teen who eats 13,000 calories a day!

[caybee 21]

Just running this quickly through an online calculator, this girl needs 3755 calories to maintain her weight (maybe 2890 if she seriously does nothing but lie in bed all day, which may be closer to the truth, but that 2890 is required just to keep her alive). If she's eating 15,000 calories a day, I don't understand why she doesn't weigh even more, although she's probably still gaining. But say the photo really does represent what she eats every day, and she's maintaining. The package of cookies has maybe 800 calories. If she just traded that for three apples and kept everything else the same, she'd eat maybe 500 fewer calories a day, she'd fill up faster, and it would probably take her as long or longer to eat the apples than the cookies. And she'd lose a pound a week. Make a similar trade with something else that's very caloric, like that chocolate thing or the chips, and that would be two pounds a week. She wouldn't even have to change anything else in the beginning, and in my opinion, that would be a reasonable first step if she's going to make a lifelong change. Unfortunately, locking everything away from her and limiting her to 1000 calories a day would likely kill her because she'd be way below the calories required just to keep her breathing and her heart beating. Yeah, I know her current weight will kill her eventually also, but even "normal" overweight folks are cautioned not to go below 1200 calories a day for long periods because it's so hard on the body, it lowers your energy, and it makes the body think it's starving so it shuts everything down just to try to stay alive. This girl can barely move as it is; she can't afford for anything else to shut down. If she could make some relatively small changes that allowed her to lose slowly and steadily, she'd soon have the energy to walk a few steps, then a few more, then make some more small changes to her diet, then a few more steps, and maybe she'd have a chance. She needs a good nutritionist and a good therapist. And she needs them now, before she becomes an adult (if she lives that long) and can make her own (good or bad) decisions more easily. Whoever is responsible for her has an absolute responsibility to fight for proper care for this girl and to hold her accountable for her choices, just as a parent does for a 15-year-old who sneaks out or drinks, even if the child is acting out for psychological reasons.

Edited August 4, 2008 by caybee

[one...two...tree 2,762]

why do people seem to have more understanding of bulimics or anorexics?? but when someone is overweight they are called lazy etc... oh they should just stop eating so much etc..

For one, a person doesn't have to be addicted to food to be overweight. A poor diet and sedentary lifestyle are usually the biggest factors into being overweight...so I think that's why people tend to be less sympathetic. I'm not saying it's right, but that would be my guess.

As for this girl - who knows how much of her problem is from addiction and how much is from having a mother who is a poor role model? The only sure way to find out, is to remove her from her home for a period of time, put her on a healthier regiment of diet and exercise...and get both the mom and daughter in counseling. This girl is old enough though that with the right direction, she could change for the better on her own, even if her mother is unable or unwilling to change her unhealthy lifestyle.

hmmmm, a lot of times when people are overeating it is because of some mental or emotional reason not because they are addicted to food... just like when someone is bulimic or anorexic, it is a mental or emotional issue......

I agree, but it's not just overeating for many who are overweight, it's an improper diet and lack of exercise. I forgot the percentage of how many children are overweight in America today compared to 20 years ago, but it is of epidemic proportions. So we either have a lot of children with addictive personalities or emotional problems that we didn't have before, or perhaps kids today are not eating as healthy as the kids of yesterday, nor getting the right amount of exercise.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

why do people seem to have more understanding of bulimics or anorexics?? but when someone is overweight they are called lazy etc... oh they should just stop eating so much etc..

For one, a person doesn't have to be addicted to food to be overweight. A poor diet and sedentary lifestyle are usually the biggest factors into being overweight...so I think that's why people tend to be less sympathetic. I'm not saying it's right, but that would be my guess.

As for this girl - who knows how much of her problem is from addiction and how much is from having a mother who is a poor role model? The only sure way to find out, is to remove her from her home for a period of time, put her on a healthier regiment of diet and exercise...and get both the mom and daughter in counseling. This girl is old enough though that with the right direction, she could change for the better on her own, even if her mother is unable or unwilling to change her unhealthy lifestyle.

hmmmm, a lot of times when people are overeating it is because of some mental or emotional reason not because they are addicted to food... just like when someone is bulimic or anorexic, it is a mental or emotional issue......

