferociously. I know Jen has three daughters and she has devoted herself to them as well.

Whenever I try to describe how I feel about raising children, I find I have to go back to something my Mother said to me on the day Zach was born. She was getting ready to leave my hospital bedside after my long labor. She said - "Remember, he doesn't belong to you. He belongs to himself." Some people have told me that was a cruel thing to say, but I never took it that way. I took it for the fundamental truth that it was. I had, on that day, brought new life into the world. Life that I would nurture; that I would try to shape into a good and decent human being; life that would give me great happiness and great tribulations; life that I would eventually release into the world.

Children leave us. I've struggled with that knowledge daily since my Mother spoke it to me so plainly. We do what we can and must - but we must always remember they have lives of their own which will spin off from ours.

So - while I would do nearly anything for my son - I have never put him first. Rather I have put family first and what is in the best interest of all of us. Sometimes one of us comes first; sometimes another. Last fall, I sold the family home my son was raised in. It liked to kill him. I wil never forget him standing in the driveway (on his last visit in from college before the closing which would take place while he was away) looking up into the woods he loved. I remember the arguments we had about the house - about how he loved it and how it was home to him. And I remember hugging him, and asking him if he understood why we had to do what we were doing. He looked at me through tears, and said he did. And I knew he meant it. Because he knew that together we were all stronger than we were separate.

He still comes home from school now and then. He calls home to check on me. And he is growing from the tiny infant I held in my arms 20 years ago, to the man my Mother saw in the future. And that man has three men from whom he takes his life lessons. His own father - whom he loves but despises; his step-father - a sweet man who treats his mother well and makes her happy; and his grandfather - who taught him to look in the mirror for the true measure of his self.

I hope he looks to his Mother also. Who never put him first all the time - but put him on the road to learning that being first isn't real life. That being part of the whole is where real strength is found. And where real fulfillment will begin.

Beautiful post Rebeccajo great thoughts expressed.

[*JG* 2]

I agree with Kelly insofar as making peace. But....sometimes you just can't. My ex and I never have. But my bitterness isn't to do with the years we were married. It is to do with the way he handled himself towards our son during the divorce, and the way he continues to punish him.

Which brings me to something I've been wanting to say since I started reading this 'blog'. Children.

Everybody who has read me for any length of time at all knows I have one son; that he is the apple of my eye; and that I love him ferociously. I know Jen has three daughters and she has devoted herself to them as well.

Whenever I try to describe how I feel about raising children, I find I have to go back to something my Mother said to me on the day Zach was born. She was getting ready to leave my hospital bedside after my long labor. She said - "Remember, he doesn't belong to you. He belongs to himself." Some people have told me that was a cruel thing to say, but I never took it that way. I took it for the fundamental truth that it was. I had, on that day, brought new life into the world. Life that I would nurture; that I would try to shape into a good and decent human being; life that would give me great happiness and great tribulations; life that I would eventually release into the world.

Children leave us. I've struggled with that knowledge daily since my Mother spoke it to me so plainly. We do what we can and must - but we must always remember they have lives of their own which will spin off from ours.

So - while I would do nearly anything for my son - I have never put him first. Rather I have put family first and what is in the best interest of all of us. Sometimes one of us comes first; sometimes another. Last fall, I sold the family home my son was raised in. It liked to kill him. I wil never forget him standing in the driveway (on his last visit in from college before the closing which would take place while he was away) looking up into the woods he loved. I remember the arguments we had about the house - about how he loved it and how it was home to him. And I remember hugging him, and asking him if he understood why we had to do what we were doing. He looked at me through tears, and said he did. And I knew he meant it. Because he knew that together we were all stronger than we were separate.

He still comes home from school now and then. He calls home to check on me. And he is growing from the tiny infant I held in my arms 20 years ago, to the man my Mother saw in the future. And that man has three men from whom he takes his life lessons. His own father - whom he loves but despises; his step-father - a sweet man who treats his mother well and makes her happy; and his grandfather - who taught him to look in the mirror for the true measure of his self.

I hope he looks to his Mother also. Who never put him first all the time - but put him on the road to learning that being first isn't real life. That being part of the whole is where real strength is found. And where real fulfillment will begin.

That's why I said, "or just move on", cause I do know that sometimes you just can't either. In that case, I move on and say at least I tried.

[JenT 0]

Apparently David has indeed been reading this thread and just like when the doc declared him "not depressed" when he was having a good day, he felt quite vindicated by your post, Becc. Everyone has their own perspective of what it means to be a parent and how to raise their children. If you gather 10 different attorneys in a room, you'd get 10 different opinions. Same with parents. I learned VERY early on to listen to what other people had to say about parenting and then decide what's best for me and for my family. That's all anyone can do. I'm not going to defend my choice to make them a priority. They are with us in the same home for a very short period of time, in the grand scheme of things, and choosing to become a parent demands sacrifices. Some make more than others. Some have it easier than others. Being the best parent one can be means something different for everyone.

