I am sick...

[KarenCee 3]

Ex is being a jerk again...which is nothing unusual. This time, however, he is hurting Anna in the process. He is refusing to sign the Consent to Travel letter. He's signed it before without a problem. I always give him a complete itinerary, along with the address where we'll be staying and several contact numbers. Now, because he's pissed off at me about a completely unrelated issue, he is refusing to sign this document. I am literally physically nauseated at this...Joel's mom paid for these tickets and just last week he was all set to sign them and now he's jerking her around like this.

This is what I found on the cbsa website:

http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/pu...1-eng.html#P004

<h2 class="bb">Bringing children into Canada</h2> Border services officers are on alert for children who need protection. Children under the age of 18 are classified as minors and are subject to the same entry requirements as any other visitor to Canada.

We will conduct a more detailed examination of minors entering Canada without proper identification or those travelling in the company of adults other than their parents or legal guardian(s). This additional scrutiny helps ensure the safety of the children.

Minors travelling alone must have proof of citizenship and a letter from both parents detailing the length of stay, providing the parents’ telephone number and authorizing the person waiting for them to take care of them while they are in Canada.

If you are travelling with minors, you must carry proper identification for each child such as a birth certificate, passport, citizenship card, permanent resident card or Certificate of Indian Status.

If you are divorced or separated, you should carry with you copies of the legal custody agreements for your children. If you are travelling with minors and you are not their parent/guardian, you should have written permission from the parent/guardian authorizing the trip. The letter should include addresses and telephone numbers of where the parents or guardian can be reached and identify a person who can confirm that the children are not being abducted or taken against their will.

If you are travelling with a group of vehicles, make sure you arrive at the border in the same vehicle as your children, to avoid any confusion.

================================================================================

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I guess my question is this: The part in red...since I *AM* her parent and I have primary physical custody, would I even NEED this document? I've had it before, and maybe it's at the discretion of the CBP, but I have always traveled with my divorce decree that states the child custody arrangements and travel requirements. I've emailed Neiks (can anyone suggest anyone else?) to ask if there's anything I can do to keep this from happening. God I am so sick....

[Cassie 8]

try zyggy too, he was/is still a border agent, he might have some insight

your ex sucks long time, does he not realize that she'll remember that he pulled ####### like this and dislike him for it later??? :bonk: :bonk:

So sorry, Karen *hugs*

[Leafgal 3]

Ex is being a jerk again...which is nothing unusual. This time, however, he is hurting Anna in the process. He is refusing to sign the Consent to Travel letter. He's signed it before without a problem. I always give him a complete itinerary, along with the address where we'll be staying and several contact numbers. Now, because he's pissed off at me about a completely unrelated issue, he is refusing to sign this document. I am literally physically nauseated at this...Joel's mom paid for these tickets and just last week he was all set to sign them and now he's jerking her around like this.

This is what I found on the cbsa website:

http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/pu...1-eng.html#P004

<h2 class="bb">Bringing children into Canada</h2> Border services officers are on alert for children who need protection. Children under the age of 18 are classified as minors and are subject to the same entry requirements as any other visitor to Canada.

We will conduct a more detailed examination of minors entering Canada without proper identification or those travelling in the company of adults other than their parents or legal guardian(s). This additional scrutiny helps ensure the safety of the children.

Minors travelling alone must have proof of citizenship and a letter from both parents detailing the length of stay, providing the parents’ telephone number and authorizing the person waiting for them to take care of them while they are in Canada.

If you are travelling with minors, you must carry proper identification for each child such as a birth certificate, passport, citizenship card, permanent resident card or Certificate of Indian Status.

If you are divorced or separated, you should carry with you copies of the legal custody agreements for your children. If you are travelling with minors and you are not their parent/guardian, you should have written permission from the parent/guardian authorizing the trip. The letter should include addresses and telephone numbers of where the parents or guardian can be reached and identify a person who can confirm that the children are not being abducted or taken against their will.

If you are travelling with a group of vehicles, make sure you arrive at the border in the same vehicle as your children, to avoid any confusion.

================================================================================

=============

I guess my question is this: The part in red...since I *AM* her parent and I have primary physical custody, would I even NEED this document? I've had it before, and maybe it's at the discretion of the CBP, but I have always traveled with my divorce decree that states the child custody arrangements and travel requirements. I've emailed Neiks (can anyone suggest anyone else?) to ask if there's anything I can do to keep this from happening. God I am so sick....

