Dealing with SO's opinions about future children

[allousa 1]

I really can't decide if this is a religious issue with him because he's not saying that it is. When I tried to ask him questions about how he would handle things in the future, he kind of just shut down and said "I don't know".

I don't consider myself to be religious at all and I still plan on teaching my children not to give themselves away until marriage. That is such a sacred gift, that in my opinion, transcends religion. I would hope that I teach them right, BUT, if they weren't to be a virgin before marriage, am I going to excommunicate myself from them...NO!

[doodlebugg 10]

Sorry if you've already mentioned this but has he become more religious since he's been back this time around? Also I know he's always been a dad but now that he's physically present everyday in your son's life (cutie patootie btw) maybe that's changed him. I've seen a few marriages where the guy isn't religious in the least bit and then WHAMMO as soon as he becomes a daddy he's going to the mosque everyday, growin' the beard, etc.

[chaishai 1]

Oh geez do I know that too well. Male friends = you slept with them. No if's and's or but's!!!!

Oh yes, and mail co-workers = you've slept with them. With as many people that are supposed to be having sex in America, how does anything get done?

Badr and I have had the "daughter" conversation before. I just dropped it and realized that his views might change after he's experienced America first.

seriously? i can see (but dont agree with) not wanting ur wife to have male friends but co-workers? how does one even control that? ha i would LOVE it if my husband gave me a hard time about that - oh well sorry honey, you bring home the turkey bacon!

No one can control it unless I become a nun. I just let him bark because I know he won't bite.

or you could get a job at curves or another ladies fitness center lol

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I really can't decide if this is a religious issue with him because he's not saying that it is. When I tried to ask him questions about how he would handle things in the future, he kind of just shut down and said "I don't know".

I don't consider myself to be religious at all and I still plan on teaching my children not to give themselves away until marriage. That is such a sacred gift, that in my opinion, transcends religion. I would hope that I teach them right, BUT, if they weren't to be a virgin before marriage, am I going to excommunicate myself from them...NO!

You maybe didnt notice this because you never lived around a large community of palestinians but the reality is that life for a palestinian girl is very different for a boy. Two stories come to mind. My palestinian ex once told me that a neighbor saw his sister talking to a boy she later ended up marrying. His mom came to him and told him to beat up his sister. He promptly obliged breaking her nose and leaving her black and blue all over her body but the family honor was restored. He also told me the story of a girl who agreed to go on a date with one of his friends. The friend put her in a van in ramallah. In the van, several men waited for her then raped her then threw her out of the van. She had it coming because she was a girl who "dated". Its not fair but its reality that girls and boys have different lives in palestinian families.She was never able to tell anyone out of fear they would blame her then kill her.Liberal families, conservative families.. in between families. Girls and boys have different sets of rules. Period. Like it or not. Its just sad that somehow you having a baby is contingent on all of this. Its tragic. You deserve to have a baby..He is the one living in this country. He needs to adapt to the life here not the other way around.

All your objectiveness will never erase the cultural reality or double standards that are held within this particular community. They highly value female virginity and integrity. Boys can do what they want and girls can't.

[sandinista! 1,816]

never underestimate wahrania's obsession.

[chaishai 1]

never underestimate wahrania's obsession.

I was like huh? why would allousa have lived in palestine and what does a bunch of palestinian rapists have to do with allousas husband and this issue?

[allousa 1]

I am biting my tongue in half at the moment to not comment on this being a Palestinian issue (OUCH!). While Hicham has visited Gaza, he has never lived there. He was born and raised in Morocco and not in a Palestinian community either. Neither do his other brothers feel this way. That comment was quite out of left field.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

never underestimate wahrania's obsession.

Yes I singlehandedly wrote the book on gender behavior in MENA. Oh give it a rest Ta Me..

Its reality....in virginity inspection, honor killings and the day to day life for a girl living there. They don't have the freedom of choices that American women do . I doubt that my husband is going to give a daughter of mine the freedom that I had as a young woman. I knew that when I married him. Its just different when you have a daughter and you dream of her going away to college and living in a dorm and doing something with her life and her dad refuses to let her leave the home. If he is already saying his daughter won't date and his daughter isn't here yet, its a pretty good indicator of what he will do in the future. I think Allousa knows this and thats why she is really sad. She knows if she has a daughter that she might not live a carefree life and have lots of choices. Allousa is thinking about what the future holds unlike some of us who think simply with our hearts and not our heads..

[sandinista! 1,816]

I am biting my tongue in half at the moment to not comment on this being a Palestinian issue (OUCH!). While Hicham has visited Gaza, he has never lived there. He was born and raised in Morocco and not in a Palestinian community either. Neither do his other brothers feel this way. That comment was quite out of left field.

except for when one considers the source. your son is a doll, by the way.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I am biting my tongue in half at the moment to not comment on this being a Palestinian issue (OUCH!). While Hicham has visited Gaza, he has never lived there. He was born and raised in Morocco and not in a Palestinian community either. Neither do his other brothers feel this way. That comment was quite out of left field.