I agree, but it's not just overeating for many who are overweight, it's an improper diet and lack of exercise. I forgot the percentage of how many children are overweight in America today compared to 20 years ago, but it is of epidemic proportions. So we either have a lot of children with addictive personalities or emotional problems that we didn't have before, or perhaps kids today are not eating as healthy as the kids of yesterday, nor getting the right amount of exercise.

There's a bunch of reasons for that - we live in a fast food culture where its more convenient to pile on the calories than it is to burn them off, and sedentary lifestyles exacerbated by sedentary leisure activities (like videogames). Also additives to food like HFCS and the huge marketing operations carried out by the manufacturers of processed foods.

Extreme cases like this one - I would argue are the result of mental/emotional problems.

[Peikko 1,575]

It seems there are still people who think that being morbidly obese, bullimic, anorexic etc are lifestyle choices as apposed to recognized mental disorders - hence comments like "I'd rather see the money going to really sick children like cancer patients". This 15 year old is really sick just like a cancer patient. She is not lazy and she certainly didn't choose to be morbidly obese. Being a little overweight is a totally different problem.

Addiction isn't an easy thing to overcome and this comparison to smoking is just not helpful. Some people can quit smoking or other addictive substances relatively easily because they are only addicticted physically to the drug, it's not a compulsive behaviour that is masking some deep seated pyscological disorder. Those who do have the psycological compulsive disorder as well have immense difficulty quitting anything be it drugs, alcohol, gambling, not eating, over eating even compulsive cleaning and as even the expert's understanding of this is imperfect, many times the addict is not cured and what they are compelled to do will eventually kill them.

I feel sorry for this person as I feel sorry for anyone who has to deal with an illness that is either incurable and/or is difficult to cure.

Edited to add

I also meant to address the mother's role in this. While it might have helped to have her removed from her mother's care it might also have exacerbated the problem. It's extremely hard to know what effect removal from another loved one would do if the original problem was caused by the loss of a loved one. It seems so simple, take away the food and problem solved and would that it was.

Edited August 4, 2008 by Purple_Hibiscus

[Marilyn. 340]

yeah she lost her father.. I don't think removing her from her mother would have helped the situation...

[one...two...tree 2,762]

It seems there are still people who think that being morbidly obese, bullimic, anorexic etc are lifestyle choices as apposed to recognized mental disorders - hence comments like "I'd rather see the money going to really sick children like cancer patients". This 15 year old is really sick just like a cancer patient. She is not lazy and she certainly didn't choose to be morbidly obese. Being a little overweight is a totally different problem.

Addiction isn't an easy thing to overcome and this comparison to smoking is just not helpful. Some people can quit smoking or other addictive substances relatively easily because they are only addicticted physically to the drug, it's not a compulsive behaviour that is masking some deep seated pyscological disorder. Those who do have the psycological compulsive disorder as well have immense difficulty quitting anything be it drugs, alcohol, gambling, not eating, over eating even compulsive cleaning and as even the expert's understanding of this is imperfect, many times the addict is not cured and what they are compelled to do will eventually kill them.

I feel sorry for this person as I feel sorry for anyone who has to deal with an illness that is either incurable and/or is difficult to cure.

Edited to add

I also meant to address the mother's role in this. While it might have helped to have her removed from her mother's care it might also have exacerbated the problem. It's extremely hard to know what effect removal from another loved one would do if the original problem was caused by the loss of a loved one. It seems so simple, take away the food and problem solved and would that it was.

PH, since there's no sure way of diagnosing what is at the root of this girl's obesity by keeping her in the environment she is, wouldn't make sense to find out? And given her grave condition, wouldn't it make sense (if possible), to temporarily remove her from the environment that she is currently in? A 15 year going off to Summer Camp, for example, would not be traumatic for either the child, nor the parent. Let the mother come and visit her daughter while she is being helped. Have them both attend counseling together. These are all things that would be done if the girl was anorexic. The point is, the girl needs help outside of the home before she dies and worrying about separating a 15 year old from her mommy should be least of concerns, IMO.

