KKK endorses McCain: "A black President would go against just about everything we stand for"

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I do wonder whether say European immigrants to the US would be called - European-Americans, as opposed to British-Americans, German-Americans or Italian-Americans etc.

Africa always seems to be written off at the continental level for the purposes of assigning an original - you don't generally hear of Kenyan or Nigerian-Americans in the general usage.

[Fandango 1,439]

Certainly - my intent was really to address the whole "if someone of X race said it, there'd be a big hoo-ha". Especially as the character in this thread has been to compare the NAACP with the KKK.

There is a difference and there is a reason why we have things like BET or indeed the NAACP and (IMO) they have less to do with giving racism a pass than some people want to believe.

I will concede though that these things and social engineering like Affirmative Action can and do cause problems - but at the same time abandoning those things will not magically provide the transition to social equality. After all, this is pretty much was what these things were brought in to address in the first place.

I don't know who has the answers - but I do know that pointing fingers at group X or Y doesn't move the debate forward.

It's true though. If the goal is true racial equality, then things like BET, and Affirmative Action need to stop. There is NO such thing as 'reverse' racism...it's racism, pure and simple. I remember years ago watching Def Comedy Jam (I used to watch it all the time, it was v funny), and seeing comedian after comedian make serious fun of white people. Not the 'oh he can't dance' innocuous funny #######, but REALLY harsh sh!t. I watched one of em say that the black people were going to capture all the whites and change all our names and force us to become slaves. 'you won't be laughing then!' he said. And that was the last time I watched.

You cannot straddle both sides of the fence. No one alive here owned a slave...I certainly didn't. I don't endorse, condone, or try to explain it. So the fact that I might not get a job based on the color (or lack thereof) of MY skin is institutionalized racism & actually unconstitutional. And if we're talking about what pushes people to identify with their race, well, that's one factor which promts me to identify myself, not as American, not as Italian, but as a white person.

I was in a car crash on Christmas Eve when I was 16. I was in a predominantly black lower middle class neighborhood when I was T boned by a drunk driver. The 40 something year old black lady proceeded to get out of her car & beat the shiznit out of me in front of all the neighbors while they cheered her on with chants of 'Kill Whitey!' 'White Devil B!tch!' and the like. My hands were trapped by my waist and here's this woman punching the shiznit outta my face while I can't even defend myself. I saw the cop lights in the distance and passed out before they got there. When the cops got there, of course no one saw anything & cops said that there was no way to discern what injuries came from the crash, and which from the 'alleged' assault (hi? there's a full fist mark on my face, duh). Cops later told my mom that because of the 'racial tension' in Miami (a Spanish cop has mistakenly killed a black teen who pointed a toy gun, some parts of Miami rioted for 3 days), that if they arrested her for assault, there'd be 'Holy hell'.

That kind of apologistic, walk on eggshells ####### should NOT happen in today's (or in the 90s, heh) day and age. it's complete bollox.

I don't mind scholarships and a help up to our nation's poor....but again, that has nothing to do with race. Inner cities have all sorts of races and ancestry. But programs like AA are run on the basis that somehow they NEED a handout, as if they are deficient in some way. And as we all age out farther and farther away from the atrocities of the past, they become less of a factor. I could certainly say how xy&z happened to my ancestors sometime ago, but what real bearing does that have on me today? Sure, I'm not black, but I do see that this guilt free pass we as a society show perpetrates that very atmosphere we as a society should be moving away from. 'ALL men created equal' and all that jazz.

Edited for typos!

Edited May 15, 2008 by Happy Bunny

[HAL 9000 96]

Where else are black-skinned individuals ancestrally from? Just curious (not counting Australia's Aboriginals and Pacific Islanders)

If a black Englishman was walking down the street in America, he'd be called 'African-American' of which he is neither.

Im not talking about tracing the origin of where the first black man and woman came from...but there are dark skinned people of every nationality all over the world.

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

[Ban Hammer 13,342]

Where else are black-skinned individuals ancestrally from? Just curious (not counting Australia's Aboriginals and Pacific Islanders)

If a black Englishman was walking down the street in America, he'd be called 'African-American' of which he is neither.

