Michael Moore Dares to Ask: What's So Heroic About Being Shot Down While Bombing Innocent Civilians?

[Chica Yeyé 41]

Moore probably is already on some list. That stuff didn't start happening when the DHS came on the scene - the FBI held files on a number for certain people for reasons that aren't exactly clear. Steve McQueen is one name that springs to mind - he was on some FBI watch list, though God knows what for.

You got that right, Seis. Moore is on MY list, and that's a scary place.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Moore probably is already on some list. That stuff didn't start happening when the DHS came on the scene - the FBI held files on a number for certain people for reasons that aren't exactly clear. Steve McQueen is one name that springs to mind - he was on some FBI watch list, though God knows what for.

Well, let's see... this is government we're talking about, so it can't be logical. Knowing this, we'll look at Steven McQueen's name. Separating his name, we're left with two parts: "Mc" and "Queen."

The "Mc" could be seen as, perhaps, the Irish Republican Army's silent attack on McDonald's, a major capitalistic institution of the United States. Some might say it's even something of a quasi-Imperialistic icon. Regardless, this couldn't be good!

Next, the "Queen" could be interpreted as either "the head a foreign unknown power" (and therefore a potential threat to national security) or worse yet, a transvestite. We couldn't allow the children to see that, now could we?

All in all, it would be determined that Steve McQueen was actually an IRA terrorist who dressed as a female monarch and was prepared to take down the fast food industry.

[Heracles 417]

Moore, America's disingenuous documentary film maker.

He's certainly opened up plenty of people's eyes to legitimate issues this country is facing. For that, he's a genius, and I respect him. But sometimes I think of what he complains about like listening to Don Cherry talk, and sometimes just let it pass because, like everyone else, he has a political position, and of course not everyone will agree with it.

Moore has some good points but I lost respect for him after Fahrenheit 9/11. Not only was he extremely biased but he also tarnished the United State's reputation overseas.

Some extreme Democrats don't ever stop and think what effect anything they say or write will have overseas. To them it is Democrats vs Republicans. To people abroad this is just another piece of the puzzle, cementing their hatred of America.

I can safely assure you there's nothing that tarnished the country's image more than Republican foreign policy.

Moore's pointing out, for instance, the U.S. not joining the rest of the first world in universal health care (the high tens of millions of working uninsured, which ultimately taxpayers pick up anyways for those who can't pay), is not tarnishing an image that the rest of the world already knew about.

How is the Democrat foreign policy any better? Six of one, half a dozen of another really.

But nonetheless, lets look at UHC It is not as simple as saying well other countries have UHC, therefore so should we. In comparison to most of those nations with UHC, we have a completely different form of government. Most of those nations are using the parliamentary system. Canada, UK, Sweden, Australia etc are quite federally oriented nations. Certainly not the case in the US. A UHC system is easier to manage and actually feasible under a federal system. Wheres, even your schools here are generally county based, so the thought of a federal or state health care system seems more like a dream. Then we have to consider the different justice system and law of tort. Another butt of jokes abroad. A US UHC system would be bankrupted by the lawsuits alone. Let alone the 20,000,000 million illegal immigrants who would have access to it, free of charge.

It is not as easy as Moore makes it out to be.

Edited August 26, 2008 by Aficionado

[jundp 191]

Robert Byrd?

I was thinking David Duke, but Robert Byrd works too

Too bad this fat slob has not been placed on the Department of Homeland Security Terrorist Watch List for he needs it.

the only thing mikey moore terrorized was the buffet line.

Moore probably is already on some list. That stuff didn't start happening when the DHS came on the scene - the FBI held files on a number for certain people for reasons that aren't exactly clear. Steve McQueen is one name that springs to mind - he was on some FBI watch list, though God knows what for.

Well, let's see... this is government we're talking about, so it can't be logical. Knowing this, we'll look at Steven McQueen's name. Separating his name, we're left with two parts: "Mc" and "Queen."

The "Mc" could be seen as, perhaps, the Irish Republican Army's silent attack on McDonald's, a major capitalistic institution of the United States. Some might say it's even something of a quasi-Imperialistic icon. Regardless, this couldn't be good!

Next, the "Queen" could be interpreted as either "the head a foreign unknown power" (and therefore a potential threat to national security) or worse yet, a transvestite. We couldn't allow the children to see that, now could we?

All in all, it would be determined that Steve McQueen was actually an IRA terrorist who dressed as a female monarch and was prepared to take down the fast food industry.

