Sarah Palin and the Two Americas

[SteveLaura 0]

oh my gosh.. you are so not getting it

I never said it was ok.. my point is that is silly for the Republicans to say, "how dare they bring the children into this" when they would turn around and do the same...

and just to be clear I have never stated what side I am on.. I am really trying to be in the middle...

I just would like to see these discussions be more fair...

Based on what? Show me where the reps have gone after a candidates minor children. Your assuming things based on a stereotype. How is that fair?

so in order to be classless it it just has to be about children??

I have seen a tonne of posts on here bashing Obama over every little thing...

But was any of it about his kids? Nope. There is a line and the dems are stomping all over it.

Source

McCain reportedly told a "joke" about Chelsea Clinton in 1998, saying: "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly? Because her father is Janet Reno." The late columnist Molly Ivins reported of Limbaugh:

On his TV show, early in the Clinton administration, Limbaugh put up a picture of Socks, the White House cat, and asked, 'Did you know there's a White House dog?' Then he put up a picture of Chelsea Clinton, who was 13 years old at the time and as far as I know had never done any harm to anyone.

When viewers objected, he claimed, in typical Limbaugh fashion, that the gag was an accident and that without his permission some technician had put up the picture of Chelsea -- which I found as disgusting as his original attempt at humor.

[GaryC 7]

Shamelessly stolen from Fark:

Dear Santa,

I've been really good this year. As an early Christmas present, could you make the first question presented to the VP candidates in their debate, "On this blank map of the world, please point to Afghanistan." Make both of them answer at roughly the same time. I realize that isn't really a debatable postulation, but it'd be fun to watch all the same.

Thanks!

Why do we assume she must be stupid?

Since she's been to Kuwait and has a son serving in Iraq I'm pretty sure she knows where Afghanistan is

Because she has a 17yr old knocked up daughter and she thinks every american family is cool with it. Maybe she needs to do some educating at home first, before she starts preaching to the rest of the nation of what she can do for us. Perhaps she has some items on her 'to-do' list at home that aren't taken care of.

My sister was pregant at 17 - is my mother stupid?

She lacked to teach your sister some items. Your mother is not running for the VP of the US either. With that type of status, you should have a solid background, and her's is closer to Britney's than to a real VPs.

And to Gary's "are you running scared" I'm running and laughing my a$ off with this nominee. I think its a joke.

Is that so now? How is it that my brother and I had exacly the same background and both were not teenaged parents and went on to get advanced college degrees and great jobs? Just like Sarah Palin also raised a son who is serving our country in Iraq. Do you know how condescending and sexist your remarks sound?

My comments were to be condescending. They are not sexist. I dont care what you or your brother, or your neighbor ended up doing in life. I dont care about your sister either. 17yr old pregnancies are wrong. A VP should be a role model, as a leader, as a woman, as a mother. Not teaching your kid and setting them up for a hard life is a failure as a parent. Certainly not VP material. So get up off your high horse, this is not about your or your family.

That's really uncalled for. Robin is making a point that what a 17 does or doesn't do isn't necessarily a reflection of the minor's parents. Anyone who's been a teenager or has one knows that to be true. Secondly, it's got nothing to do with Sarah Palin's ability to lead this country, whether you agree with her politics or not. Harping on this issue as Robin keeps pointing is only drawing more sympathy for Palin as a mother and woman trying to make it in a man's world.

It's nice to see that you get it Steven. Others here should follow your lead.

[Marilyn. 340]

The real issue is a disingenuous Op-Ed article that makes out that the Democrats hold the monopoly on political smears.

Only a dunce would believe such guff.

A strange comment when you look at this board and see dozens of smear topics about Palin with hundreds of replies. Reps do attack and smear but the dems have taken it to a new low in regards to smearing children.

so its ok then

yes the attack against the kids is not good but that is only one issue among many that people have with her...

[IAMX 3,055]

So if she was the presidential candidate rather than McCain, and she was running against a democrat with many years of political experience and accomplishments behind him or her, who would you vote for? Would it depend on the issues, or would your vote remain the same since you are obviously a devout republican?

I think the problem is with your reading. There, I bolded my question, does that make it any easier? Where did I say against Obama?

This isn't about Palin running against a well qualified dem. This is about a dem candidate without experience running against a well qualified rep. You can try and make it about Palin running against a qualified dem if you want but that isn't the case. Try and stay in reality here.

I see...so you can't answer the question, even hypothetical. Go figure.

Since Obama has no experience the hypotheticals is all you have. Go figure.

Again, shamelessly stolen from Fark:

2 year governor of the largest state in the union (with the smallest population)?

Check.

2 year governor of state with closest proximity of any state to Russia?

Check.

More abuse of power scandals?

Check.

Saying she's against ear marks out of one side of her mouth while pushing for money for the famous bridge to nowhere out of the other?

Check.

Quote of her just a few short weeks ago saying that she has no clue what it is that a Vice President does?

