Our Fairy Tale is Over

[Brad and Vika 129]

Jen, I was sorry to read about your troubles. It seems to me from reading other posts on VJ and empirical evidence that rebeccajo is spot on about the red flags. It is a problem most of us contend with at some point here, distinguishing between flags and cultural differences that require our emotional adjustment. To compound things, the opinions and advice of friends and family who have never attempted this kind of relationship can be way off the mark. These circumstances almost require us at times to forge ahead ignoring the people around us. Once there is so much invested in the process, it can be tough to see those red flags waving at us.

For example, there is a guy who brought his fiance here recently, and she is telling him directly that the relationship was a mistake and that she does not love him. After posting on VJ and chatting with several of us, he wants to get married anyway because he still hopes things will work out. He also believes (correctly) that she will be humiliated by being "sent back", and wants to give her more time here. He is willfully blind to every single problem and opinion that doesn't allow for a marriage. Here is the thread address Noll.

[SterlingGirl 1]

It's not as if there's any "trouble in paradise" that made me say what I did - just that, sometimes when I read threads of relationships that have dissolved, whether it's right or wrong of me to do so, I'll sometimes get a "feeling" about either of the people involved and wonder if they really did think things through, if they weren't just so antsy to get into a relationship or have things work out that they didn't REALLY, truly make sure that marriage was what they both wanted (or whether they had anything in common, such as FAR older USC's with much younger Filippinas). With Jen, I didn't get that feeling; she seemed so grounded and spoke so eloquently on the subject that I'm sure, had I spoken to her when the relationship was still intact, I'd have probably felt that her situation was pretty similar to mine. And while I can't say that I have NO doubts whatsoever (I'm a cynic by nature), they're nothing that aren't common for me. That simply comes from having been married before and trying to be a lot more practical this time around.

I certainly don't have what I call "Oprah Syndrome", which is my term for a person who hears a story about a failed relationship or "warning signs" and then spends the rest of the time thereafter trying to pick at everything her mate does in an attempt to prove whether or not the relationship will work. I know that any red flags in MY relationship could be as different from others as night and day. I take any post about relationship in a Your Mileage May Vary kind of way.

[JenT 0]

... It's a fine line to walk to gain knowledge from the experience of others, and the realization that what we may be going through might not be quite so - terrible.

Yes, and each person makes that decision themselves. I equate it to any sort of advice you receive from another.... take potty training (or any other issue relative to raising a child) as an example. Many have advice on the subject and the best thing a parent can do is read what others have done, talk to others about their experiences, and apply that knowledge to their own personal circumstances. There is no 'one size fits all' solution. No different here.

[JenT 0]

Jen, I was sorry to read about your troubles. It seems to me from reading other posts on VJ and empirical evidence that rebeccajo is spot on about the red flags. It is a problem most of us contend with at some point here, distinguishing between flags and cultural differences that require our emotional adjustment. To compound things, the opinions and advice of friends and family who have never attempted this kind of relationship can be way off the mark. These circumstances almost require us at times to forge ahead ignoring the people around us. Once there is so much invested in the process, it can be tough to see those red flags waving at us.

For example, there is a guy who brought his fiance here recently, and she is telling him directly that the relationship was a mistake and that she does not love him. After posting on VJ and chatting with several of us, he wants to get married anyway because he still hopes things will work out. He also believes (correctly) that she will be humiliated by being "sent back", and wants to give her more time here. He is willfully blind to every single problem and opinion that doesn't allow for a marriage. Here is the thread address Noll.

Very well stated. I haven't read the thread in the example you cited, but clearly, some people are more open to accepting (and acting upon) advice from others and some can rationalize against anything that someone else has to say.

I believed that I was entering into my relationship with eyes wide open. Hindsight being 20/20, I know now that I rationalized a lot of David's life circumstances in order to make it more positive than it really was. And to defend him to others who were critical. Everyone wants to believe in the person that they have fallen in love with, right? I was giving him the benefit of the doubt more than he deserved and I believe that would have been more apparent had I spend more time getting to know him. Yes, we got caught up in the mechanics of immigration and of planning a wedding, just like everyone else here. Which is why I say that for my own personal circumstance, my interests would have been better served had I continued a long distance relationship for a longer period of time.

