Muslims

[~Jackie~ 30]

snortin? hmmmm have never heard of that one.

Fart, and ya can take a bath and pray. You would think a snort would be forgiven. Umm Squeak....ever heard of the 'snortin hadith' ? (im off to reasearch...)

jJ

[100% Al Ahly Fan 53]

You haven't been there during Ramadan recently? After the whole debacle re: people bringing rowdy children to iftar, they started giving out coupons to Holyland and then subsequently Crescent Moon Bakery. From here on out, it just isn't ramadan without a holyland date and crescent moon afghan pizza

Haven't been there since the summer of 2007. To be honest, I have never been to Crescent Moon. I'm usually at Holyland every other week or so, don't know why I haven't made the time to visit Crescent Moon. I gotta try that pizza.....

Slightly off topic, but wanted to ask. Last night Hubby and I got into it a little over snorting. I tend to snort when I laugh sometimes and he gets upset that I do that, even though I can't always control that. He then told me that if I were to pray, when I snorted my prayers wouldn't be accepted for 40 days after. What's up with that?! I'm constantly having Hadith thrown at me, but am never sure it's actually true or misunderstood. Anyone?

Wow, never heard this before. I am not sure why someone would snort during salat but even so why your prayers wouldn't be accepted, I haven't the slighted.

[Ahmed N Tina 2]

I just re-read what I wrote, I wasn't exactly clear. Sorry!

So if I snort when I laugh, and if I were a Muslim, my prayers wouldn't be accepted due to snorting when laughing (not while praying necessarily) cause it sounds like a pig.

Hopefully that's clearer, its Friday, I'm wiped.

[100% Al Ahly Fan 53]

I just re-read what I wrote, I wasn't exactly clear. Sorry!

So if I snort when I laugh, and if I were a Muslim, my prayers wouldn't be accepted due to snorting when laughing (not while praying necessarily) cause it sounds like a pig.

Hopefully that's clearer, its Friday, I'm wiped.

Umm......I still haven't heard of this. I mean, I don't know about snorting...I don't think your husband is right though, but I can't say for sure. I think your hubby must REALLY not like the snorting.

[amysaid 9]

My husband said he has heard about it, but he thinks it's only if it's intentional. He said he'd look for the hadith on it and get back to me, but I am about to leave to run errands so it probably won't be until later tonight or tomorrow that I find out

[doodlebugg 10]

I just re-read what I wrote, I wasn't exactly clear. Sorry!

So if I snort when I laugh, and if I were a Muslim, my prayers wouldn't be accepted due to snorting when laughing (not while praying necessarily) cause it sounds like a pig.

Hopefully that's clearer, its Friday, I'm wiped.

Honestly I think he's trying to scare you out of making that noise at all. I did it once when I laughed the first time with him and his mood changed drastically. Eventually he told me that when a woman snorts like that it means she's a sleazebag ####### so he would never want me to make that noise again. Never heard of it pertaining to salat though.

[Ahmed N Tina 2]

Ahmed mentioned if it was intentional too. I get so worn out with all the little rules sometimes, its overwhelming.

Sleazebag #######?! Wow! He didn't mention that, but he did say its not nice. But why isn't it? To me it means I'm enjoying a laugh and it just slips out. I don't sit around making pig noises for the fun of it. Next thing he'll say is women aren't supposed to laugh in public. (I'm totally exaggerating here) I guess I need to buy the books of hadith and read them all myself.

Edited June 26, 2009 by Ahmed N Tina

[KHPerfectMatch 1]

Ahmed mentioned if it was intentional too. I get so worn out with all the little rules sometimes, its overwhelming.

Sleazebag #######?! Wow! He didn't mention that, but he did say its not nice. But why isn't it? To me it means I'm enjoying a laugh and it just slips out. I don't sit around making pig noises for the fun of it. Next thing he'll say is women aren't supposed to laugh in public. (I'm totally exaggerating here) I guess I need to buy the books of hadith and read them all myself.

OMG Tina.... I've NEVER heard such a thing! Sounds like a MAJOR over reaction to me... I know that they have an aversion to snorting...(like anyone would do it on PURPOSE!!!) but not sure why it causes them such revulsion...

SLEAZEBAG #######...?????????

H had better NEVER use those words in connection with anything and I mean ANYTHING I've ever done intentionally or otherwise, or anything I've contemplated, or mentioned, in fact not even about anything I've even HEARD ABOUT......

[doodlebugg 10]

"sleazebag #######" is my expression. I don't remember what exactly he said but that was the gist of it. Basically it was like you're...well....that word. Like a woman of the evening if that's a nicer expression. Seriously I doubt it's in any hadith at all. It's just a cultural thing.

I was offended at first but when I confirmed it with a few egyptians I was more forgiving and I was more cautious when I laugh. Also on the flip side, my husband used to chew with his mouth open ALL THE TIME. Wicked embarassing so one day I just said, you know how you think of women who snort when they laugh? Well chewing with your mouth open is worse! He hasn't done it since. ####### for tat, so to speak.

Edited June 27, 2009 by humpkinpumpkin

[KHPerfectMatch 1]

"sleazebag #######" is my expression. I don't remember what exactly he said but that was the gist of it. Basically it was like you're...well....that word. Like a woman of the evening if that's a nicer expression. Seriously I doubt it's in any hadith at all. It's just a cultural thing.

I was offended at first but when I confirmed it with a few egyptians I was more forgiving and I was more cautious when I laugh. Also on the flip side, my husband used to chew with his mouth open ALL THE TIME. Wicked embarassing so one day I just said, you know how you think of women who snort when they laugh? Well chewing with your mouth open is worse! He hasn't done it since. ####### for tat, so to speak.