Check.

Saying she's a major family values player and not being a good enough mother to keep her high school daughter from getting knocked up?

Check.

Hmmmm.... You're right. She does look a lot more like an experienced politician than Obama!

No Gary, I'm not "running scared" from Palin. I'm pointing out what a terrible candidate she is and how horribly qualified she'd be if she were to become President. And I'm relishing the fact that it's coming out so quickly and hurting McSame.

Kind of reminds you of Obama doesn't it?

Here's Gary's argument:

[morocco4ever 63]

Are we seriously still talking about this #######? How many days til November again?

Gary loves the drama. He loves to hit the buttons, but can't handle it when the buttons are pushed back.

Personally I hate this kind of campaigning. But it goes both ways unfortunately.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

The real issue is a disingenuous Op-Ed article that makes out that the Democrats hold the monopoly on political smears.

Only a dunce would believe such guff.

A strange comment when you look at this board and see dozens of smear topics about Palin with hundreds of replies. Reps do attack and smear but the dems have taken it to a new low in regards to smearing children.

Well you would say that wouldn't you - because you've found a target of opportunity. The Dems must be worse - because of the media (and forum) response to the B-grade story of the week.

BTW - I remember those comments about the Coulter story very well - how you justified the unjustifiable comment she made about Edwards dead son.

The sad fact is that too many people have this sort of stuff on the brain and need to step back and start viewing people's personal tragedies in a human way and stop using them to make barbed and cynical political attacks.

Quite frankly its disgusting - and your #######-for-tat denial that the party you support is equally complicit in this sort of ####### going back decades is similarly unpleasant. Not to mention totally untruthful.

[GaryC 7]

oh my gosh.. you are so not getting it

I never said it was ok.. my point is that is silly for the Republicans to say, "how dare they bring the children into this" when they would turn around and do the same...

and just to be clear I have never stated what side I am on.. I am really trying to be in the middle...

I just would like to see these discussions be more fair...

Based on what? Show me where the reps have gone after a candidates minor children. Your assuming things based on a stereotype. How is that fair?

so in order to be classless it it just has to be about children??

I have seen a tonne of posts on here bashing Obama over every little thing...

But was any of it about his kids? Nope. There is a line and the dems are stomping all over it.

Source

McCain reportedly told a "joke" about Chelsea Clinton in 1998, saying: "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly? Because her father is Janet Reno." The late columnist Molly Ivins reported of Limbaugh:

On his TV show, early in the Clinton administration, Limbaugh put up a picture of Socks, the White House cat, and asked, 'Did you know there's a White House dog?' Then he put up a picture of Chelsea Clinton, who was 13 years old at the time and as far as I know had never done any harm to anyone.

When viewers objected, he claimed, in typical Limbaugh fashion, that the gag was an accident and that without his permission some technician had put up the picture of Chelsea -- which I found as disgusting as his original attempt at humor.

So you see one crude joke as an equivalent to the firestorm we are experiencing? Your reaching man.

[Peikko 1,575]

I am a dem and I am categorically not "threatened" nor "running scared" of Palin. I find it curious, and do see many points as to why she was selected, but scared - I am not.

You know, I'm not going to vote for John McCain, but as a woman a little part of me cheered when she was announced because of what it meant for women, and I fundamentally disagree with her worldview. Here is a woman who is a feminist's wet dream - she has it all, a family and a career. She's a star athlete, hunter (I hate hunting), governor, beauty queen, small business owner. She outshines her husband and can run with the boys.

Will I vote for her because of this things? No, I won't. But tearing her down using sexist language and dismissing her impressive accomplishments among people who consider themselves "liberals" really makes me question their commitment to issues that are important to women. It's depressing.

Excellent points, but herein lies the rub it seems to me, both extremes of the spectrum seem content to attach labels to everyone who appears to hold dissimilar views and tars them with the extremism without a care for what is actually said, where the actual discrepancies and similarities lie.

Edited September 3, 2008 by Madame Cleo

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Its hardly a firestorm... When something better comes along the media will be all over it.

[IAMX 3,055]

Are we seriously still talking about this #######? How many days til November again?

Gary loves the drama. He loves to hit the buttons, but can't handle it when the buttons are pushed back.

Personally I hate this kind of campaigning. But it goes both ways unfortunately.

Exactly. He was pretty high strung when Obama ended up beating Hillary. He must be scared Obama is going to win. Otherwise he'd just not attack the other side and be fair to a moderate Democrat who is in the mainstream of America.

[Ban Hammer 13,340]

sarah palin just needs to get back under that glass ceiling so everyone dem will be happy.

Edited September 3, 2008 by charles!

[SteveLaura 0]

oh my gosh.. you are so not getting it

I never said it was ok.. my point is that is silly for the Republicans to say, "how dare they bring the children into this" when they would turn around and do the same...

and just to be clear I have never stated what side I am on.. I am really trying to be in the middle...

