Affair while Married

[yankee 0]

A friend is in this situation, any suggestion?

He is married for past 7 years.

While 4 years into the marriage he met a girl oversees while he was on a trip, she was on holiday away from her country.

They met casually and started talking, via email and phone, he meet her every few months in the past and the present.

Anyway, friendship turned to extramarital affair, and feeling developed within the first year they met. He continued with his marriage and lead this life till now. This affair led to a 2 year old baby girl.

His marriage is just not going anywhere, (they live in the same house separately). He is thinking about divorcing, and marrying her, and file for fiancee visa. This is genuine relationship and with a child.

This is a complex and serious question, please let me know, what he should do. I-129F asked for a proof of meeting in the last 2 years, and past divorce decree, and how met. How should he answer or fill out the forms? During Embassy interview, if I129F is approved, do you think they will ask about his character and question her about baby without marriage, or, having an affair with married man? Could this scenario be a reason in denied K1/K2 visa?

Or should he just furnish proof met, and I-129F show baby as K2.

Thanks,

Randy

Hi, maybe you can ask your " friend" to sign up here at VJ so he can really explain his situation and ask some advices and information. This is my idea..The visa center will ask atleast 2 yrs of supporting documents ( Pictures, emails, money remittances, etc), granting that you have all these and the divorce decree if granted will have a date during " the extramarital affair" this may lead for your fiance to be grill during her interview. If your " friend" and her fiance are ready to prove and convince the consul that would be a factor to pass her interview..

goodluck to your friend..

[RandyM 0]

Any good suggestions out there, or just a a bash to ask friend to sign up and explain....

yankee, please read previous replies, there few few poster similar to this situation and posted REAL experience. You are assuming things and adding "may" this or that.

Please give references and or actual experiences. I am sure you would also appreciate solid advice, anyway, thanks to the several posters who has helped, especially pushbrk great poster with specific answer without unwanted ridicule, judgment, suspicion and bashes.

Good luck to all!

A friend is in this situation, any suggestion?

He is married for past 7 years.

While 4 years into the marriage he met a girl oversees while he was on a trip, she was on holiday away from her country.

They met casually and started talking, via email and phone, he meet her every few months in the past and the present.

Anyway, friendship turned to extramarital affair, and feeling developed within the first year they met. He continued with his marriage and lead this life till now. This affair led to a 2 year old baby girl.

His marriage is just not going anywhere, (they live in the same house separately). He is thinking about divorcing, and marrying her, and file for fiancee visa. This is genuine relationship and with a child.

This is a complex and serious question, please let me know, what he should do. I-129F asked for a proof of meeting in the last 2 years, and past divorce decree, and how met. How should he answer or fill out the forms? During Embassy interview, if I129F is approved, do you think they will ask about his character and question her about baby without marriage, or, having an affair with married man? Could this scenario be a reason in denied K1/K2 visa?

Or should he just furnish proof met, and I-129F show baby as K2.

Thanks,

Randy

Hi, maybe you can ask your " friend" to sign up here at VJ so he can really explain his situation and ask some advices and information. This is my idea..The visa center will ask atleast 2 yrs of supporting documents ( Pictures, emails, money remittances, etc), granting that you have all these and the divorce decree if granted will have a date during " the extramarital affair" this may lead for your fiance to be grill during her interview. If your " friend" and her fiance are ready to prove and convince the consul that would be a factor to pass her interview..

goodluck to your friend..

[rrobin 2]

yes i agree with others , the consulate does not care about your past relationships or marriages. They care about now in the present make sure you have your divorce final with decree in your hand before filing any papers work with immigration. As long as it is a real relationship. Then your friend should not not be denied for past mariage.

It's reasonably safe to conclude a Consular officer won't make a big issue of having had an affair and illigitimate child with the foreign beneficiary but you can bet your britches they care about previous relationships for many other reasons. I don't see a worry here but your assertion bolded above is far to broad to be accurate.

yes i can understand what you are saying if there have been abuse or fraud in past relationships. thank you

Actually, the more common reason for concern is that the past relationship is currently ongoing and the petitioned relationship is a fraud. Past relationships, including what the parties know about their partner's past relationships often impact the evaluation of the bona fides of currently petitioned relationships.

Okay it seems like obtaining a Fiancé Visa with extramarital affair is not a problem. However, has anyone experienced any problem due to an extramarital affair in the AOS (adjustment of status) interview???? What I have read is that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is a 'crime involving moral turpitude' which may result in the denial at AOS. Any thoughts?

[Ban Hammer 13,352]

Okay it seems like obtaining a Fiancé Visa with extramarital affair is not a problem. However, has anyone experienced any problem due to an extramarital affair in the AOS (adjustment of status) interview???? What I have read is that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is a 'crime involving moral turpitude' which may result in the denial at AOS. Any thoughts?

it would be best if you posted that as a separate thread in this forum:

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showforum=127

[RandyM 0]

Interesting question and it does relate to this thread.