Karen I am so sorry to hear about this, been there done that myself sort of. I was taking my kids on a trip within Canada and my ex told me he would not give me persmission and I had the plane tickets (courtesy of my mother, having all of her grandchildren present for Christmas that year). I hired a lawyer to force the issue and he changed his mind but cost me for the lawyer in order to get him to change his mind. I don't know the answer to your question, but I know you will find the answer and get this resolved before you leave. Is there any chance he will change his mind (I know that is a stupid question) just asking from history what you think he will do.

[Leafgal 3]

try zyggy too, he was/is still a border agent, he might have some insight

your ex sucks long time, does he not realize that she'll remember that he pulled ####### like this and dislike him for it later??? :bonk: :bonk:

So sorry, Karen *hugs*

I also agree with this, kids aren't stupid and they remember things. My youngest son who is now 22 and his father don't have a very good relationship and part of the reason is how things were handled by his dad, even though I kept telling him it wasn't his concern, but it did concern him with the things my ex did to try and get back at me.

[KarenCee 3]

Anna is very upset about this...she has cried quite a bit about it. I'm frantic, tbh. I've googled, searched everywhere else, and I'm about ready to call Canada Customs just to see what they tell me...then again, that might make things worse.

I would hate for any child to hate their parent, but I agree...she won't forget things like this. How can a man who claims to love his child do this to her? I can only hope that he will change his mind. *sigh* 9 more years of his #######....

Edited June 13, 2008 by KarenCee

[BH45 0]

Hi Karen

You have an ex like mine. I have only ever once got a letter of permission from him to take our daughter to the States. I was able to get her passport without anything from him but that could be due to the fact that I have sole custody. I have been back and forth into the states with no issues at all. I drive all the time tooo. I always have my custody order with me and there is nothing in it to state that I cannot travel with her. As well, my daughter is now 14 and speaks for herself a lot of the time.

Not sure if this is helping or not but I do know where you are coming from. I hope things work out for you both.

[pj1959us 0]

So sorry to hear he is being a jerk about this. If he signed one before, was it dated? Would you be able to use an old copy? I hope he comes to his senses soon. Any way the daughter could give "dad" her feelings on the matter directly? I wish parents would realize they are only hurting their children when they act like this.

PJ

[Sprailenes 47]

I never had a problem taking my son across. I never once took documents or anything. I was well aware of the rules but was never asked about it or anything.

[Mrs. BB 0]

I just went through this not too long ago. I was told that as long as I had certified court orders showing the custodial arrangement and her passport that would suffice. My ex would have to file paperwork barring me from taking her and get that ordered by a court before he could prevent me from taking her out of the country. As long as I was not violating the custodial arrangement I was in my right to take her. I'm the custodial parent. She lives with me. Dad has visitation rights. I was told to inform him where we could be reached, when we'd be back, etc. But unless he had a court order saying so, he could not prevent me from taking her.

Now he can threaten you with calling the border check, customs..etc....(been there, done that) but until he has a document from a court that he can present to THEM proving that you cannot take her out of the country you have a right to do so.

Also, I know that when I got my daughters passport, my ex was required to be there to sign or I needed a notarized document providing his consent. So he KNEW that this would allow me to take her out of the country and he still signed it.

If the documentation you have supports your side of the story you should be okay.

If your still unsure....for peace of mind call an attorney for a consultation. Some may even give you a few min for free.

Edited June 13, 2008 by Mrs. BB

[Marilyn. 340]

I hope things work out, Karen...

[Autumnchik 6]

Oh Karen, I am keeping you in my thoughts. I hope it works out for you. Hopefully you can find an attorney who would give you a few minutes free phone consultation.

[Nagishkaw 510]

Me too! I hope he comes around and realizes what a jerk he is being to his daughter ( and you ). God willing, he will change his tune real quick.

[KarenCee 3]

I just went through this not too long ago. I was told that as long as I had certified court orders showing the custodial arrangement and her passport that would suffice. My ex would have to file paperwork barring me from taking her and get that ordered by a court before he could prevent me from taking her out of the country. As long as I was not violating the custodial arrangement I was in my right to take her. I'm the custodial parent. She lives with me. Dad has visitation rights. I was told to inform him where we could be reached, when we'd be back, etc. But unless he had a court order saying so, he could not prevent me from taking her.