Edited August 4, 2008 by Jabberwocky

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I don't understand the tendency to try and suggest magic solutions to other people's problems - especially in the realm of mental health.

Anyone who doesn't have or hasn't had a relative, spouse or close friend go through some sort of mental/emotional disorder really has no context with which to understand it (or attempt to) - and even when you do its easy to fall back on clicheed social stigmas about "mad people".

Unfortunately talk is often cheap and its often easier to harp on about good old personal responsiblity and the like and characterise sick people as lazy who could get their heads together if they so wanted. If only it were that easy...

[Marilyn. 340]

It seems there are still people who think that being morbidly obese, bullimic, anorexic etc are lifestyle choices as apposed to recognized mental disorders - hence comments like "I'd rather see the money going to really sick children like cancer patients". This 15 year old is really sick just like a cancer patient. She is not lazy and she certainly didn't choose to be morbidly obese. Being a little overweight is a totally different problem.

Addiction isn't an easy thing to overcome and this comparison to smoking is just not helpful. Some people can quit smoking or other addictive substances relatively easily because they are only addicticted physically to the drug, it's not a compulsive behaviour that is masking some deep seated pyscological disorder. Those who do have the psycological compulsive disorder as well have immense difficulty quitting anything be it drugs, alcohol, gambling, not eating, over eating even compulsive cleaning and as even the expert's understanding of this is imperfect, many times the addict is not cured and what they are compelled to do will eventually kill them.

I feel sorry for this person as I feel sorry for anyone who has to deal with an illness that is either incurable and/or is difficult to cure.

Edited to add

I also meant to address the mother's role in this. While it might have helped to have her removed from her mother's care it might also have exacerbated the problem. It's extremely hard to know what effect removal from another loved one would do if the original problem was caused by the loss of a loved one. It seems so simple, take away the food and problem solved and would that it was.

PH, since there's no sure way of diagnosing what is at the root of this girl's obesity, wouldn't make sense to find out? And given her grave condition, wouldn't it make sense (if possible), to temporarily remove her from the environment that she is currently in? A 15 year going off to Summer Camp, for example, would not be traumatic for either the child, nor the parent. Let the mother come and visit her daughter while she is being helped. Have them both attend counseling together. These are all things that would be done if the girl was anorexic. The point is, the girl needs help outside of the home before she dies and worrying about separating a 15 year old from her mommy should be least of concerns, IMO.

I think PH is referring to if they removed her when she was younger not now....

Edited August 4, 2008 by *Marilyn*

[Peikko 1,575]

Actually, I was addressing the point that this mother is necessarily in control of the child's obesity. I say that it's not at all clear that this is true. I don't know what the reason is and I certainly don't think that it is wrong at this stage to try various interventions although I was worried about the 'fat camp' scenario when someone on this thread mentioned the success rate wasn't all that promising. My point is that to simply say, well, the mother must be feeding her too much therefor she is abusive is just simplistic.

And what Marilyn said too. Thanks M.

Edited August 4, 2008 by Purple_Hibiscus

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

It seems there are still people who think that being morbidly obese, bullimic, anorexic etc are lifestyle choices as apposed to recognized mental disorders - hence comments like "I'd rather see the money going to really sick children like cancer patients". This 15 year old is really sick just like a cancer patient. She is not lazy and she certainly didn't choose to be morbidly obese. Being a little overweight is a totally different problem.

Addiction isn't an easy thing to overcome and this comparison to smoking is just not helpful. Some people can quit smoking or other addictive substances relatively easily because they are only addicticted physically to the drug, it's not a compulsive behaviour that is masking some deep seated pyscological disorder. Those who do have the psycological compulsive disorder as well have immense difficulty quitting anything be it drugs, alcohol, gambling, not eating, over eating even compulsive cleaning and as even the expert's understanding of this is imperfect, many times the addict is not cured and what they are compelled to do will eventually kill them.

