I am wondering gays and k-1 visas?

[pushbrk 13,011]

I didn't enter the discussion to debate the issue.

Now isn't that a blatant lie.

Proving my point.

Of what? You've debated from the start, and you're still debating now. If you don't want to, don't. Very simple.

Not debating gay marriage. My opening post and all to follow, have been about respecting the other point of view. This is a polarizing issue. Nobody is going to convince anybody to change their mind about it through debate but we don't need to refer to the other side as haters. That one group thinks the laws of God are the highest priority, does not trivialize the views of others. We all have our values and priorities and can respect or disrespect them. You've been debating gay marriage. I've been debating about the civility and respect associated with that debate in this forum. Only you have continued the disrespect.

I have debated one point as to the overall issue but for the same reason. I've simply stated we all have the same rights to marriage. You've countered with the other side doesn't have the right they desire. That's a given. They are asking for a right nobody else has. The fact that only one group wants that right for themselves and some want them to have it doesn't change the fact it's a right nobody else has.

I understand the debate of the issue, but cannot with any degree of intellectual honesty, surrender to the other side, due to my long and stongly held religious beliefs. I respect that others do not share those beliefs and simply ask that you and others show similar respect by refraining from referring to good honest religious people as "haters" or "homophobes" etc. and filing your assertions with the kind of value judgments you wish to impose on others, while belittling them for imposing their values on you.

We are all subject to the same laws. If you want to advocate changing them, go right ahead. Others will advocate the other side and we'll see the end result at some point in the future.

The ONLY reason I posted in this thread was to object to somebody (who should well have known better) referring to me and those who think like me as "haters".

All I see is you excusing such bigotry in the first place, hiding behind nonsense like pedophilia and animal relations as justification. If it were merely of your subjective belief, it would be kept to yourself, but since you wish to push this belief on others and hinder their freedoms, you pulled yourself right into the debate.

You may be subject to your deity's laws, but in this country there is separation of church and state. I am not subject to your deity, and neither is everyone else. Sorry. If you don't like gay marriages and don't agree with one, there's one simple principle you can live by -- don't have one.

(The bold is to note your denial in that, yes, you are debating gay marriage, contrary to your claim)

If that's all you see, then you're seeing what you wish to see and ignoring all else. Bigotry? Do you see how you prove my point repeatedly? If not, others do. Enough said.

[IAMX 3,055]

If that's all you see, then you're seeing what you wish to see and ignoring all else.

There is nothing else, other than your justification for banning others from marriage because of your belief that marriage is between a man and woman, and using nonsense as a crutch for wanting it banned, including your beliefs, which yet again show how you wish others to live their lives by your beliefs. Unfortunately this type of bigotry removes the right of two men or two women to having a loving marriage much the same as you and I would have. While you wish to trivialize their rights, some of us like protecting the rights of others.

[Shpat_Argjira 0]

I had no problem bringing Eric to the states.

[filirican 3]

never

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The law is my business and yours no matter what the law addresses.

I didn't say anything about a choice. I asserted we all have the same rights when it comes to marriage.

But this is the USA, and that's how we make our laws, whether you like it or not.

I didn't make a slippery slope argument. Read again. A slippery slope argument must assert one thing is downhill from another. Apparently you've made some value judgments for there rest of us, if you saw a slippery slope in my examples.

To my knowledge, there is no law limiting gay marriages. The laws define marriage as between a man and a woman. In such jurisdictions "gay marriage" is an oxymoron, not "limited".

Well, since two men want to marry each other, something a few courts, at least, have defined as perfectly within the scope of freedoms offered to Americans, and in many states they cannot, then no, they do not have the same rights, because their choices are limited away from their own genetic inclinations. It's the same as denying blacks the right to marriage with a white woman. No different. This whole "all the same rights" bullshit is just that -- equivocating bullshit.

Also, your slippery slope arguments pertain to your persistent trivializing two loving men or two loving women, comparing them to sex/relationship/marriage with a child, sex/relationship/marriage with an animal, and sex/relationship/marriage with multiple persons. Making the same issue of things that aren't the same is an attempt to use a slippery slope as a crutch for your argument, like being gay, or allowing gays to marry, is a gateway to all of the others. A complete farce.

Well said.

I had no problem bringing Eric to the states.

[twahir 0]

Sorry guys, I take it that this has been a repetitive topic for you!

why not its the 21st century and its goes on in close doors

I had no problem bringing Eric to the states.

u r taking the piss u r very ignorrant and a shallow inhuman

[nowhereman 1]

I believe in rights for same sex couples, but I'm going to have to vote no on gay marriage. The difference is that rights for same sex couples is a legal matter & gay marriage is a religious matter. Pushbrk had a valid point in that you can't automatically label someone bigoted or homophobic just because they don't support gay marriage. Sure some people just hate gays but it's a copout to lump everyone against gay marriage in that category.

