Curious MENA question...

[Nasturtium 500]

Hey all, science (which is not part of my question) is not a religion or a belief system. Science is just a tool used in acquiring knowledge. Science does not come up with concrete answers, usually, and cannot PROVE anything. Science is using observation and testing to either support or not support a hypothesis. For something to be supported, it has to be an experiment which can be replicated by many people. Science in itself cannot be "wrong." Science in itself also cannot be "believed" in. Science is just a means. It is like a mathematical equation. They cannot be wrong, nor can you believe in an equation... but you can believe in the results or something can be misapplied. Think of science like a wrench.

Now,

Edited May 27, 2008 by julianna

[SaadBell 0]

I have read the Quran, 4 times, also the bible 7 times, so I need to re-read them because I didn't find many answers. Both books are confusing, I have to say the bible is over the top confusing, but yea to be such a divine book, it didn’t leave me much inspired. Lots of rules, so many different rules, makes no sense to me, but more power to you, that you understand. I also noticed that there are tons of contradictions, one time they state this is the way to do things, the next they break that and state that God had told them to do this now. But when they hear the word of this God, no one is around, strange. Books are hard reads to be sure, I even did a presentation on Islam in college, so I am familiar with some of the beliefs, but I am no means an expert.

[geenee 0]

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran. Just as the bible. The holy quran also says Allah is all forgiving and merciful. The bible says to stone ur son in the center of town if he shall disobey u. And the holy quran sayst the cheater shall be confined to his house until death.

[Nagishkaw 510]

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran. Just as the bible. The holy quran also says Allah is all forgiving and merciful. The bible says to stone ur son in the center of town if he shall disobey u. And the holy quran sayst the cheater shall be confined to his house until death.

First of all, I love this thread and am learning so much. Thank you, OP Julianna for starting it, and thank you all who have participated thus far.

Now as far as the Bible saying to stone your son in the centre of town if he disobeys you...Seems I read this book a lot yet I have not come across this. Could you tell me where you found this particular passage?

Edited May 27, 2008 by Nagishkaw

[Nasturtium 500]

I also noticed that there are tons of contradictions, one time they state this is the way to do things, the next they break that and state that God had told them to do this now.

Where would this be?

[SaadBell 0]

By the way they stone people in Iran, what is your stand on stoning people to death?

[Sofiyya 1,687]

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran. Just as the bible. The holy quran also says Allah is all forgiving and merciful. The bible says to stone ur son in the center of town if he shall disobey u. And the holy quran sayst the cheater shall be confined to his house until death.

Islam has existed since Adam; it is not irrelevent. It's laws haven't changed, although how to implement or enforce them has varied according to the society in question. That is no justification for ignoring the fact that God has given us rules to live by, and we are given the choice to ignore them or not, at our own peril.

You're welcome, Nagi!

Edited May 27, 2008 by Virtual wife

[Nasturtium 500]

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran. Just as the bible. The holy quran also says Allah is all forgiving and merciful. The bible says to stone ur son in the center of town if he shall disobey u. And the holy quran sayst the cheater shall be confined to his house until death.

Deut 21:18-21:

18 “If any man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey his father or his mother, and when they chastise him, he will not even listen to them, 19 then his father and mother shall seize him, and bring him out to the elders of his city at the gateway of his hometown. 20 “They shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey us, he is a glutton and a drunkard.’ 21 “Then all the men of his city shall stone him to death; so you shall remove the evil from your midst, and all Israel will hear of it and fear.

Sorry, it's not just if the son disobeys you. That would also involve breaking a lot of commandments.

[Alhamdulillah 0]

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran.

I don't believe religion is meant to be changed by men because of times changing....

[geenee 0]

I have read the Quran, 4 times, also the bible 7 times, so I need to re-read them because I didn't find many answers. Both books are confusing, I have to say the bible is over the top confusing, but yea to be such a divine book, it didn’t leave me much inspired. Lots of rules, so many different rules, makes no sense to me, but more power to you, that you understand. I also noticed that there are tons of contradictions, one time they state this is the way to do things, the next they break that and state that God had told them to do this now. But when they hear the word of this God, no one is around, strange. Books are hard reads to be sure, I even did a presentation on Islam in college, so I am familiar with some of the beliefs, but I am no means an expert.

I understand what u r saying G G but here is the thing... without religion people seem to be free to think there is no consiquences for their actions. This is axactlly why we have so many things going bad here in the great US of A.

Here is something to chew on... When I was in Jordan I wondered why so many children were free to walk alone in the streets with no adult watching them to not leave thier eyesight. Here in the US we dont do that... I mean some of my kids are teens and I wont let my girl walk home from school. Freedom to commit hanis crimes seems to be a real problem we are having.

Now... my sister is a sex offender thereapist ....not exactlly a glorious job, but we love life and we love to give everyone the right to life here in the US. Its great but where is their fear? What are these sick individuals affraid of? Not much.

They should fear God. No matter what way they look at it they should fear God's answer to thier crimes.

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran.