If he never lived there and neither did his family, why is dating even an issue? Could it be that he has standards for how women in his family should act that have nothing to do with you at all? Its his daughter not his wife and there are perhaps things he would want for his daughter that he cannot impose on you. He can because its his child. He cant change the life of a grown person. He can effect her life and will

[allousa 1]

Sorry if you've already mentioned this but has he become more religious since he's been back this time around? Also I know he's always been a dad but now that he's physically present everyday in your son's life (cutie patootie btw) maybe that's changed him. I've seen a few marriages where the guy isn't religious in the least bit and then WHAMMO as soon as he becomes a daddy he's going to the mosque everyday, growin' the beard, etc.

I wouldn't say that he's become more religious because he doesn't pray at all. He is definitely not a practicing Muslim which is what grates my cheese about this. I always knew that when and if we had children they would have Muslims names and would be raised not eating pork and observing Islamic holidays. Even while we were apart I would ask him what things I could do to help raise our son in an Islamic way in his absence. I played the Adan often for him (just wasn't possible everyday) and have done more in reality than my husband to promote Islamic traditions and beliefs than my husband has. He's been real apathetic about the whole thing actually. He talks all the time about how important it is for our children to be raised as Muslims, but all the while, he's not walkin' the walk....know what I mean?

[allousa 1]

never underestimate wahrania's obsession.

Yes I singlehandedly wrote the book on gender behavior in MENA. Oh give it a rest Ta Me..

Its reality....in virginity inspection, honor killings and the day to day life for a girl living there. They don't have the freedom of choices that American women do . I doubt that my husband is going to give a daughter of mine the freedom that I had as a young woman. I knew that when I married him. Its just different when you have a daughter and you dream of her going away to college and living in a dorm and doing something with her life and her dad refuses to let her leave the home. If he is already saying his daughter won't date and his daughter isn't here yet, its a pretty good indicator of what he will do in the future. I think Allousa knows this and thats why she is really sad. She knows if she has a daughter that she might not live a carefree life and have lots of choices. Allousa is thinking about what the future holds unlike some of us who think simply with our hearts and not our heads..

I really must correct you here. My sister-in-law who WAS born in Gaza, lived mostly in Morocco, but now resides in Gaza has been DIVORCED AND REMARRIED since living in Gaza. She is actually the one that is working in the family right now and suffice to say that she has alot of choices. Help me to understand your basis of this information? While I wouldn't doubt that this happens in some places and NOT JUST IN GAZA, mind you, this is NOT the life of ALL women there.

Where are you getting your facts.....FAUX NEWS????

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

never underestimate wahrania's obsession.

I was like huh? why would allousa have lived in palestine and what does a bunch of palestinian rapists have to do with allousas husband and this issue?

I wasn't trying to tie it to this. Her first post speaks for itself. She is afraid to have a baby daughter and wants more kids for fear that her husband will not allow her daughter to date and have a "normal" American life where she dates, acts independently or semi independently and she wasnt expecting this reaction from her husband . Everyone on here is telling her that most likely he will change but perhaps he will not. If his attitudes were not influenced by external culture, there is a pretty good indication they are his true beliefs. Some people get more conservative as they get older as well. He may simply believe that daughters are not supposed to date until they are married which is why you meet so many people who got engaged at weddings, family events or met through relatives or even married distant cousins. It doesnt make it right or wrong but there are clear difference between American culture and mena culture that you cannot rationalise away no matter how hard you try.

[Jenn! 918]

He's been real apathetic about the whole thing actually. He talks all the time about how important it is for our children to be raised as Muslims, but all the while, he's not walkin' the walk....know what I mean?

It sounds like he's more concerned with what other people think of him as a Muslim than any real beliefs. This is not an insult, from my experience this seems pretty common. Dogma and culture often seem to supersede faith.

Edited May 15, 2008 by Jenn!

[allousa 1]

I am biting my tongue in half at the moment to not comment on this being a Palestinian issue (OUCH!). While Hicham has visited Gaza, he has never lived there. He was born and raised in Morocco and not in a Palestinian community either. Neither do his other brothers feel this way. That comment was quite out of left field.

except for when one considers the source. your son is a doll, by the way.

Thank you! I never knew that I could be so in love with a little being. I can't wait for him to get up every morning just to hear what he's going to say. He's really talking alot now and says the funniest things. This morning when I came in his room to get him dressed for nursery school, he was standing at his bookcase playing with some toys. I sat in the floor with his clothes and said "Come on, let's get dressed". He turns around and says..."What's going on in here!" I laid down on the floor I was laughing so hard.