Jen

[JenT 0]

...And while I can't say that I have NO doubts whatsoever (I'm a cynic by nature), they're nothing that aren't common for me. That simply comes from having been married before and trying to be a lot more practical this time around.

Exactly, SterlingGirl.... I had healed from my first divorce and learned a lot about myself and my needs in the process. I was ready to move on and I was being as practical as I thought I could be.

I believed in David and in our relationship. Yes, there were warning signs but all relationships have them to some degree. I believed him when he told me he was committed to working things out and believed that our love and commitment to each other would sustain us, no matter what would come our way.

If David had been willing to work on the relationship and shown the least bit of effort, I would have continued working on it with him, despite what I had learned about him, despite the verbal abuse, despite his resentment of my kids, despite everything. We could have forgiven each other and overcome it all. I believe that in my heart. But he gave up and when I realized that he had 'checked out' of the relationship, there was no point in me continuing to try any longer.

[Mrs.J06 4]

...And while I can't say that I have NO doubts whatsoever (I'm a cynic by nature), they're nothing that aren't common for me. That simply comes from having been married before and trying to be a lot more practical this time around.

If David had been willing to work on the relationship and shown the least bit of effort, I would have continued working on it with him, despite what I had learned about him, despite the verbal abuse, despite his resentment of my kids, despite everything. We could have forgiven each other and overcome it all. I believe that in my heart. But he gave up and when I realized that he had 'checked out' of the relationship, there was no point in me continuing to try any longer.

I think this is exactly it, Jen.

In my opinion the time we spent in a long distance relationship is only helpful to a certain degree. It is so much easier to overlook certain things we learn about our SO during this time. Some of them turn into problems when we are together, some don't. The commitment to the relationship is a big part of it. Both my husband and I felt quite uncomfortable about taking the plunge after almost two years of LDR and countless visits, probably because we both had failed relationships as baggage. O

However, we both knew the adjustment period would be rough (and it was and sometimes still is) but we both are very committed to make this work. Fortunately none of the issues we had were serious enough to harm the committment for either one of us. Some people are just not as lucky.

[macutelit 0]

I hope you will find happiness again!!!

[JenT 0]

I hope you will find happiness again!!!

I am well on my way... thanks!!

Jen

[Brad and Vika 129]

...And while I can't say that I have NO doubts whatsoever (I'm a cynic by nature), they're nothing that aren't common for me. That simply comes from having been married before and trying to be a lot more practical this time around.

If David had been willing to work on the relationship and shown the least bit of effort, I would have continued working on it with him, despite what I had learned about him, despite the verbal abuse, despite his resentment of my kids, despite everything. We could have forgiven each other and overcome it all. I believe that in my heart. But he gave up and when I realized that he had 'checked out' of the relationship, there was no point in me continuing to try any longer.

I think this is exactly it, Jen.

In my opinion the time we spent in a long distance relationship is only helpful to a certain degree. It is so much easier to overlook certain things we learn about our SO during this time. Some of them turn into problems when we are together, some don't. The commitment to the relationship is a big part of it. Both my husband and I felt quite uncomfortable about taking the plunge after almost two years of LDR and countless visits, probably because we both had failed relationships as baggage. O

However, we both knew the adjustment period would be rough (and it was and sometimes still is) but we both are very committed to make this work. Fortunately none of the issues we had were serious enough to harm the committment for either one of us. Some people are just not as lucky.

Good posts here too. I am also divorced, and occasionally my SO (who was never married) pays a price for my divorce-driven paranoia. And JenTs earlier comments about respecting her SOs sacrifice were directly on point for me. Although Viktoria has spent some time in my home and city, as I have in hers, most of our relationship at this point has been long distance. I think she probably overlooks my tendency to be short tempered, and I ignore her cultural bias to hide her temper before marriage for example. Both character traits could spell disaster when living together full time. We will never know until the day. Also, my sixteen year old son can be difficult at times (an understatement), and her willingness to take that on without any experience as a parent is laudable. She will no doubt find the reality quite different than what she imagines. Again, we cannot know the effect until she gets here, but I would say that my being divorced, having a teenager living here full time, and a need for a prenup are HUGE flags that she is ignoring, I hope to our benefit later.

