Section8 program cause of rising crime in midsize cities across America

[Niels Bohr 72]

I was just saying I did chores too. I know people work hard.

So that's why you post things like this?

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1910127

Don't hate on me because I was lucky to have a wealthy family. Jealousy is overrated.

Amber, no one is hating on you for being born into a wealthy family. It's just that you are very dismissive of other people's struggles and you do often make comments that come across as a bit spoiled. I know I am not jealous and I doubt most people here are. That's not what it's about. It's about wishing that maybe you would be less dismissive. It's kind of like saying "gee sorry you aren't as beautiful as I am" and then saying that it's not your fault you're born that way.

It's not my "fault" I was born this way either. I'm not dismissive of struggles. I try to compare things even if the comparisons are completely #######. I know most people work hard for the things they have, but I'm not going to apologize for not working too much for the things I have.

Well, Amber, I grew up in public housing. I know the struggles. As a matter of fact, many famous people and overly wealthy people came from these areas as well. Wrong to stereotype as my prior post mentioned.

[Heracles 417]

ugh....I loathe section 8 housing. all those trashy kids running around with no one telling them no.........

Sounds like a lot of the spoiled brats from the Escalade end of our town. But hey, none of those Mommas have a daily little helper that helps them crash and burn while the kiddies are out on play dates now, do they?

Maybe it isn't the poverty as much as the parenting.

You got that right. I don't buy this they are poor ####### because similar disorderly behavior also comes from well off and middle class kids. The obvious factor is that in this generation poor American kids are more likely to have one parent who, to be honest, is less likely to give a ####.

[Heracles 417]

Well, Amber, I grew up in public housing. I know the struggles. As a matter of fact, many famous people and overly wealthy people came from these areas as well. Wrong to stereotype as my prior post mentioned.

but I bet you had good parent/s. Not one/s on crack who abandoned you.

[HAL 9000 96]

The public library where I live is mostly seniors (senior housing is a hop and skip away) and young immigrant mothers with their children (dropped off by their husbands because the library is air conditioned).

I don't see too many older kids, but I am told the other public library (our town has 2) is "where it's at". I've even heard stories of middle schoolers having sex in the computer room in that one!

Geeks.

LOL myspace and sex go perfect together

Myspace? You're behind the times, Trollie. All the cool kids are on Facebook these days.

Fo-Sho G

[Heracles 417]

Section 8 are a failure. A breading ground for crime.

The system refuses to deal with the troublemakers so the entire complex is brought down. Government housing should have zero tolerance of certain offenses and two strikes and you are out with other breaches policies. Simple as that. They need to have strict rules like any other private housing community.

This is just a band-aid fix to a complicated issue for the US though. Crime is almost glamorized here in certain communities. The laws allow the criminals to always be a few steps ahead of the police. The nations capital after all has one of the worst crimes rates in the country. That is freakin embarrassing.

Edited June 23, 2008 by Boo-Yah!

[HAL 9000 96]

Ultimately the question is what to do with the poor people..... they have to live somewhere.

I think instead of moving poor people around there should be ways to make them not poor and not uneducated at the same time. I think that may be a novel thought for some to swallow.

[Heracles 417]

Ultimately the question is what to do with the poor people..... they have to live somewhere.

I think instead of moving poor people around there should be ways to make them not poor and not uneducated at the same time. I think that may be a novel thought for some to swallow.

Education is the key but how do we get them educated when their own parent/s don't care whether they go to school or do their homework or even obey the laws. Just this weekend I met a teacher from Flint Michigan and the stories she had to tell me about high school students says a lot. If I dared cursed let alone threatened a teacher my dad would have disciplined me at school; in front of the other kids. Hence why I never did it.

I don't know of any professional who was a gansta yet somehow became a scholar. You are speaking about theoretically solutions but the reality, in America, is far from that. These kids don't even respect a teacher or the laws yet you somehow believe we should try educating them. Not going to happen.

Edited June 23, 2008 by Boo-Yah!