Yep I'm voting for "cultural thing" (which for many Egyptians is the same as a religious requirement....) They always bring their kids to the weekend Islamic school saying they want them to be "muslims" but what they REALLY mean is they want them to act like Egyptian kids... or just be EGYPTIANS.... and "practice the faith" by obeying everything their father tells them without question, daughters that never leave the house without a family member, and boys that study 4 hours a night and want to be doctors or engineers etc. etc. You know MUSLIMS... Same/Same this...

H and I agreed long ago that he gets judged by his cultural norms and I get judged by mine.... however when I'm in Egypt I conform to Egyptian norms for public behavior and when he's here he's SUPPOSED to conform to American norms for public behavior.... however I'm MUCH better at it than he is... So I guess I won't snort in public in Egypt... (or laugh/speak loudly)... but even if I did he doesn't get to do more than "gently remind me" that I'm in the "red zone" of culturally acceptable behavior.

I work closely with men here on a daily basis.... in Egypt I can't sit in the flat with my brother-in-law alone! Here on occasion I even go places with men in the car, just the two of us! B) I'll never forget when my Saidi husband told me that if he saw me in a car with a "strange" man in Egypt he would feel obligated to divorce me on the spot... (rather than killing me like a "normal" Saidi... )

I have learned over the last 30 years that if you allow Arabs to judge you by THEIR NORMS then you are setting yourself up for problems, sooner or later... As much as you want to "behave" we are Americans after all, and Americans are an independent bunch and conforming to MENA NORMS is not very satisfying after the "newness" wears off... especially when you're living here...

I remember sitting in a Denny's restaurant about 2:00 am with 3 or 4 of my girlfriends and my Saudi "brother" back in the early 80's having breakfast after a late night out... My "brother" doesn't look Arab, more Italian or Greek.. A table of Saudi's next to us were saying "uncomplimentary things" about us... (girls)... in arabic... My best friend who spoke pretty good Arabic and my "brother" let LOOSE on them... saying "how dare you sit in the USA and judge American girls on the same basis as you would a Saudi girl who did the same thing!!!!" Going out as a group to DENNY's for BREAKFAST isn't exactly a scandalous thing for 25 year olds to do...by US standards... I was really proud of Mazzi for telling them off...

I also can't stand it when people "Hadith Thump" others over nit picky things... particularly when it's a mixed marriage.. If something is maqrew (disliked) then the one who believes that shouldn't do it... End of story!

Glad this subject came up... I forgot what a reaction a snort can get...

[HLM 1]

If not during prayer; snorting is fine and wouldn't ruin wudu.

[Ahmed N Tina 2]

####### for Tat, I like that! He's been really good about changing his ways about some things when I tell him it's not cool here, so I can't really complain about that. But this snort thing got me. Especially the part where God isn't going to accept prayer for 40 days after you do it.

KH, I agree, it has to have a cultural spin. I'm trying to be easy going about a lot as he gets acclimated, but some times I gotta ask about some of the interesting "opinions" he comes up with and how they relate to his religion.

HLM - Thank you sweetie! I'm gonna tell him that!

[doodlebugg 10]

Switching gears, I have to eat only organic meat from now on and I was thinking, does halal = organic? I mean do the rules of being able to call a piece of meat halal also include not feeding the cow/chicken/whatever hormones and other chemicals? I would think so since they have to treat the animal in a humane way but should I just assume this?

I'm cool with just buying organic from the local grocers and saying bismillah before eating it but if I can support a halal butcher *and* stay organic I'd rather do that. Anyone?

[KHPerfectMatch 1]

Switching gears, I have to eat only organic meat from now on and I was thinking, does halal = organic? I mean do the rules of being able to call a piece of meat halal also include not feeding the cow/chicken/whatever hormones and other chemicals? I would think so since they have to treat the animal in a humane way but should I just assume this?

I'm cool with just buying organic from the local grocers and saying bismillah before eating it but if I can support a halal butcher *and* stay organic I'd rather do that. Anyone?

I'm no expert, but I think there are 3 different issues...

First there is the method of killing the animal (zabiha) and that is not only saying "bismillah" but includes the METHOD used, and the treatment of the animal before and after it's killed... The animal must be calm before it is killed swiftly and painlessly by cutting it's throat to allow the blood to drain. Then the carcass must be handled properly (not sure of the details there...)

The 2nd issue what an animal is fed, and treated, etc. would affect whether the meat is halal... regardless of how it was killed. If it was fed impure food like the carcasses of haram animals (which is common these days) that would render the meat impure, and "haram".

The third issue is whether the meat is healthy... from an organic stand point... free from hormones, antibiotics, disease, etc. I don't think these "additives" would make the meat "haram" and neither does organic = halal.... Humane treatment is a subjective term... When I think of inhumane I think of the chicken farms in Arkansas where the chickens never see the light of day. I think of veal stalls where the baby cows are nearly force fed until they are ready for slaughter and their feet never touch the ground because they don't want the meat to have any muscle which makes it tougher...

I think I'm glad that I am about 95% vegetarian... makes it a lot easier...

[UmmSqueakster 54]

I am unaware of anything that says "snorting" invalidates salat for 40 days. The only thing with the 40 day invalidity attached, to the best of my knowledge, is drinking alcohol.

Now, laughing out loud during prayer does invalidate the salat, but in that case, you just have to start over again.

I'll ask AbuS, but I can't for the life of me imagine that that would be true.