I just would like to see these discussions be more fair...

Based on what? Show me where the reps have gone after a candidates minor children. Your assuming things based on a stereotype. How is that fair?

so in order to be classless it it just has to be about children??

I have seen a tonne of posts on here bashing Obama over every little thing...

But was any of it about his kids? Nope. There is a line and the dems are stomping all over it.

Source

McCain reportedly told a "joke" about Chelsea Clinton in 1998, saying: "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly? Because her father is Janet Reno." The late columnist Molly Ivins reported of Limbaugh:

On his TV show, early in the Clinton administration, Limbaugh put up a picture of Socks, the White House cat, and asked, 'Did you know there's a White House dog?' Then he put up a picture of Chelsea Clinton, who was 13 years old at the time and as far as I know had never done any harm to anyone.

When viewers objected, he claimed, in typical Limbaugh fashion, that the gag was an accident and that without his permission some technician had put up the picture of Chelsea -- which I found as disgusting as his original attempt at humor.

So you see one crude joke as an equivalent to the firestorm we are experiencing? Your reaching man.

No, I thought we were discussing the line that Republicans do not to cross. Whoops, seem they do.

[Marilyn. 340]

Are we seriously still talking about this #######? How many days til November again?

Gary loves the drama. He loves to hit the buttons, but can't handle it when the buttons are pushed back.

Personally I hate this kind of campaigning. But it goes both ways unfortunately.

yeah that is the point I am trying to make....

[GaryC 7]

The real issue is a disingenuous Op-Ed article that makes out that the Democrats hold the monopoly on political smears.

Only a dunce would believe such guff.

A strange comment when you look at this board and see dozens of smear topics about Palin with hundreds of replies. Reps do attack and smear but the dems have taken it to a new low in regards to smearing children.

Well you would say that wouldn't you - because you've found a target of opportunity. The Dems must be worse - because of the media (and forum) response to the B-grade story of the week.

BTW - I remember those comments about the Coulter story very well - how you justified the unjustifiable comment she made about Edwards dead son.

The sad fact is that too many people have this sort of stuff on the brain and need to step back and start viewing people's personal tragedies in a human way and stop using them to make barbed and cynical political attacks.

Quite frankly its disgusting - and your #######-for-tat denial that the party you support is equally complicit in this sort of ####### going back decades is similarly unpleasant. Not to mention totally untruthful.

I find it disturbing that you don't see that an important line has been crossed by the dems. The argument that it's been going on from both sides falls flat.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Shamelessly stolen from Fark:

Dear Santa,

I've been really good this year. As an early Christmas present, could you make the first question presented to the VP candidates in their debate, "On this blank map of the world, please point to Afghanistan." Make both of them answer at roughly the same time. I realize that isn't really a debatable postulation, but it'd be fun to watch all the same.

Thanks!

Why do we assume she must be stupid?

Since she's been to Kuwait and has a son serving in Iraq I'm pretty sure she knows where Afghanistan is

Because she has a 17yr old knocked up daughter and she thinks every american family is cool with it. Maybe she needs to do some educating at home first, before she starts preaching to the rest of the nation of what she can do for us. Perhaps she has some items on her 'to-do' list at home that aren't taken care of.

My sister was pregant at 17 - is my mother stupid?

She lacked to teach your sister some items. Your mother is not running for the VP of the US either. With that type of status, you should have a solid background, and her's is closer to Britney's than to a real VPs.

And to Gary's "are you running scared" I'm running and laughing my a$ off with this nominee. I think its a joke.

Is that so now? How is it that my brother and I had exacly the same background and both were not teenaged parents and went on to get advanced college degrees and great jobs? Just like Sarah Palin also raised a son who is serving our country in Iraq. Do you know how condescending and sexist your remarks sound?

My comments were to be condescending. They are not sexist. I dont care what you or your brother, or your neighbor ended up doing in life. I dont care about your sister either. 17yr old pregnancies are wrong. A VP should be a role model, as a leader, as a woman, as a mother. Not teaching your kid and setting them up for a hard life is a failure as a parent. Certainly not VP material. So get up off your high horse, this is not about your or your family.

That's really uncalled for. Robin is making a point that what a 17 does or doesn't do isn't necessarily a reflection of the minor's parents. Anyone who's been a teenager or has one knows that to be true. Secondly, it's got nothing to do with Sarah Palin's ability to lead this country, whether you agree with her politics or not. Harping on this issue as Robin keeps pointing is only drawing more sympathy for Palin as a mother and woman trying to make it in a man's world.

It's nice to see that you get it Steven. Others here should follow your lead.

For me, it hits close to home. However, I think it is appropriate to discuss Sarah Palin's support in teaching abstinence only vs. traditional sex education in light of this family crises. What it at least demonstrates is that no method of sex education is fool proof...and I would argue that this case demonstrates how 17 yr. olds will do what they choose to do, even if it is going against what their parents have taught them.