Thanks JenT for blogging/posting all this. It is great food for thought.

[hheaven67 2]

"Again, we cannot know the effect until she gets here, but I would say that my being divorced, having a teenager living here full time, and a need for a prenup are HUGE flags that she is ignoring, I hope to our benefit later."

I would say that YOU are very, VERY lucky that she is ignoring all this! She is planning to take on ALL this BAGGAGE and YOU'RE asking for a PRENUP???!!! I have a 16 yr old son and I know what they're all about, thank God my husband has been thru the step-parent thing as well as has raised a wonderful son into a man! I don't think I could do it, that is for sure! I wish HER luck and patience!

[Svetlana 0]

Hi Jen,

I am sorry for what's happen. But this is not end of the world!

Time is going fast and your heart will be calm in a few month.

Don't give up, you will meet someone better.

Everything has a reason, try to think about that furute already written somewhere.

Just wait. I wish you the best and thanks again for sharing your story.

Svetlana

[JenT 0]

Hi Everyone,

This is going to be my last post in this thread, but I plan to remain here on VJ with all of my present and future friends....

The divorce was final on December 5th and I thought I would be emotional about it as I sat in the courtroom. Surprisingly, I felt more sorry for the woman who went before me and I watched her divorce become final. When the judge proclaimed mine final, I felt... nothing. Only relief that it was finally all over.

Leaving for Cabo San Lucas that following Monday was EXACTLY what I needed... I hadn't realize how much I really needed a complete break.... no computer, no cell phone... it was glorious. My new relationship is all I've ever dreamed and hoped for.... we will be spending the holidays together with family and friends and I can say with confidence that I am happier than I have even been in my life.

Thanks to all of you who helped me through these last few months... best wishes to everyone for a wonderful holiday season and a new year filled with peace and happiness!

Jen

[raymaga 25]

I have read parts of this thread off and on since it's beginning, and I feel that you seem very level-headed, intelligent and practical.

My only concern is how quickly you got into a new relationship. I know several people who did just that and the new relationship felt wonderful in the beginning, but the loss of their previous relationship without the time to "grieve" over it and experience some time of freedom from another commitment, their new relationships started to suffer.

I hope this does not happen to you and I wish you well, but my only advice would be not to rush this new relationship too much.

Best wishes to you and your family.

[JenT 0]

Thanks.... others might echo this concern as well so I will respond by saying that for one, this is not a 'new' relationship. It's actually the resurrection of an 'old' relationship that we had approx 20 years ago. It ended because our lives took different paths, not because we didn't want to be together.

Secondly, I have been divorced before, unfortunately, so I know what I need personally in terms of healing and in terms of a relationship... everyone is different in that regard. I have been in counseling for the better part of the last two years and have reconciled my relationship with David, in part through that counseling, through this 'blog', and through conversations with my closest friends and family. I have been without intimacy in my life for the better part of the last 3 years (and by that, I mean all aspects of relationship intimacy, not just physical.. and it's actually been six years if you count the time since my first divorce), so there really was no 'relationship' with David to mourn.... I mourned the dream of the relationship that I thought was possible. Once I realized that I was mourning something that was ficticious, I was ready to move on.

As far as requiring freedom from another commitment is concerned, I am 43 years old and not looking for 'freedom'. I want to be in a partnership with someone who shares the sames values, goals, and passions as I do. Now that I have found him again, I'm not going to let this opportunity slip away. We are wise enough not to make any permanent commitments right now, but I am pursuing this relationship without hesitation. We both believe that we were meant to be separated all those years ago to learn the lessons that we needed to learn along the way in order to be ready for each other when our paths crossed again. Here we are.

Jen