82% of Americans (and 62% of Republicans) believe the country is on the wrong track

[mawilson 2,133]

Jabberwocky, the fact is that you are not free. You give up something in a civil society. It's just the facts. My safety comes before your individual rights... PERIOD!

I'll take terrorist attacks over the Patriot Act any day.

You may volunteer to be a victim of a terrorist attack if you wish, I'd prefer not to be murdered nor have my loved ones be victims.

Well that is your choice. You still have the right to an opinion - the Patriot Act hasn't taken it away yet.

[Sheriff Uling 3]

Show me where the constitution prohibits the Patriot Act. Oh wait, the SC said it was constitutinal. And wait, the dem congress kept renewing it! How can that be?

The Fourth Amendment -- reasonable expectation of privacy, freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures.

That means the government should stay the #### away from my bank account.

The government will and does respect the citizen’s rights. However, the security of this nation from terrorist supersedes the basic rights of the citizens to the point where it does not cause a civil unrest. The problem is that we have become so liberal that we forget that liberty is not free. Democracy is not freedom. There are inherent rights that we relinquish when we decide to be apart of a society. However, we the bill of rights ensures citizens that our basic rights and needs will not be violated unjustly.

BS. Our nation isn't buildings. They can destroy buildings, but you give them our liberties and you've given them exactly what they wanted - to terrorize us into giving up our freedom...f##k that.

Jabberwocky, the fact is that you are not free. You give up something in a civil society. It's just the facts. My safety comes before your individual rights... PERIOD!

If you're really that concerned about your safety, then I'd suggest you stop driving a car. Don't fly in plane. Move away from the west coast and find some remote place in America where you won't be shot in a drive-by in front your house or die in an earthquake, a fire, or from breathing too much pollution. We can go on and on. If your safety is that important, then what's stopping you from taking those steps?

Why not open the borders, give away trade secrets, military tactics, access codes, sovereignty, or better eliminate the constitution and bill of rights? There are reasons why these safeguards exist. Please try not to focus on your individual desires and that of the body of people that make up our citizenry.

[Scott & Lai 12]

Show me where the constitution prohibits the Patriot Act. Oh wait, the SC said it was constitutinal. And wait, the dem congress kept renewing it! How can that be?

The Fourth Amendment -- reasonable expectation of privacy, freedom from unreasonable searches and seizures.

That means the government should stay the #### away from my bank account.

The government will and does respect the citizen’s rights. However, the security of this nation from terrorist supersedes the basic rights of the citizens to the point where it does not cause a civil unrest. The problem is that we have become so liberal that we forget that liberty is not free. Democracy is not freedom. There are inherent rights that we relinquish when we decide to be apart of a society. However, we the bill of rights ensures citizens that our basic rights and needs will not be violated unjustly.

BS. Our nation isn't buildings. They can destroy buildings, but you give them our liberties and you've given them exactly what they wanted - to terrorize us into giving up our freedom...f##k that.

Jabberwocky, the fact is that you are not free. You give up something in a civil society. It's just the facts. My safety comes before your individual rights... PERIOD!

If you're really that concerned about your safety, then I'd suggest you stop driving a car. Don't fly in plane. Move away from the west coast and find some remote place in America where you won't be shot in a drive-by in front your house or die in an earthquake, a fire, or from breathing too much pollution. We can go on and on. If your safety is that important, then what's stopping you from taking those steps?

There is a major difference between the threat of a natural disaster or an accident and the threat of terrorists or drive-by shootings. The later two examples are acts of human evil, and are specifically what we have governments to prevent.

Jabberwocky, the fact is that you are not free. You give up something in a civil society. It's just the facts. My safety comes before your individual rights... PERIOD!

I'll take terrorist attacks over the Patriot Act any day.

Please try not to focus on your individual desires and that of the body of people that make up our citizenry.

I am. A terrorist attack might kill 10 people, or 100 or even 1000. The Patriot Act kills civil liberties for 300 million people.

Which specific liberties have you, personally, or anyone you know or can name, lost?

[Sheriff Uling 3]

Jabberwocky, the fact is that you are not free. You give up something in a civil society. It's just the facts. My safety comes before your individual rights... PERIOD!

I'll take terrorist attacks over the Patriot Act any day.

Please try not to focus on your individual desires and that of the body of people that make up our citizenry.