He confronted me yet again the other night and it's pretty clear that this is not going to end with us being on speaking terms. It's just as well.... as Mrs J06 said, we have nothing that requires us to remain in touch so it is best just to go our separate ways.

One of the things he took issue with me about, since he's been following this thread, was the fact that certain details have been 'left out'.... that has been intentional. There are a few of you with whom I've pm'd who know some of these details, but I have chosen to leave them out of the public forum because there's no point in sinking to such a level. This thread is not about trashing David and that has never been my intent. He has very few people with which he can share such details and I encouraged him to get an account here to find some support of his own. But that would require effort, so it will never happen.

Thank you Jayde and Jeff's Bride for taking some time to offer words of encouragement.

Jen

[JenT 0]

One thing I neglected to mention was something else he criticized me for.... how I seem to be a different person here with all of you than I am with him. Those you who remember me from 'back when' know that who I am on here is 'me'... I can step back from the anger and resentment to think a little clearer, especially when I write. I cannot do that when he is in my face with his criticisms and verbal abuse.

It also supports what I said earlier about David and I bringing out the worst in each other. The person I am when I'm around him is not me, and it's not who I want to be, which is further justification for us to move on separately with our lives.

[russian_armenian 4]

JenT,

Good luck to you. All the best wishes and wish you happiness. I am so sorry to read your story.

Reading your story made me realize again how background cultures are important. I dont mean that his UK/European background played a big part in this sad outcome and marraige resolution. What striked me (again and again) is a typical American tradition to work on a sour relationship and reason that more time in the beginning/dating would save/avoid future problems. My perspective (and I think it is kind of culturally related) is that the best marraiges were started in a hearbeat. All happy families I know (about dozen) were formed after 2-3 months of dating and no prior to marriage living. The span of those marraiges are 15-25 years now. But when you meet them, you get it right away they are strong unions and happy and they are not working/never did on relationships.

I feel that if after a few months of dating, if people want to live together/to see how all will work out, the big chance that there are some bigger than accepted interpersonal differences (maybe on unconceous level). I know that most Americans would not agree since it is engraved in culture than before a big jump into marraige, you have to make sure that marriage would last. And all this brings us to 70% divorce rate (the divorce rate is high in Russia too now; but a lot of marraiges in Russia are started with wrong intentions-ride to a better life due to dare circumstatces; it is much more difficult to get yourself on tracks in Russia than here). Is this an outcry of protestant culture-to get something good, you have to work hard? While it helps to prosper economically, should it be applied to relationships?

Hi Everyone,

Two years ago, I never would have thought I'd be posting in this forum, but here I am. I'm angry and bitter and trying very hard to keep it together these days... I haven't posted on (or even accessed) VJ for a very long time because it's too much of a reminder of what was. Things are so different now and the feelings that I remember having 'way back when' seem so distant.

Some of the 'old timers' here know our story.... anyone else who is interested can read our story in my profile. Since I haven't kept up with VJ, I really don't know who's still here... who might be interested…. Rebeccajo, Charles and Nessa, GaryC, Luzy, William33, LisaD, Diaddie….??

I remember reading posts in this forum two years ago and shaking my head in wonder... thinking I was immune to some of these 'issues' much as an adolescent believes they are immune to danger and are immortal. It was foolish of me to think that way. As much as I thought I was being realistic about the challenges of blending households and cultures, I did not account for how unrealistic David was about all of this, despite the fact that we talked about everything, a lot.

After my divorce, I decided that I didn't want to marry again. But after meeting David and deciding that we wanted to build a life together, marriage was the only way (thanks, USCIS). I believed him when he told me that he had nothing keeping him in Germany.. his daughter was almost 18 and lived exclusively with her mother (that should have been one of my parenting-related clues). She had a boyfriend and a life of her own that she was building. David had a very small circle of friends and he had his saxophone. He taught English as a second language (no college or University education)… all things he could easily 're-create' here, as long as his daughter was able to visit. His best friend died of cancer a month of so before he moved to the US and that deeply affected him.

I fell in love with his sense of humor... the loyalty he felt for his friends… and his determination to make some sort of a life for himself in Germany after his divorce. I loved how he expressed himself through his music, how he showed obvious affection for his daughter, and how he enjoyed teaching. I was awestruck that he loved me enough to forsake his life in Germany and move across the ocean to be with me. I loved him for that too.

But David never found 'closure' after leaving Germany. There were warning signs about his personality 'issues' that I chose to either ignore or spin positively… ultimately, he suffered from severe homesickness and depression (and he is borderline obsessive-compulsive), but lived in denial about it. He grew resentful of the fact that I had a full calendar and a life with my two teenage girls. He resented the fact that I had a full-time career that paid very well, while it took him a year and a half to find a job, working as a front desk clerk at a local hotel. Yet, even though he was home alone all day (and I worked 60+ hr weeks), he would not do any housework unless I was right alongside him doing it too.