Im not talking about tracing the origin of where the first black man and woman came from...but there are dark skinned people of every nationality all over the world.

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

[HAL 9000 96]

Certainly - my intent was really to address the whole "if someone of X race said it, there'd be a big hoo-ha". Especially as the character in this thread has been to compare the NAACP with the KKK.

There is a difference and there is a reason why we have things like BET or indeed the NAACP and (IMO) they have less to do with giving racism a pass than some people want to believe.

I will concede though that these things and social engineering like Affirmative Action can and do cause problems - but at the same time abandoning those things will not magically provide the transition to social equality. After all, this is pretty much was what these things were brought in to address in the first place.

I don't know who has the answers - but I do know that pointing fingers at group X or Y doesn't move the debate forward.

It's true though. If the goal is true racial equality, then things like BET, and Affirmative Action need to stop. There is NO such thing as 'reverse' racism...it's racism, pure and simple. I remember years ago watching Def Comedy Jam (I used to watch it all the time, it was v funny), and seeing comedian after comedian make serious fun of white people. Not the 'oh he can't dance' innocuous funny #######, but REALLY harsh sh!t. I watched one of em say that the black people were going to capture all the whites and change all our names and force us to become slaves. 'you won't be laughing then!' he said. And that was the last time I watched.

You cannot straddle both sides of the fence. No one alive here owned a slave...I certainly didn't. I don't endorse, condone, or try to explain it. So the fact that I might not get a job based on the color (or lack thereof) of MY skin is institutionalized racism & actually unconstitutional. And if we're talking about what pushes people to identify with their race, well, that's one factor which promts me to identify myself, not as American, not as Italian, but as a white person.

I was in a car crash on Christmas Eve when I was 16. I was in a predominantly black lower middle class neighborhood when I was T boned by a drunk driver. The 40 something year old black lady proceeded to get out of her car & beat the shiznit out of me in front of all the neighbors while they cheered her on with chants of 'Kill Whitey!' 'White Devil B!tch!' and the like. My hands were trapped by my waist and here's this woman punching the shiznit outta my face while I can't even defend myself. I saw the cop lights in the distance and passed out before they got there. When the cops got there, of course no one saw anything & cops said that there was no way to discern what injuries came from the crash, and which from the 'alleged' assault (hi? there's a full fist mark on my face, duh). Cops later told my mom that because of the 'racial tension' in Miami (a Spanish cop has mistakenly killed a black teen who pointed a toy gun, some parts of Miami rioted for 3 days), that if they arrested her for assault, there'd be 'Holy hell'.

That kind of apologistic, walk on eggshells ####### should NOT happen in today's (or in the 90s, heh) day and age. it's complete bollox.

I don't mind scholarships and a help up to our nation's poor....but again, that has nothing to do with race. Inner cities have all sorts of races and ancestry. But programs like AA are run on the basis that somehow they NEED a handout, as if they are deficient in some way. And as we all age out farther and farther away from the atrocities of the past, they become less of a factor. I could certainly say how xy&z happened to my ancestors sometime ago, but what real bearing does that have on me today? Sure, I'm not black, but I do see that this guilt free pass we as a society show perpetrates that very atmosphere we as a society should be moving away from. 'ALL men created equal' and all that jazz.

Edited for typos!

Sorry you went through that. Where was this- Liberty City? Not exactly where you'd want to be on Christmas Eve at 16 years of age but hey I am most definitely not blaming you for the idiots if this world. Drunk ones to add.

Unfortunately, that pent up anger apparently came to hilt with you and as wrong as it was, it happened.

I wonder how many descriptions telling of centuries of similar if not worse violence (not to justify) occured against their communities and I also wonder how that shaped these communities views of the "majority" populations that were legally equal but most definitely not equal, and separate. Again, there is no justification. Violence does not justify violence in my opinion.

Like I stated before, AA and the like have very specific problems in idealizing a perfect society, but also like I stated, until there is no mass improvement in the structure of these communities towards the better, they will continue to be used, needed or no by interpretation.