I don't believe religion is meant to be changed by men because of times changing....

not changed just understood in a manor that fits our changing evolving lives

[Nagishkaw 510]

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran. Just as the bible. The holy quran also says Allah is all forgiving and merciful. The bible says to stone ur son in the center of town if he shall disobey u. And the holy quran sayst the cheater shall be confined to his house until death.

Deut 21:18-21:

18 “If any man has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey his father or his mother, and when they chastise him, he will not even listen to them, 19 then his father and mother shall seize him, and bring him out to the elders of his city at the gateway of his hometown. 20 “They shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey us, he is a glutton and a drunkard.’ 21 “Then all the men of his city shall stone him to death; so you shall remove the evil from your midst, and all Israel will hear of it and fear.

Sorry, it's not just if the son disobeys you. That would also involve breaking a lot of commandments.

Then one can say this was true under the ' old law' ? But are we as Christians not bound by the ' old ' law' ?

[geenee 0]

We also need to remember todays day and age has very much changed from the days of the holy quran. Just as the bible. The holy quran also says Allah is all forgiving and merciful. The bible says to stone ur son in the center of town if he shall disobey u. And the holy quran sayst the cheater shall be confined to his house until death.

Islam has existed since Adam; it is not irrelevent. It's laws haven't changed, although how to implement or enforce them has varied according to the society in question. That is no justification for ignoring the fact that God has given us rules to live by, and we are given the choice to ignore them or not, at our own peril.

You're welcome, Nagi!

nicely put!!!

[Sofiyya 1,687]

By the way they stone people in Iran, what is your stand on stoning people to death?

Stoning is not in the Quran, but it is in the Sunnah of the Prophet. It is told that it was taken from Jewish law as the Prophet was commanded to consult those who had received the Book before, then applied to Muslims who confessed 3 times to committing a grievous sin explicity disallowed by God. It is part of the Hudd Laws, which are to this day a highly controversial and hotly debated issue in Islamic law.

[Alhamdulillah 0]

I have read the Quran, 4 times, also the bible 7 times, so I need to re-read them because I didn't find many answers. Both books are confusing, I have to say the bible is over the top confusing, but yea to be such a divine book, it didn’t leave me much inspired. Lots of rules, so many different rules, makes no sense to me, but more power to you, that you understand. I also noticed that there are tons of contradictions, one time they state this is the way to do things, the next they break that and state that God had told them to do this now. But when they hear the word of this God, no one is around, strange. Books are hard reads to be sure, I even did a presentation on Islam in college, so I am familiar with some of the beliefs, but I am no means an expert.

You have to read it and refer to the explainations and Sunnah to fully understand the meanings. The bible, however, is confusing because it's been altered and has men's words mixed with God's.

God does abrogate laws or give different laws to different ppl at different times.... He has His reasons and it's not necessarily for us to understand. I don't understand the level of arrogance some ppl have to think they have to understand or comprehend everything God does in order to believe in Him. If we were capable of comprehending everything about God, we wouldn't be human.

[geenee 0]

By the way they stone people in Iran, what is your stand on stoning people to death?

depends on what the crime is.... cuz i will tell u right now if someone rapes my baby girl.... u better believe I want him stoned.... dont put him in jail so I can foot the bill .... take him out of his misery.... cuz as i said before my sister is a sex offender therapist.... and guess what???

THERE IS NO CURE FOR IT!! NONE!! HE HAS TO LIVE OUT THE REST OF HIS DAYS TRYING TO KEEP OFF OF YOUNG BOYS AND GIRLS.... I REPEAT NO CURE!!!

By the way they stone people in Iran, what is your stand on stoning people to death?

Stoning is not in the Quran, but it is in the Sunnah of the Prophet. It is told that it was taken from Jewish law as the Prophet was commanded to consult those who had received the Book before, then applied to Muslims who confessed 3 times to committing a grievous sin explicity disallowed by God. It is part of the Hudd Laws, which are to this day a highly controversial and hotly debated issue in Islamic law.

Man girl U kno ur stuff I like you!

I have read the Quran, 4 times, also the bible 7 times, so I need to re-read them because I didn't find many answers. Both books are confusing, I have to say the bible is over the top confusing, but yea to be such a divine book, it didn’t leave me much inspired. Lots of rules, so many different rules, makes no sense to me, but more power to you, that you understand. I also noticed that there are tons of contradictions, one time they state this is the way to do things, the next they break that and state that God had told them to do this now. But when they hear the word of this God, no one is around, strange. Books are hard reads to be sure, I even did a presentation on Islam in college, so I am familiar with some of the beliefs, but I am no means an expert.

You have to read it and refer to the explainations and Sunnah to fully understand the meanings. The bible, however, is confusing because it's been altered and has men's words mixed with God's.

God does abrogate laws or give different laws to different ppl at different times.... He has His reasons and it's not necessarily for us to understand. I don't understand the level of arrogance some ppl have to think they have to understand or comprehend everything God does in order to believe in Him. If we were capable of comprehending everything about God, we wouldn't be human.

u rock!