[zqt3344 21]

And now that is warm hot weather, they will all be coming inside that library to cool off and sit in the AC all day long. They have turned this library into a taxpayer subsidized babysitter for their Section 8 housing sect!

ugh....I loathe section 8 housing. all those trashy kids running around with no one telling them no. they had built some brand new apartments across the road from the library and part of them were section 8. they have to have a police officer in the library because the parents drop their kids off at the library so they don't have to pay for a sitter. they steal stuff, make loads of noise, and drive people crazy. they've started ticketing parents who leave their kids there all day in the summer now.

[HAL 9000 96]

Ultimately the question is what to do with the poor people..... they have to live somewhere.

I think instead of moving poor people around there should be ways to make them not poor and not uneducated at the same time. I think that may be a novel thought for some to swallow.

Education is the key but how do we get them educated when their own parent/s don't care whether they go to school or do their homework or even obey the laws. Just this weekend I met a teacher from Flint Michigan and the stories she had to tell me about high school students says a lot. If I dared cursed let alone threatened a teacher my dad would have disciplined me at school; in front of the other kids. Hence why I never did it.

I don't know of any professional who was a gansta yet somehow became a scholar. You are speaking about theoretically solutions but the reality, in America, is far from that. These kids don't even respect a teacher or the laws yet you somehow believe we should try educating them. Not going to happen.

In three years as a public school teacher in an inner city setting of immigrants (among other diverse populations) I have knowledge of roughly 30 students (out of 450 over the three years) that are now pre-med/life science undergraduates (a couple credit me with the influence, sadly), 25 that went into engineering, 15 into nursing, another 10 into the arts, and I think about 300 or so into business administration. Last I checked, the rest either went into military, to work, or unknown professions. Not that bad or bleak. And many of these kids were of the 'gangsta' phenotype.

[Heracles 417]

In three years as a public school teacher in an inner city setting of immigrants (among other diverse populations) I have knowledge of roughly 30 students (out of 450 over the three years) that are now pre-med/life science undergraduates (a couple credit me with the influence, sadly), 25 that went into engineering, 15 into nursing, another 10 into the arts, and I think about 300 or so into business administration. Last I checked, the rest either went into military, to work, or unknown professions. Not that bad or bleak. And many of these kids were of the 'gangsta' phenotype.

Immigrants are a whole different kettle of fish.

[zqt3344 21]

Agreed, they have not been indoctrinated with all the feel sorry for me stuff and I am so discriminated against stuff and Whitey did it to me stuff yet! Thus they take advantage of every opportunity like the rest of us are offered and make the most of it.

In three years as a public school teacher in an inner city setting of immigrants (among other diverse populations) I have knowledge of roughly 30 students (out of 450 over the three years) that are now pre-med/life science undergraduates (a couple credit me with the influence, sadly), 25 that went into engineering, 15 into nursing, another 10 into the arts, and I think about 300 or so into business administration. Last I checked, the rest either went into military, to work, or unknown professions. Not that bad or bleak. And many of these kids were of the 'gangsta' phenotype.

Immigrants are a whole different kettle of fish.

[Niels Bohr 72]

In three years as a public school teacher in an inner city setting of immigrants (among other diverse populations) I have knowledge of roughly 30 students (out of 450 over the three years) that are now pre-med/life science undergraduates (a couple credit me with the influence, sadly), 25 that went into engineering, 15 into nursing, another 10 into the arts, and I think about 300 or so into business administration. Last I checked, the rest either went into military, to work, or unknown professions. Not that bad or bleak. And many of these kids were of the 'gangsta' phenotype.

Didn't know it was a part of their genetic expression.

Same story can be viewed on a middle-class family. They have a house that's paid for already by their parents or grandparents. There's no need for them to pay-off the mortgage. They can just make enough just to pay for electricity, food, and property taxes. Therefore, many would just sit there working less and enjoy the fruits of their ancestors. And, if they need more money they can just sell the house.

The other side is the poor people who lives in rented complexes. In fact, very poor to enjoy their life. They work hard. They study harder and smarter. They know that in their future, they don't want to live a life of being a bum. They have dreams of having a house with a big lawn, a brand new car, and a family. These people have high ambitions, hence, they work and study 100% of their time.