It would be peachy if we lived in a country that did not abuse its racial divide and that it did not continue to foster such a divide along the ages, even after such practices were abolished and outlawed, and we can argue that circumstances HAVE changed for the better... just at a very slow pace... while the reality of these areas are that they are still living in poor conditions, disproportionately to the rest of the population, and with a ton of historical and every now and then, assumed racial targetting to add to the mix.

Certainly not an easy black/white scenario with personal choice as an escape to the poverty situation.

Where else are black-skinned individuals ancestrally from? Just curious (not counting Australia's Aboriginals and Pacific Islanders)

If a black Englishman was walking down the street in America, he'd be called 'African-American' of which he is neither.

Im not talking about tracing the origin of where the first black man and woman came from...but there are dark skinned people of every nationality all over the world.

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

[Ban Hammer 13,342]

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

so why hasn't al sharpton showed up to protest for my benefit?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

so why hasn't al sharpton showed up to protest for my benefit?

Give him a call when a cop sticks a plunger up your butt.

[Ban Hammer 13,342]

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

so why hasn't al sharpton showed up to protest for my benefit?

Give him a call when a cop sticks a plunger up your butt.

so you're saying sharpton has a fetish for that?

[Empress of Groovy 373]

Similarly, acknowledging that racism still exists in the U.S. and supporting policies and organizations whose aims are to correct centuries of appalling treatment and staggering inequality (whose effects are still felt today) is distinct from giving murderous inner-city gangsters a free pass.

Maybe you can clarify this current, as per 2008, "appalling treatment and staggering inequality" you and certain others keep on beating on about.

Reread the sentence, please.

This thread is a rehash of one from a few weeks ago. I suggested that you take a gander at the excellent documentary Eyes on the Prize.

I am not interested in any documentary. I am interested in hearing exactly how white America, in 2008, is carrying out and promoting, and I quote, "appalling treatment and staggering inequality" for black Americans.

I didn't think you'd be interested in learning anything that may make you think. But it is an excellent documentary.

Do I have to ask you to reread the sentence again? Specifically the text that precedes your red text? I'm talking about history (some of it recent) whose effects are still felt today.

Have there been improvements in both race relations and opportunities for minorities since then? Absolutely. But that wasn't my comment.

Like I said, creative reading.

[HAL 9000 96]

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

so why hasn't al sharpton showed up to protest for my benefit?

Lets ask him: 1-888-AL SHARP

I think it might have something to do with him being upset that people ignore the major causes of today's current situation while claiming that we can all get along in the process. Of course, he is a media #######.

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

so why hasn't al sharpton showed up to protest for my benefit?

Give him a call when a cop sticks a plunger up your butt.

Sick image... bad Troll.

[mawilson 2,133]

They do have odds stacked against them. It has been explained to you before- schooling for inner city children is funded disproportionately according to local taxation- primarily more so than the standard amounts dedicated per pupil from the State and Federal level. Sure, you get diamonds in the rough that make their teachers cry with joy, but even some of these kids get sucked in by a system that is stacked against them (poor home life, lack of proper diet at home, poor health care, violence close to home, etc). These are all byproducts of true and historical circumstance.

Note how race is left out of that argument. You are a product of where you come from.

I think you just proved Boo-Yah's point -- race has nothing to do with it.

Poor white kids struggle just as hard as poor black kids do.

[Ban Hammer 13,342]

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

so why hasn't al sharpton showed up to protest for my benefit?

Give him a call when a cop sticks a plunger up your butt.

Sick image... bad Troll.

you can probably guess what images are on his computer........

[HAL 9000 96]

They do have odds stacked against them. It has been explained to you before- schooling for inner city children is funded disproportionately according to local taxation- primarily more so than the standard amounts dedicated per pupil from the State and Federal level. Sure, you get diamonds in the rough that make their teachers cry with joy, but even some of these kids get sucked in by a system that is stacked against them (poor home life, lack of proper diet at home, poor health care, violence close to home, etc). These are all byproducts of true and historical circumstance.

Note how race is left out of that argument. You are a product of where you come from.

I think you just proved Boo-Yah's point -- race has nothing to do with it.