I feel sorry for this person as I feel sorry for anyone who has to deal with an illness that is either incurable and/or is difficult to cure.

Edited to add

I also meant to address the mother's role in this. While it might have helped to have her removed from her mother's care it might also have exacerbated the problem. It's extremely hard to know what effect removal from another loved one would do if the original problem was caused by the loss of a loved one. It seems so simple, take away the food and problem solved and would that it was.

PH, since there's no sure way of diagnosing what is at the root of this girl's obesity, wouldn't make sense to find out? And given her grave condition, wouldn't it make sense (if possible), to temporarily remove her from the environment that she is currently in? A 15 year going off to Summer Camp, for example, would not be traumatic for either the child, nor the parent. Let the mother come and visit her daughter while she is being helped. Have them both attend counseling together. These are all things that would be done if the girl was anorexic. The point is, the girl needs help outside of the home before she dies and worrying about separating a 15 year old from her mommy should be least of concerns, IMO.

As I said earlier - I don't think this is possible in the UK. Social services don't cater for things like this residentially - and care homes (where they send orphans, or troubled/abused kids) aren't environments that are helpful to emotional or mental problems. Of course all this really depends on how close the girl is to her mother - if she has image problems and few friends, it could well make things worse. Certainly not a decision that could be made my random members of the public - but rather trained professionals...

In any case - social services only take children into care as a last resort (usually if there is beating or sexual abuse going on).

Also agree with PH's comments above - there is mention in the article that the girl is banned from the cafeteria but still gets her friends to sneak her things. You can't exactly say the mother is responsible for that...

Edited August 4, 2008 by Number 6

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Actually, I was addressing the point that this mother is necessarily in control of the child's obesity. I say that it's not at all clear that this is true. I don't know what the reason is and I certainly don't think that it is wrong at this stage to try various interventions although I was worried about the 'fat camp' scenario when someone on this thread mentioned the success rate wasn't all that promising. My point is that to simply say, well, the mother must be feeding her too much therefor she is abusive is just simplistic.

And what Marilyn said too. Thanks M.

A parent with any kind of emotional or mental disorder is still a parent and legally responsible for their child. I understand the sympathy side of it, but I think it's pretty straight forward that when a child is not properly being cared for, the parents bare the weight of that responsibility. Her mother may have legitimate reasons why she has been unable to help her daughter, but that doesn't give her an excuse. Neglect is neglect...whether it's because of a mental disorder, alcoholism or drug abuse, it's still neglect.

[Amby 490]

I will be sure to check for updates on this story to see if she is successful

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I think if we were talking about a disorder like Schizophrenia where the parent couldn't function as the child's guardian on a basic level - then the child would be taken into care. With this its far less clear - as some legal judgement has to be made on the part of the social services that the mother is abusing her child. I don't think that's easy to establish here...

[Peikko 1,575]

Jaberwocky, my argument has nothing to do with sympathy but is about giving the child the best possible environment to beat the addiction she is suffering from and placing her in care may or may not have been a great idea when these psychological problems began. It's not at all clear that it would have been nor is it at all clear that that would have been possible. What is clear is that she didn't recieve any treatment and that may be because the mother sought help but wasn't given any, we don't know.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Jaberwocky, my argument has nothing to do with sympathy but is about giving the child the best possible environment to beat the addiction she is suffering from and placing her in care may or may not have been a great idea when these psychological problems began. It's not at all clear that it would have been nor is it at all clear that that would have been possible. What is clear is that she didn't recieve any treatment and that may be because the mother sought help but wasn't given any, we don't know.

I just wish you'd acknowledge the responsibility of the mother - not to point at her and tell her she's a bad mother, but to look at this child's problem as being a family condition, rather than an individual condition. That is what most addictive treatment focuses on - it's a condition that stems from the environment of the family rather than just the individual....and that's an important distinction when looking for solutions.