Now he can threaten you with calling the border check, customs..etc....(been there, done that) but until he has a document from a court that he can present to THEM proving that you cannot take her out of the country you have a right to do so.

Also, I know that when I got my daughters passport, my ex was required to be there to sign or I needed a notarized document providing his consent. So he KNEW that this would allow me to take her out of the country and he still signed it.

If the documentation you have supports your side of the story you should be okay.

If your still unsure....for peace of mind call an attorney for a consultation. Some may even give you a few min for free.

Documentation that I have:

Divorce Decree that says I have primary physical custody. In the decree it states that I have to tell him of her travel plans and provide an itinerary for him with dates, contact info, and address(es) where we will be staying. It says nothing about needing his permission.

She has a passport already...and yes, he signed the consent form for that too, so he KNEW what it was for and that she would need it for travel.

Her birth certificate that has my former name, which matches the name in my passport (I will also take my marriage cert.)

A page off the Canada Border Security website that addresses traveling with children - what the requirements are if you are the parent or if you are not the parent. All it says is if you are NOT the parent, you need written consent.

I plan on calling an attorney next week...to see if there is an action I can take to prevent this from happening again...something like a document from a judge declaring that I have permission to take her across the border one or two times a year. Not sure if there is anything like that, but I guess it can't hurt to find out.

Thank you all for helping me...or just being here for me. I don't know what I would do without you guys.

[Mrs. BB 0]

I just went through this not too long ago. I was told that as long as I had certified court orders showing the custodial arrangement and her passport that would suffice. My ex would have to file paperwork barring me from taking her and get that ordered by a court before he could prevent me from taking her out of the country. As long as I was not violating the custodial arrangement I was in my right to take her. I'm the custodial parent. She lives with me. Dad has visitation rights. I was told to inform him where we could be reached, when we'd be back, etc. But unless he had a court order saying so, he could not prevent me from taking her.

Now he can threaten you with calling the border check, customs..etc....(been there, done that) but until he has a document from a court that he can present to THEM proving that you cannot take her out of the country you have a right to do so.

Also, I know that when I got my daughters passport, my ex was required to be there to sign or I needed a notarized document providing his consent. So he KNEW that this would allow me to take her out of the country and he still signed it.

If the documentation you have supports your side of the story you should be okay.

If your still unsure....for peace of mind call an attorney for a consultation. Some may even give you a few min for free.

Documentation that I have:

Divorce Decree that says I have primary physical custody. In the decree it states that I have to tell him of her travel plans and provide an itinerary for him with dates, contact info, and address(es) where we will be staying. It says nothing about needing his permission.

She has a passport already...and yes, he signed the consent form for that too, so he KNEW what it was for and that she would need it for travel.

Her birth certificate that has my former name, which matches the name in my passport (I will also take my marriage cert.)

A page off the Canada Border Security website that addresses traveling with children - what the requirements are if you are the parent or if you are not the parent. All it says is if you are NOT the parent, you need written consent.

I plan on calling an attorney next week...to see if there is an action I can take to prevent this from happening again...something like a document from a judge declaring that I have permission to take her across the border one or two times a year. Not sure if there is anything like that, but I guess it can't hurt to find out.

Thank you all for helping me...or just being here for me. I don't know what I would do without you guys.

You should be just fine. If your court order does not state you need his written permission you should be in the clear.

I live in San Diego California, and being a border town our courts and borders are pretty darn strict. People try to take kids across the border all the time here and I have never had a problem. If you are prepared and have all the proper and legal documentation I doubt if you will have a single hassle.

I could see problems with him getting a court order if he could prove that you were not returning or if State Law required his consent. But in my experience that is usually in the final court orders. Usually there is something in there stating that you cannot remove the child out of the (pick one) county, state, country without written permission from the other parent.

Also if you are the primary custodial parent the courts will take into account that you will take vacations, and your child with you. You may be able to get something signed by a judge allowing you to have a certain number of weeks a year for international travel. Just remember if you get that on a court order you have to stick to that. So if you only get 2 weeks a year that limits you and if you stay longer than that for whatever reason: ie, canceled flights...whatever....it gives him leverage.

You've got support. Hang in there.

[~Laura and Nick~ 5]

Karen...I just wanted to say I'm so sorry you are going through this

Keep strong hon