Poor white kids struggle just as hard as poor black kids do.

It does when placed into context. It is no coincidence that the major inner cities with disproportionate levels of educational funding have a very particular racial makeup. Hence, they do have it stacked against them. {Cause, History}

Do I agree with your last statement? Of course. That is an individual-based assumption, not a community-level argument. {Another argument} Linking it to the Causal aspect is simple: You are a product of where you come from.

Edited May 15, 2008 by maviwaro

[amiquechu 0]

Certainly - my intent was really to address the whole "if someone of X race said it, there'd be a big hoo-ha". Especially as the character in this thread has been to compare the NAACP with the KKK.

There is a difference and there is a reason why we have things like BET or indeed the NAACP and (IMO) they have less to do with giving racism a pass than some people want to believe.

I will concede though that these things and social engineering like Affirmative Action can and do cause problems - but at the same time abandoning those things will not magically provide the transition to social equality. After all, this is pretty much was what these things were brought in to address in the first place.

I don't know who has the answers - but I do know that pointing fingers at group X or Y doesn't move the debate forward.

It's true though. If the goal is true racial equality, then things like BET, and Affirmative Action need to stop. There is NO such thing as 'reverse' racism...it's racism, pure and simple. I remember years ago watching Def Comedy Jam (I used to watch it all the time, it was v funny), and seeing comedian after comedian make serious fun of white people. Not the 'oh he can't dance' innocuous funny #######, but REALLY harsh sh!t. I watched one of em say that the black people were going to capture all the whites and change all our names and force us to become slaves. 'you won't be laughing then!' he said. And that was the last time I watched.

You cannot straddle both sides of the fence. No one alive here owned a slave...I certainly didn't. I don't endorse, condone, or try to explain it. So the fact that I might not get a job based on the color (or lack thereof) of MY skin is institutionalized racism & actually unconstitutional. And if we're talking about what pushes people to identify with their race, well, that's one factor which promts me to identify myself, not as American, not as Italian, but as a white person.

I was in a car crash on Christmas Eve when I was 16. I was in a predominantly black lower middle class neighborhood when I was T boned by a drunk driver. The 40 something year old black lady proceeded to get out of her car & beat the shiznit out of me in front of all the neighbors while they cheered her on with chants of 'Kill Whitey!' 'White Devil B!tch!' and the like. My hands were trapped by my waist and here's this woman punching the shiznit outta my face while I can't even defend myself. I saw the cop lights in the distance and passed out before they got there. When the cops got there, of course no one saw anything & cops said that there was no way to discern what injuries came from the crash, and which from the 'alleged' assault (hi? there's a full fist mark on my face, duh). Cops later told my mom that because of the 'racial tension' in Miami (a Spanish cop has mistakenly killed a black teen who pointed a toy gun, some parts of Miami rioted for 3 days), that if they arrested her for assault, there'd be 'Holy hell'.

That kind of apologistic, walk on eggshells ####### should NOT happen in today's (or in the 90s, heh) day and age. it's complete bollox.

I don't mind scholarships and a help up to our nation's poor....but again, that has nothing to do with race. Inner cities have all sorts of races and ancestry. But programs like AA are run on the basis that somehow they NEED a handout, as if they are deficient in some way. And as we all age out farther and farther away from the atrocities of the past, they become less of a factor. I could certainly say how xy&z happened to my ancestors sometime ago, but what real bearing does that have on me today? Sure, I'm not black, but I do see that this guilt free pass we as a society show perpetrates that very atmosphere we as a society should be moving away from. 'ALL men created equal' and all that jazz.

Edited for typos!

Sounds like a hate crime to me.

[HAL 9000 96]

Yes. For that the caller would just have to be corrected.

In a way we are all Africans anyway, so that may in itself be a point to ponder.

good, we're all african americans.

That's right brother.

so why hasn't al sharpton showed up to protest for my benefit?

Give him a call when a cop sticks a plunger up your butt.

Sick image... bad Troll.

you can probably guess what images are on his computer........

Not sure I want to know but I am pretty sure there are none with NYPD doing nasty things to you in reality.