Why would they approve the K1 and deny AOS (in the future) based on past affair which led to the marriage. In reference to your comment 'crime involving moral turpitude' Could you cite your source?

Please read the memoir of McCain running for President.

http://www.jedreport.com/2008/08/john-mccains-ch.html

In his 2002 memoir, "Worth the Fighting For," McCain wrote that he had separated from Carol before he began dating Hensley.

"I spent as much time with Cindy in Washington and Arizona as our jobs would allow," McCain wrote. "I was separated from Carol, but our divorce would not become final until February of 1980."

An examination of court documents tells a different story. McCain did not sue his wife for divorce until Feb. 19, 1980, and he wrote in his court petition that he and his wife had "cohabited" until Jan. 7 of that year -- or for the first nine months of his relationship with Hensley.

Although McCain suggested in his autobiography that months passed between his divorce and remarriage, the divorce was granted April 2, 1980, and he wed Hensley in a private ceremony five weeks later. McCain obtained an Arizona marriage license on March 6, 1980, while still legally married to his first wife.

Any thoughts?

yes i agree with others , the consulate does not care about your past relationships or marriages. They care about now in the present make sure you have your divorce final with decree in your hand before filing any papers work with immigration. As long as it is a real relationship. Then your friend should not not be denied for past mariage.

It's reasonably safe to conclude a Consular officer won't make a big issue of having had an affair and illigitimate child with the foreign beneficiary but you can bet your britches they care about previous relationships for many other reasons. I don't see a worry here but your assertion bolded above is far to broad to be accurate.

yes i can understand what you are saying if there have been abuse or fraud in past relationships. thank you

Actually, the more common reason for concern is that the past relationship is currently ongoing and the petitioned relationship is a fraud. Past relationships, including what the parties know about their partner's past relationships often impact the evaluation of the bona fides of currently petitioned relationships.

Okay it seems like obtaining a Fiancé Visa with extramarital affair is not a problem. However, has anyone experienced any problem due to an extramarital affair in the AOS (adjustment of status) interview???? What I have read is that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is a 'crime involving moral turpitude' which may result in the denial at AOS. Any thoughts?

[rrobin 2]

There are different standards for a K1 (or any other) visa and permanent residency. For a temporary visa, they don’t have the resources and time to investigate someone’s past. On the other hand, permanent residency and citizenship are big deals and USCIS spends a lot of time on all kinds of background checks. Even a small misdemeanor can get you in trouble. For example, on I-485, USCIS specifically asks if you have ever committed a crime involving moral turpitude (CIMT).

Remember that immigration has a very weird and nonstandard way of defining CIMT. Therefore, the acts which are not considered crime otherwise can be classified as CIMT for immigration purposes.

Just google “extramarital I-485 OR AOS” and you will see that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is regarded a CIMT which can render someone inadmissible. You can also google the term “crime involving moral turpitude” to see which crime falls under it.

Well McCain is an American citizen by birth so he is not deportable regardless of his immoral actions.

[pushbrk 12,907]

There are different standards for a K1 (or any other) visa and permanent residency. For a temporary visa, they don’t have the resources and time to investigate someone’s past. On the other hand, permanent residency and citizenship are big deals and USCIS spends a lot of time on all kinds of background checks. Even a small misdemeanor can get you in trouble. For example, on I-485, USCIS specifically asks if you have ever committed a crime involving moral turpitude (CIMT).

Remember that immigration has a very weird and nonstandard way of defining CIMT. Therefore, the acts which are not considered crime otherwise can be classified as CIMT for immigration purposes.

Just google “extramarital I-485 OR AOS” and you will see that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is regarded a CIMT which can render someone inadmissible. You can also google the term “crime involving moral turpitude” to see which crime falls under it.

Well McCain is an American citizen by birth so he is not deportable regardless of his immoral actions.

Unless there was an "arrest" and/or "prosecution" for the affair, their would be no record of any crime in the US or abroad for any adjudicator to consider.

[rrobin 2]

You are right pushbrk there needs to be a conviction. But for immigration purposes "admission" without any arrest is also considered a conviction. I am not sure what "evidence" RandyM submitted to USCIS to show here relationship with her then-married fiancé, but it can easily be translated by USCIS as an automatic admission to an extramarital affair. However, if RandyM can argue (or show) that the marriage was not viable otherwise, and she is not the one responsible for the destruction of his marriage then she won't be charged with CIMT.

My only point is that be well-prepared for all kind of questions at your interview and do your home work. By the way this is not a legal advice and I am not a lawyer. I have learnt most of thing that I am saying here by reading various forums and internet articles.

[RandyM 0]

rrobin,

Allow me, as your comments are not sourced. Any suggestions, please feel free to add to this.

What is Moral turpitude and importance for immigration purposes.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_turpitude

Adultery is included however it was repealed (see INA 101(f)(2) repealed by Public Law 97-116).