Beautiful!

Oh and no, Der Ewige Jude hasn't been mass marketed in the US, but it is used in KKK "training." Also, while we were talking about contemporary United States, you mentioned right wing propaganda. I was pointing out that Nazi propaganda was right wing and widespread and was hoping you'd make the leap to what can happen when ANY propaganda becomes so widespread. I wouldn't say that Moore's propaganda is as vicious.

Also, yes, I do teach Mass Media in the hopes that my students can learn to think for themselves and not believe everything that's spouted out to them, so before you start with the and the comments please stop to think that some people in this world actually do believe in doing what's right. Even if they are *gasp* liberals.

Finally, if you want widespread right wing propaganda, check out Fox news. Or Faux news as many like to call it.

Moore probably is already on some list. That stuff didn't start happening when the DHS came on the scene - the FBI held files on a number for certain people for reasons that aren't exactly clear. Steve McQueen is one name that springs to mind - he was on some FBI watch list, though God knows what for.

You got that right, Seis. Moore is on MY list, and that's a scary place.

No kidding. I'm scared!

[IAMX 3,055]

How is the Democrat foreign policy any better?

It's not. Given that there's no Democratic President. It's also not as bad as Republicans, given that. Republicans have ###### things up surely, and made more enemies than friends, and continue pushing this country toward wars it won't be able to win. However, give it time. If Democrats take office they'll be given another chance to #### things up just like their taking of Congress for the last 2 years.

But nonetheless, lets look at UHC It is not as simple as saying well other countries have UHC, therefore so should we. In comparison to most of those nations with UHC, we have a completely different form of government. Most of those nations are using the parliamentary system. Canada, UK, Sweden, Australia etc are quite federally oriented nations. Certainly not the case in the US. A UHC system is easier to manage and actually feasible under a federal system. Wheres, even your schools here are generally county based, so the thought of a federal or state health care system seems more like a dream. Then we have to consider the different justice system and law of tort. Another butt of jokes abroad. A US UHC system would be bankrupted by the lawsuits alone. Let alone the 20,000,000 million illegal immigrants who would have access to it, free of charge.

It is not as easy as Moore makes it out to be.

No one said a change like this would be easy. However, there's been ongoing investigations, particularly through this state, in that more doctors are not being able to cover medicare patients, and increasing the tax burden on taxpayers to foot the bill of the increasing amount of uninsured, and no end in sight to this crumbling healthcare system. Fiscally, it's far more responsible rather than keep things in chaos the way it is now.

Edited August 26, 2008 by SRVT

[Heracles 417]

I will give America a hint about international policy. The simplest concept to understand and the easiest to execute. Stop interfering in other nations affairs.

The biggest fallacy with UHC in America is that it will both be cheap and freely available for all. Just not possible. Also, is America willing to ensure that illegal immigrants do not get free access to the system? This is probably one of the biggest deal breakers for UHC.

Edited August 26, 2008 by Aficionado

[Dan J 277]

The biggest fallacy with UHC in America is that it will both be cheap and freely available for all. Just not possible. Also, is America willing to ensure that illegal immigrants do not get free access to the system? This is probably one of the biggest deal breakers for UHC.

No, that's not it. If everyone pays their premium, it doesn't matter what their immigration status is. Subsidizing of premium can easily be limited to USC's since you would have to document your income. Of course, anyone who doesn't want to pay their premium, would be denied all care, unless they pay for it up front. Including emergency care.

We don't have a completely private system as it is. We have a hybrid system. Emergency rooms and some hospitals are socialized, you will receive care regardless of your ability to pay for it. But the cost of caring for those people, is instead put upon those who can afford to pay. So instead of just subsidizing the poor, we are also subsidizing everyone in the gray area between being able to qualify for medicare, and being able to afford private insurance.

The biggest deal breaker of UHC, is fear.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Finally, if you want widespread right wing propaganda, check out Fox news. Or Faux news as many like to call it.

I just don't get it when people attack Fox News. Are they unbiased? Of course not. Then again, no news source is, either. So it's really quite pathetic when people attempt to tear apart Fox News simply because of its conservative slant. Other news outlets have agendas as well, but for some reason, they don't warrant such obvious hatred.

[jundp 191]

Finally, if you want widespread right wing propaganda, check out Fox news. Or Faux news as many like to call it.