In fact I fully support a relationship between two consenting women who happen to be really hot!

[Ban Hammer 13,450]

I believe in rights for same sex couples, but I'm going to have to vote no on gay marriage. The difference is that rights for same sex couples is a legal matter & gay marriage is a religious matter. Pushbrk had a valid point in that you can't automatically label someone bigoted or homophobic just because they don't support gay marriage. Sure some people just hate gays but it's a copout to lump everyone against gay marriage in that category.

In fact I fully support a relationship between two consenting women who happen to be really hot!

:thumbs: :thumbs:

[mawilson 2,133]

We are talking about peoples lives, not a game of baseball and who is cheering for who.

Have your opinion all you want but the fact that some people are forbidden to do something that should be their right, just as it is for everyone else, is messed up.

Just because you feel one way, does not mean you have the right to tell someone how to live their life.

I hope it changes soon, one step at a time for EVERYONE to have EQUAL RIGHTS.

And THAT, is YOUR opinion, and you can have it all you want as well. It is not their right, otherwise it would be legal, so until you get Congress the change the laws... it is what it is.

Well that's just nonsense. Slavery was legal not too long ago, and so was lynching based on race.

Just because something is legal or illegal doesn't mean it's right.

[DanielParul 50]

I am not a hater, just opposed to same sex marriages. Geez! what will they come up with next - why should people be stopped from falling in love with kids and marrying/having sex with them or what about animals. I just feel that nature created male and female for a reason and anything else is unnatural.

[Chica Yeyé 41]

I am not a hater, just opposed to same sex marriages. Geez! what will they come up with next - why should people be stopped from falling in love with kids and marrying/having sex with them or what about animals. I just feel that nature created male and female for a reason and anything else is unnatural.

Why did you have to resurrect an old thread? Seriously how stupid can you be to compare gay relationships to bestiality or pedophilia?

Oh, I see; to bring out your bigoted sense of alleged moral superiority. Not so long ago, any relationship that crossed racial boundaries was off limits., Lucky for you, it was before your time. Otherwise, you would not be married - at least not to your spouse. THINK before you post. If you can.

Carry on.

[DanielParul 50]

I am not a hater, just opposed to same sex marriages. Geez! what will they come up with next - why should people be stopped from falling in love with kids and marrying/having sex with them or what about animals. I just feel that nature created male and female for a reason and anything else is unnatural.

Why did you have to resurrect an old thread? Seriously how stupid can you be to compare gay relationships to bestiality or pedophilia?

Oh, I see; to bring out your bigoted sense of alleged moral superiority. Not so long ago, any relationship that crossed racial boundaries was off limits., Lucky for you, it was before your time. Otherwise, you would not be married - at least not to your spouse. THINK before you post. If you can.

Carry on.

Can't take an opinion different from yours, eh? so have to stoop down to name calling? THINK before you post, if you can.

[Zee Bee 61]

I am not a hater, just opposed to same sex marriages. Geez! what will they come up with next - why should people be stopped from falling in love with kids and marrying/having sex with them or what about animals. I just feel that nature created male and female for a reason and anything else is unnatural.

It amazes me that people want to lump pedophilia in the same category as gay marriage. Why? You don't have to agree with it, heck, you don't have to like it. But at least be smart enough to know that that they are not the same thing.

Protecting children is different than preventing 2 consenting adults to do something THAT IS NOT GOING TO HURT ANYONE ELSE.

[Cham 3]

I am not a hater, just opposed to same sex marriages. Geez! what will they come up with next - why should people be stopped from falling in love with kids and marrying/having sex with them or what about animals. I just feel that nature created male and female for a reason and anything else is unnatural.

It amazes me that people want to lump pedophilia in the same category as gay marriage. Why? You don't have to agree with it, heck, you don't have to like it. But at least be smart enough to know that that they are not the same thing.

Protecting children is different than preventing 2 consenting adults to do something THAT IS NOT GOING TO HURT ANYONE ELSE.

Well said.

I realize that you may not agree to it..BUT they are NOT hurting you. YOU can choose who you have in your yard, home and at your dinner table, BUT it is NOT your choice who can love one another.

As ZeeBee said a PEDOPHILE is NOT GAY. If two consenting adults love each other NO matter the sex..IT is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. YES; YOU have a right to your opinion.

Make sure you get your FACTS straight though and learn the difference between GAY and PEDOPHILE.

Respect those who make the choice to love someone of the same sex and you to shall earn respect.

Predjudice is THICK and makes for an ugly ugly world