The United States of America - my thoughts so far

[Captain Oates 911]

Ok I can understand where you are coming from there. It is awfully hard to know you are supposedly the "best" when you have never been anywhere else. Not to mention that different groups of people have different definitions of what greatness entails.

One thing that always has annoyed me is the rampant dislike of France from those who have never been there. My experiences in France have been almost positive...except for a Algerian on a Montemartre street who called me an "American Pr*ck" as I went to do my laundry. I actually found it more hilarious than anything.

Yes it's because he has never lived in America and knows nothing of americans

I criticize the Uk and the US and France and everywhere really as I like to seek out the 'best' way to do things

But it doesnt mean I am anti these countries overall because I compliment them too

An american family literally saved me and took me in when i was in trouble in saudi arabia (a brit refused to help), and I am married to an american and I chose to live in america - so I am not a good candidate to be anti-american really

But I would like it to be easier for me to say I dont like this or that without the auto response being 'well get back to your own country bud - we are the best that ever existed' - and I suspect that the overly nationalistic rabble rousing of the political parties is to blame and that left to their own devices, the american people would just be people.

Perhaps its me deploring universal aspects of human nature, rather than specific americans responses

The aclimatisation goes on - but I wish the flag waving and roar of 'USA' would stop, and the place looked more like Germany now than Germany then

[bakofoil 27]

Nope, it's preposterous to claim that the US is at ease with the idea of a black head of government and the UK isnt

And that's not what I was suggesting ....only that we have come much closer to achieving it. I guess I'm tired of my UK friends wondering if "america is ready for a black president" and if we don't elect him we are "racist" when in fact the UK is quite far from doing that themselves. And as someone who in a former life as a social research analyst interviewed Met police in work that would underpin the McPherson Report - lets just say I always become very contrary when UK people insist they are "better" when it comes to race relations than we are in the US. and I'm the first to say in the US we have a long way to go.

You know, I actually agree with most of the points you make. I don't think Britain can claim any superiority over the US on race relations until we have lived through the experience of the possibility of the election of a non-white prime minister. However, it is also unfair to compare Britain to the US in terms of achievement when the population differences are so large. When I was pondering the question of who is comparable in British Politics to Obama, Powell, Rice etc. the only person I could come up with was Bill Morris, the TGWU leader who now has a seat in the House of Lords. Obviously there are people like Paul Boateng and Valerie Amos who have been cabinet ministers but I'm not sure to what extent we can draw comparisons when American politics operates on a much larger stage. Not making excuses - just pondering the validity of a comparison.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

You know, I actually agree with most of the points you make. I don't think Britain can claim any superiority over the US on race relations until we have lived through the experience of the possibility of the election of a non-white prime minister. However, it is also unfair to compare Britain to the US in terms of achievement when the population differences are so large. When I was pondering the question of who is comparable in British Politics to Obama, Powell, Rice etc. the only person I could come up with was Bill Morris, the TGWU leader who now has a seat in the House of Lords. Obviously there are people like Paul Boateng and Valerie Amos who have been cabinet ministers but I'm not sure to what extent we can draw comparisons when American politics operates on a much larger stage. Not making excuses - just pondering the validity of a comparison.

I agree with your point - and I'm being a little contrary because I agree that the Obama claim of "only in this country is my story possible" is annoying when the UK had a prime minister who ran away from the circus to become an accountant!

[Captain Oates 911]

Nope, it's preposterous to claim that the US is at ease with the idea of a black head of government and the UK isnt

And that's not what I was suggesting ....only that we have come much closer to achieving it. I guess I'm tired of my UK friends wondering if "america is ready for a black president" and if we don't elect him we are "racist" when in fact the UK is quite far from doing that themselves. And as someone who in a former life as a social research analyst interviewed Met police in work that would underpin the McPherson Report - lets just say I always become very contrary when UK people insist they are "better" when it comes to race relations than we are in the US. and I'm the first to say in the US we have a long way to go.

That's fair and balanced - truth is that the USA is no more homegenous than anywhere else and there are racists everywhere - but in the US everything is more extreme (extreme good as well as extreme bad - it goes with the weather), so whereas in the UK some skinhead would call names or throw a beer can, in Mississippi, a black person is more likely to 'disappear' if they cross the 'good ole boys'

Racism seems to go very deep. I can understand it because it's only 20 years prior to my grandad being born that the slaves were set free - turned loose. Since then, they have gone feral in many inner cities and I don't blame them - if I were in their position I would go pretty feral myself.

The whites who caused it all and didn't sweep up their own mess by educating and including black people, then saw all the crime etc and the gulf widened to where the two communities are still very uneasy with each other.

So in those terms it's great that Obama has come as far as he has, amazing really, but there is a lot of iceberg under the water line that hasn't melted

It's a lot easier for minorities to be absorbed when there are just a few and not a huge wave and thats where the UK has gone wrong. Me and my dad worked unloading coal trucks by hand with a punchie old black ex -pro boxer - we were all deep black with the coal dust and I didn't even think about the guy's colour until years later ! I never saw the slightest discrimination against him in our small town, and he lived with a white woman too and walked to the pub where everyone made him popular and asked about his former career and laughed and joked with him all night - he was 'walter the boxer ', not 'the black guy'

From that I have always thought that slow careful integration is possible but push it too fast and there are problems - bit like introducing two tigers to each other - do it slowly or they will rip each others heads off rather than mating

[bakofoil 27]

I agree with your point - and I'm being a little contrary because I agree that the Obama claim of "only in this country is my story possible" is annoying when the UK had a prime minister who ran away from the circus to become an accountant!

Running away from the circus to become an accountant is so romantic!

[Jeraly 4]

I agree with your point - and I'm being a little contrary because I agree that the Obama claim of "only in this country is my story possible" is annoying when the UK had a prime minister who ran away from the circus to become an accountant!

Running away from the circus to become an accountant is so romantic!

[Captain Oates 911]

I agree with your point - and I'm being a little contrary because I agree that the Obama claim of "only in this country is my story possible" is annoying when the UK had a prime minister who ran away from the circus to become an accountant!

Running away from the circus to become an accountant is so romantic!

Running away from accountancy to the deserts of Washington State isnt as romantic - but at least I can go looking for rattlesnakes instead of them looking for me

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

My husband once made a website where the only thing on it was John Major's recipe for French onion soup. Why he did this, I will never know......

[Captain Oates 911]

My husband once made a website where the only thing on it was John Major's recipe for French onion soup. Why he did this, I will never know......

Trapeze artists son who is prime minister, bonks respectable Jewish lady cabinet minister in between games of cricket !

Never mind 'only in america' - I say 'only in England !'

beat that Obama !

[bakofoil 27]

My husband once made a website where the only thing on it was John Major's recipe for French onion soup. Why he did this, I will never know......

Lol! It is hard to leave a comment on this without insulting your husband.

[Captain Oates 911]

My husband once made a website where the only thing on it was John Major's recipe for French onion soup. Why he did this, I will never know......

Lol! It is hard to leave a comment on this without insulting your husband.

That's what husbands are for - in both countries

always have been

hence:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_scold

I note that the americans repealed it before the Brits - so one up for the USA in the civilisation process.

or was it ? ....

Edited September 10, 2008 by saywhat