I just don't get it when people attack Fox News. Are they unbiased? Of course not. Then again, no news source is, either. So it's really quite pathetic when people attempt to tear apart Fox News simply because of its conservative slant. Other news outlets have agendas as well, but for some reason, they don't warrant such obvious hatred.

True story. I hate all news channels though not just Fox!

[DeadPoolX 9]

Finally, if you want widespread right wing propaganda, check out Fox news. Or Faux news as many like to call it.

I just don't get it when people attack Fox News. Are they unbiased? Of course not. Then again, no news source is, either. So it's really quite pathetic when people attempt to tear apart Fox News simply because of its conservative slant. Other news outlets have agendas as well, but for some reason, they don't warrant such obvious hatred.

True story. I hate all news channels though not just Fox!

I prefer The Onion.

[Ban Hammer 13,352]

Finally, if you want widespread right wing propaganda, check out Fox news. Or Faux news as many like to call it.

I just don't get it when people attack Fox News. Are they unbiased? Of course not. Then again, no news source is, either. So it's really quite pathetic when people attempt to tear apart Fox News simply because of its conservative slant. Other news outlets have agendas as well, but for some reason, they don't warrant such obvious hatred.

True story. I hate all news channels though not just Fox!

hater!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Finally, if you want widespread right wing propaganda, check out Fox news. Or Faux news as many like to call it.

I just don't get it when people attack Fox News. Are they unbiased? Of course not. Then again, no news source is, either. So it's really quite pathetic when people attempt to tear apart Fox News simply because of its conservative slant. Other news outlets have agendas as well, but for some reason, they don't warrant such obvious hatred.

Its not really that surprising - Fox has the biggest audience making it the most obvious target for criticism. There's a whole bunch of things wrong with Fox News (and the other news media) - if anything the slant of particular articles is less important than the stories that are chosen for public consumption.

Going back to Michael Moore - one interesting point that was made in Bowling For Columbine is that the public perception of how much violent crime there actually is artificially inflated by the news media and that this creates a persistent undercurrent of fear that tends to be reflected (amongst other things) in a subconcious fear of minorities. I've read that idea elsewhere and there have been some studies backing this up - there was one in the UK that found that people who watched particular news shows on a regular basis were more likely to overreport the incidence of certain types of crime (specifically violent crime).

[DeadPoolX 9]

Going back to Michael Moore - one interesting point that was made in Bowling For Columbine is that the public perception of how much violent crime there actually is artificially inflated by the news media and that this creates a persistent undercurrent of fear that tends to be reflected (amongst other things) in a subconcious fear of minorities. I've read that idea elsewhere and there have been some studies backing this up - there was one in the UK that found that people who watched particular news shows on a regular basis were more likely to overreport the incidence of certain types of crime (specifically violent crime).

I think it was in Bowling for Columbine that Moore stated that "Canadians don't lock their doors." I don't know where he got this information, but from my experience in Canada, they most certainly do. Maybe some Canadians don't if they live in relatively small towns or countryside areas, but in a city like Toronto or Vancouver, they'd be nuts to do otherwise.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Going back to Michael Moore - one interesting point that was made in Bowling For Columbine is that the public perception of how much violent crime there actually is artificially inflated by the news media and that this creates a persistent undercurrent of fear that tends to be reflected (amongst other things) in a subconcious fear of minorities. I've read that idea elsewhere and there have been some studies backing this up - there was one in the UK that found that people who watched particular news shows on a regular basis were more likely to overreport the incidence of certain types of crime (specifically violent crime).

I think it was in Bowling for Columbine that Moore stated that "Canadians don't lock their doors." I don't know where he got this information, but from my experience in Canada, they most certainly do. Maybe some Canadians don't if they live in relatively small towns or countryside areas, but in a city like Toronto or Vancouver, they'd be nuts to do otherwise.

He interviewed some people in a small town over the river from Detroit (I forget the name of it).

Incidentally, there are neighbourhoods in Los Angeles where people don't lock their doors.

It is an interesting movie - esp. the stuff about an ever-present culture of fear and consumption perpetuated by the mass media and how panic stories cause a corresponding upswing in gun ownership. Someone gets mugged in your town = buy a gun. 9/11 = buy a gun and survival equipment, Y2K = buy supplies (and guns) in case society collapses.

It's not hard to see the point. Even the stories about pedophilia are grossly overreported and make people crazy - the fear of child abduction vastly (really really vastly) outweighs the likelihood of it actually happening.

Edited August 26, 2008 by Number 6