He was jealous of the time I devoted to my children and I realized that he never really raised a child… he divorced his wife when his daughter was 6. So he missed all of the school-stuff, doctor appointments, nightmares in the middle of the night, sleepovers, clothes shopping, party planning, holiday 'stuff', etc. Even when his ex went out of town, his daughter stayed with a babysitter, instead of staying with him. He didn't know how to share a home with a wife and two teenage daughters. More importantly, he didn't want to try. He became suspicious that we were all out to make him feel like a 'slave'.

He came upon a cruise line for students that was seeking English instructors…. They'd be gone for 4 months at a time, sailing the world while being educated in various subjects. There wasn’t even any negotiation possible. He'd decided he was going to go, regardless of how I felt, without even knowing any details about compensation…. That was when I felt the shred of foundation that was left between us had finally cracked. We kept trying and reconciling. But every argument grew uglier and nastier than the last.

We coached soccer together last fall, in an effort to find some mutual ground, but it was a disaster because he resented the fact that we (Americans) had ruined HIS sport (UK football). His arrogance about everything in Europe being better than everything in the US was growing very wearisome.

He became angry and verbally abusive, to the point where I had to phone 9-1-1 one night this last July just to diffuse the situation. We'd been having computer problems and he accused me of changing settings so that he could not longer access his email… (like I have time to conspire against him like that). It escalated and other issues crept in to the point where the police needed to be called.

Overall, we were in marriage counseling for over a year, separately and independently. I kept up hope for both of us... And the therapist and I tried to help him to find the person that he was, or wanted to be. Everything that was mine was his, but he could never accept it because his pride stood in the way. He was too depressed to listen to music, let alone play, and he never sought to develop any of his own personal relationships. Everything was too much effort. We live in a small Midwest town… he knew what he was getting himself into as I requested that he come to stay with us for 6 weeks before I accepted his proposal. That wasn't enough time for him to really understand what life was going to be like.

Of course I was frustrated by all of this… I knew we were complete opposites but I 'thought' we would balance each other out. Instead, we wound up bringing out the worst in each other. I've been impatient and have overlooked his needs because I've felt so betrayed. He made no effort to change, to meet MY needs, or to make things better. I feel as though he just went to counseling to placate me. If he were to post here, he would tell you that I am controlling… I would have been quite happy to relinquish some of the responsibility for the house and the calendar and our social lives if he'd shown some competency, some desire, and "stepped up", but he did not. He was content to let me do everything and then blame me for doing so. Rather than communicate with me, he'd have conversations with me in his head, decide on the outcome, and then blame me for whatever it was…. He gave up being interested in what I had to say, and quite honestly, I lost interest in what he had to say as well.

I kept trying to remind myself that his was the biggest adjustment and that he needed time…. All of my suggestions to help with the adjustment were looked upon by him as more attempts to control him, so I gave up. He had freedom to come and go as he pleased with full access to one of our vehicles and he took full advantage of that, out of spite. It was ok for him to be gone for hours at a time and I wasn't supposed to ask where he'd gone…. Yet I had to be accountable to him for my plans every day.

Those of you on here who know me also know that this is the most personal information I've ever shared about my life. I am only doing so to emphasize the fact that had we had more time together to date and be a 'normal' couple, I would have learned about our incompatibility long ago. Many of you are able to make it work given the distance and timing…. Many are not. If you see red flags or warning signs, PLEASE pay attention to them. Others had warned of things to watch for as we were going through our immigration process but I thought we were immune to all of it since we HAD built a solid foundation of communication. That ability to communicate seemed to crumble as soon as we shared the same living space.

I'm no longer wondering whether I made the right decision to file for divorce. I still love him, but that is not enough. We don't have enough in common to sustain a marriage… most importantly though, we have both lost the desire to try any longer. We are fundamentally incompatible and we could not have known that in the short time we knew each other before we began the immigration process. I just hope to get past my anger and resentment to resume a happy life with my girls. I'm back in therapy to help with that.

So…. I'll probably still check in on VJ from time to time, but I'm sure I won't be posting much. I wish all of you the best in your relationships and I hope you find the most possible happiness in your lives.

Jen

[Laura+Tom 2]

Jen, I just want to wish you and your children all the best for the future

[rebeccajo 14]

Jen -

If you've left out 'certain details' that is your prerogative. I'm sure if David posted there would be more details still. This isn't a judgment, but just reinforces that there are two sides to every story.

Insofar as children go, maybe it's because I only had one that I believe so strongly in what I wrote. I see my sons growing and his passing into the adult world very clearly. I've got no other children at home to 'soothe' me into the separation that occurs when they grow and leave the nest. It's natures way for kids to grow up and go. And we, as parents, have lives left to live after they go. I tried to prepare my son for a well-rounded and fulfilled life. And I had to learn that I needed a happy, fulfilling life after he was gone. To me it's just that simple.

This isn't intended to be an argument about how to raise a child. It's just my opinion that we need to remember we are more than parents.

Edited October 12, 2008 by rebeccajo

[JenT 0]

... we need to remember we are more than parents.

We are indeed. Thanks Becc.

Jen