Immigration attorney Mr. Tipon writes in this artile http://www.philippinenews.com/article.php?id=2127

"Immigration law requires that an alien be of “good moral character” to obtain certain benefits, like naturalization or voluntary departure when placed in deportation.The Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) § 101(f) (2) formerly provided that: No person shall be regarded as, or found to be, a person of good moral character who, is, or was a person who has committed adultery.

But on December 29, 1981, Congress struck out the provision on adultery in Paragraph 2 of § 101(f), Public Law 97-116 § 2©(1).

Regards,

There are different standards for a K1 (or any other) visa and permanent residency. For a temporary visa, they don’t have the resources and time to investigate someone’s past. On the other hand, permanent residency and citizenship are big deals and USCIS spends a lot of time on all kinds of background checks. Even a small misdemeanor can get you in trouble. For example, on I-485, USCIS specifically asks if you have ever committed a crime involving moral turpitude (CIMT).

Remember that immigration has a very weird and nonstandard way of defining CIMT. Therefore, the acts which are not considered crime otherwise can be classified as CIMT for immigration purposes.

Just google “extramarital I-485 OR AOS” and you will see that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is regarded a CIMT which can render someone inadmissible. You can also google the term “crime involving moral turpitude” to see which crime falls under it.

Well McCain is an American citizen by birth so he is not deportable regardless of his immoral actions.

[Ban Hammer 13,352]

given the direction this thread has taken, i'm moving it.

Edited September 12, 2008 by charles!

[RandyM 0]

pushbrk,

In your opinion, when a fiancee has a petitioners child while the petitioner was married (divorced recently), the child is the proof of extra-marital affair. Do you think this proof is ground for K1 visa denial or future AOS denial?

Thanks

There are different standards for a K1 (or any other) visa and permanent residency. For a temporary visa, they don’t have the resources and time to investigate someone’s past. On the other hand, permanent residency and citizenship are big deals and USCIS spends a lot of time on all kinds of background checks. Even a small misdemeanor can get you in trouble. For example, on I-485, USCIS specifically asks if you have ever committed a crime involving moral turpitude (CIMT).

Remember that immigration has a very weird and nonstandard way of defining CIMT. Therefore, the acts which are not considered crime otherwise can be classified as CIMT for immigration purposes.

Just google “extramarital I-485 OR AOS” and you will see that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is regarded a CIMT which can render someone inadmissible. You can also google the term “crime involving moral turpitude” to see which crime falls under it.

Well McCain is an American citizen by birth so he is not deportable regardless of his immoral actions.

Unless there was an "arrest" and/or "prosecution" for the affair, their would be no record of any crime in the US or abroad for any adjudicator to consider.

[RandyM 0]

Charles,

This is the forum we are in "Marriage Based Immigration (K1, K2, K3, etc) to the USA > K-1 Fiance(e) Visa Process & Procedures General Discussion"

I started the thread, and I don't believe she hijacked the thread, the question is IF USCIS see this as a moral turpitude, than why they would they issue K1 Visa and later at the time of AOS deny it as the other posters posting.

I am sorry if this is inappropriate and properly written in a proper thread:

McCain was listed as an example, it appeared he was having affair and applied for license while he was married, if this is moral turpitude? if so, how he is running for a President.

I don't know, I am just asking question and learning.

given the direction this thread has taken, i'm moving it.

Okay it seems like obtaining a Fiancé Visa with extramarital affair is not a problem. However, has anyone experienced any problem due to an extramarital affair in the AOS (adjustment of status) interview???? What I have read is that an extramarital affair that destroys an existing marriage is a 'crime involving moral turpitude' which may result in the denial at AOS. Any thoughts?

it would be best if you posted that as a separate thread in this forum:

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showforum=127

[rrobin 2]

You are right adultery alone is not CIMT but when it destroys a marriage it becomes CIMT. Here is the link, check pages 11-31 and 11-32

http://books.google.com/books?id=W550EYW3O...sult#PPT1161,M1

Edited September 12, 2008 by rrobin

[Ban Hammer 13,352]

McCain was listed as an example, it appeared he was having affair and applied for license while he was married, if this is moral turpitude? if so, how he is running for a President.

mccain didn't need to get a visa either. so it's off the subject.

this forum is better suited for these types of questions. the mermaid will be by shortly to assist you.

[RandyM 0]

Thanks rrobin,

Excellent link!

so, in 1981, 27 years ago they removed adultery as a reason to deny visa. However, the adultery can be used in combination of the 7 items listed in the book (linked provided by you), item 1 mentions it could be used for denial if the alien "destroy a viable marriage" my question is how does the alien destroy a viable marriage? any input?

Scenario: What if the USC marriage was not going anywhere, when he met an alien, it is possible they had their difference and marriage was not working out, love happens divorce happens 50% rate in US. We know this is not an ideal situation, thats why we all are asking questions.

You are right adultery alone is not CIMT but when it destroys a viable marriage it becomes CIMT. Here is the link, check pages 11-31 and 11-32

http://books.google.com/books?id=W550EYW3O...sult#PPT1161,M1