Back in the days when I lived in public housing, it was very hard for me to invite my friends or college buddies over. Inside, I feel very intimidated that they know that I'm poor. You know what, I bite my tongue and brought them over. They know how I lived then. It inspired them all. Now I am an Engineer (Computer and Electrical), I reflect back upon my past and sometimes tears would just roll down my cheeks. My dream has come true! My buddies like me because I had nearly all A's in college. I can help them with their homework and finals, too!

Although, my English isn't very good. I am trying to write better. For my papers, I have somebody help me edit them for my professional work.

Edited June 23, 2008 by consolemaster

[Heracles 417]

Attitude and lack of responsibilities is the culprit here. It is not the schools job to parent these kids. It seems in 2008 we need to teach parents what it actually means to be a parent. Something that has obviously been forgotten by many even though it has been passed down for 10,000 years. And we are apparently supposed to be the smarter, know-it-all, generation. The status quo many kids are in is the unfortunate byproduct of the me me me post 60's generation. Whether people accept it or not. Everything has its equal and opposite reaction.

Edited June 23, 2008 by Boo-Yah!

[zqt3344 21]

Section 8 another liberal Democrat program run amok, Not surprising at all. Good plan by all those run down inner cities, go in and bulldoze the rat hole crack houses down, build back nice stuff, price out or displace all the trash people and they soon migrate and move to new places and along with them comes all their baggage. What is new, question is, IS IT BETTER TO KEEP THEM ALL IN ONE GEOGRAPHIC AREA or SPREAD THEM OUT LIKE THEY ALL ARE NOW AND DEAL WITH THEIR CRIME THAT WAY? May have been better when in one spot.

Falling crime rates have been one of the great American success stories of the past 15 years. New York and Los Angeles, once the twin capitals of violent crime, have calmed down significantly, as have most other big cities.

...

Lately, though, a new and unexpected pattern has emerged, taking criminologists by surprise. While crime rates in large cities stayed flat, homicide rates in many midsize cities (with populations of between 500,000 and 1 million) began increasing, sometimes by as much as 20 percent a year ... According to FBI data, America’s most dangerous spots are now places where Martin Scorsese would never think of staging a shoot-out—Florence, South Carolina; Charlotte-Mecklenburg, North Carolina; Kansas City, Missouri; Reading, Pennsylvania; Orlando, Florida; Memphis, Tennessee.

...

Janikowski [A criminologist with the University of Memphis] merged his computer map of crime patterns with Betts’s [a housing expert at the University of Memphis] map of Section8 rentals ... The match was near-perfect. On the merged map, dense violent-crime areas are shaded dark blue, and Section8 addresses are represented by little red dots. All of the dark-blue areas are covered in little red dots, like bursts of gunfire. The rest of the city has almost no dots.

Betts remembers her discomfort as she looked at the map ... She knew right away that this would be a “hard thing to say or write.” Nobody in the antipoverty community and nobody in city leadership was going to welcome the news that the noble experiment that they’d been engaged in for the past decade had been bringing the city down, in ways they’d never expected. But the connection was too obvious to ignore.

...

Simultaneously, the University of Louisville criminologist Geetha Suresh was tracking local patterns of violent crime ... In her research, Suresh noticed a recurring pattern, one that emerged first in the late 1990s, then again around 2002. A particularly violent neighborhood would suddenly go cold, and crime would heat up in several new neighborhoods. In each case, Suresh has now confirmed, the first hot spots were the neighborhoods around huge housing projects, and the later ones were places where people had moved when the projects were torn down. From that, she drew the obvious conclusion: “Crime is going along with them.” Except for being hand-drawn, Suresh’s map matching housing patterns with crime looks exactly like Janikowski and Betts’s.

http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200807/memphis-crime

[HAL 9000 96]

In three years as a public school teacher in an inner city setting of immigrants (among other diverse populations) I have knowledge of roughly 30 students (out of 450 over the three years) that are now pre-med/life science undergraduates (a couple credit me with the influence, sadly), 25 that went into engineering, 15 into nursing, another 10 into the arts, and I think about 300 or so into business administration. Last I checked, the rest either went into military, to work, or unknown professions. Not that bad or bleak. And many of these kids were of the 'gangsta' phenotype.

Immigrants are a whole different kettle of fish.

Among other diverse populations.

Nevertheless these were immigrants from countries associated with "hella-gangsta type politics and social dynamics."