KKK endorses McCain: "A black President would go against just about everything we stand for"

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

So... what? I still wasn't born yet. I had nothing to do with that. So why am I responsible?

Neither was I - so no we're not directly to blame, I don't think that's being suggested. We are however - the inheritors of a historical legacy - from which we benefit to a greater or lesser extent. That's not too hard to understand.

To broaden the argument slightly - none of the UK politicians in the House of Commons were alive in the heyday of Britain's colonial period, yet noone is suggesting that because of this the government should suspend financial support of its former colonies.

In fact, this was actually brought up as a reason why, for example - the Australian Govt should not offer an apology for the treatment of the aborigines involved in the Stolen Generation (they have since offered one - under the Rudd Govt). That was more problematic - because many of the victims are still alive and the government (as an entity unto itself) surely has to accept some degree of responsibility regardless of the fact that none of the current crop of politicians were behind the original policy.

[Eric-Pris 1,607]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

Tell that to the white kid with an B average who didn't get accepted because the black or hispanic kid with a C- took his spot.

[HAL 9000 96]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

Some people had a major issue with the very word advancement as if improving themselves was something particularly bad. Go figure.

[Dr. Obvious 49]

The economic aspect of AA is quite different from the admissions aspect of AA. To be honest there is much resentment among some white Americans since (they having many more options for schooling, as well as the financial resources to be able to go to many more schools than others) they can't attend every single school they wish to go to.

That is pretty ridiculous. I never considered going to any college in high school because my parents couldn't afford it and I couldn't afford it. The only way I could afford it was with scholarships and the government and that was not information I was most privy to until about the last minute. All white people are not middle class and up. Some white people cannot afford to go to college period, not just THAT ONE DADDY MONEYBAGS! Thanks for stereotyping white people.

[HAL 9000 96]

Well of course you couldn't care less- that's precisely why you can't understand the significance of advancement based on inequalities that have existed in the past and that have created the current idiotic climate we're discussing.

By lacking an understanding of the discrimination in the past you are fooling yourself into thinking that righting wrongs is discriminatory. Get over it. I mean, lets be honest. Do you think you would have stood up not too long ago in defense of equal access rights before anything like AA existed?

The past, the past, the past.... get some new material. You gonna bring up the past to argue with everybody? People seem to be saying that the past is the past.

Discrimination is discrimination, anyway you want to present it. You seem to favor the "righting wrongs" approach. Guess what, I wronged nobody!

What do you expect? If you don't want to concern yourself with how things got to be then you have got to be wasting plenty of brainpower trying to escape from the results of said reality (=history).

If you wronged nobody then stop whining like they're wronging you.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

I think it's because resources are finite. There's only so much of any one "thing" to go around and when you start devoting an inordinate amount of "something" to one group, the other group(s) get left behind.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

Tell that to the white kid with an B average who didn't get accepted because the black or hispanic kid with a C- took his spot.

Or *any* kid with a C-

As I said - there are many reasons this could happen.

There are actually some people on here who work as academic admissions counsellor's - their view on this would probably be illuminating...

[Eric-Pris 1,607]

If you wronged nobody then stop whining like they're wronging you.

Who's whining?

You sound more like a whiner than me.

[HAL 9000 96]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

Tell that to the white kid with an B average who didn't get accepted because the black or hispanic kid with a C- took his spot.

And tell that to the minority kid that couldn't study at night because his parents got gentrified out of their neighborhood so another kids's family with money could take over their building at a higher property value. It goes both ways and only looking at the side that is convenient to your incomplete picture only polarizes the argument to its incompletenes..

The economic aspect of AA is quite different from the admissions aspect of AA. To be honest there is much resentment among some white Americans since (they having many more options for schooling, as well as the financial resources to be able to go to many more schools than others) they can't attend every single school they wish to go to.

That is pretty ridiculous. I never considered going to any college in high school because my parents couldn't afford it and I couldn't afford it. The only way I could afford it was with scholarships and the government and that was not information I was most privy to until about the last minute. All white people are not middle class and up. Some white people cannot afford to go to college period, not just THAT ONE DADDY MONEYBAGS! Thanks for stereotyping white people.

Bolded original text for your reading pleasure. One article of speech. Quite powerful.

Put it in context, as I've told others before.

If you wronged nobody then stop whining like they're wronging you.

Who's whining?

You sound more like a whiner than me.

I dunno, I am not the one griping about AA or the past. Just reminding of history and where we are now in 2008 as a result of it.

[Eric-Pris 1,607]

...polarizes the argument to its incompletenes..

#######? you must be an expert at circular arguments.

[HAL 9000 96]

...polarizes the argument to its incompletenes..

#######? you must be an expert at circular arguments.

I think its clearly written

Polarizes = makes unequal

argument = discussion; debate

incompleteness = something is left out; not all pertinent information is available by accident or choice

[DeadPoolX 9]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

Tell that to the white kid with an B average who didn't get accepted because the black or hispanic kid with a C- took his spot.

Or *any* kid with a C-

As I said - there are many reasons this could happen.

There are actually some people on here who work as academic admissions counsellor's - their view on this would probably be illuminating...

To be fair (which is really what this is all about, isn't it?), grades aren't everything. Sure, they're probably the best way to monitor someone's performance in any given class and a GPA is a good indicator of someone's aptitude in whatever area they are studying, but people are more than just grades.

Some jobs require certain types of people. I'm not trying to be discriminatory here, but if there's an opening for a position that deals with a certain client base, then applicants might be judged against that, as well as the other usual areas.

Is that fair? Theoretically, no, it's not. However, business isn't fair -- it's about making money. So if a corporation can make more with one person than another, simply due to physical, racial, ethnic, religious or gender differences, they'll certainly consider those when viewing the proposed hiring pool. That wouldn't be the only reason someone gets hired, but it might matter, especially when money is concerned.

[Jenn! 918]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

I think it's because resources are finite. There's only so much of any one "thing" to go around and when you start devoting an inordinate amount of "something" to one group, the other group(s) get left behind.

But isn't it kind of like being with 3 of your friends who haven't eaten in a week and still insisting that you each get 2 slices of pizza because that's what's fair?

[DeadPoolX 9]

Maybe that's what is at issue here - this perception that anything positive for a minority is a "punishment" for a non-minority.

I think it's because resources are finite. There's only so much of any one "thing" to go around and when you start devoting an inordinate amount of "something" to one group, the other group(s) get left behind.

But isn't it kind of like being with 3 of your friends who haven't eaten in a week and still insisting that you each get 2 slices of pizza because that's what's fair?

The major flaw in your example is that I'd know my friends personally.

[Amby 490]

this thread makes me laugh. thank you everyone!