I am. A terrorist attack might kill 10 people, or 100 or even 1000. The Patriot Act kills civil liberties for 300 million people.

You are speculating that the scope or magnitude of another attack won't be that severe, which is wishful thinking. If safeguards do not create a civil unrest, do not destroy our quality of life, and potentially saves lives, wouldn't you want that for Americans and our future generations?

[mawilson 2,133]

Why not open the borders, give away trade secrets, military tactics, access codes, sovereignty, or better eliminate the constitution and bill of rights? There are reasons why these safeguards exist. Please try not to focus on your individual desires and that of the body of people that make up our citizenry.

What Jabbawacky is saying is that small-time terrorism isn't as big of a threat as they would have you believe.

It if was... and the government really cared about it, would they really leave the borders unprotected?

Think about it: if the Big Bad Suicide-Bomber Terrorist is comin' 't git'cha, wouldn't securing the borders be their first priority?

Unless they know something you don't....

Edited May 13, 2008 by mawilson

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Jabberwocky, the fact is that you are not free. You give up something in a civil society. It's just the facts. My safety comes before your individual rights... PERIOD!

I'll take terrorist attacks over the Patriot Act any day.

Please try not to focus on your individual desires and that of the body of people that make up our citizenry.

I am. A terrorist attack might kill 10 people, or 100 or even 1000. The Patriot Act kills civil liberties for 300 million people.

Right on!

They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security

[mawilson 2,133]

Which specific liberties have you, personally, or anyone you know or can name, lost?

Oh God, where do I begin?

How about

• the "no fly" list that bans certain people from flying
• US citizens harassed by immigration and customs
• millions of Americans assigned terrorism risk scores without their knowledge
• secret wiretapping and monitoring of US citizens' overseas communications
• data mining and consolidation of government databases

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Which specific liberties have you, personally, or anyone you know or can name, lost?

Oh God, where do I begin?

How about

• the "no fly" list that bans certain people from flying
• US citizens harassed by immigration and customs
• millions of Americans assigned terrorism risk scores without their knowledge
• secret wiretapping and monitoring of US citizens' overseas communications
• data mining and consolidation of government databases

If this bothers you then, clearly, you have something to hide.

[Scott & Lai 12]

Jabberwocky, the fact is that you are not free. You give up something in a civil society. It's just the facts. My safety comes before your individual rights... PERIOD!

I'll take terrorist attacks over the Patriot Act any day.

Please try not to focus on your individual desires and that of the body of people that make up our citizenry.

I am. A terrorist attack might kill 10 people, or 100 or even 1000. The Patriot Act kills civil liberties for 300 million people.

Right on!

They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security

"Strict observance of the written law is doubtless one of the high duties of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of necessity, of self-preservation, of saving our country when in danger, are of higher obligation. To lose our country by a scrupulous adherence to the written law, would be to lose the law itself, with life, liberty, property and all those who are enjoying them with us; thus absurdly sacrificing the ends to the means."

--Thomas Jefferson

"The choice is not between order and liberty. It is between liberty with order and anarchy without either. There is danger that, if the court does not temper its doctrinaire logic with a little practical wisdom, it will convert the constitutional Bill of Rights into a suicide pact."

--Justice Robert H. Jackson

Which specific liberties have you, personally, or anyone you know or can name, lost?

Oh God, where do I begin?

How about

• the "no fly" list that bans certain people from flying
• US citizens harassed by immigration and customs
• millions of Americans assigned terrorism risk scores without their knowledge
• secret wiretapping and monitoring of US citizens' overseas communications
• data mining and consolidation of government databases

Keeping government databases separate from each other in hermetically-sealed compartments was one of the things that enabled the 9-11 terrorists to murder 3000 people. The Act could certainly be applied with more wisdom, but I don't believe gutting/eliminating it is the answer.

My "right" not to be inconvenienced would be of little value if I'm murdered.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Too many simply succumb to fear. You guys are being played. Our ports are wide open while the government is busy listening to my phone conversations and checking what books I picked up at the local library? Meanwhile we're pouring oil into the very fire we're being told is about to burn us. And that somehow makes me safer in any way? What a joke.

Edited May 13, 2008 by Mr. Big Dog

[GaryC 7]

The comments here show in graphic detail how some people don't understand the threats we are facing. To say you would rather have a terrorist attack rather than the remote possibility that someone may have seen your email or listened in on an overseas call is beyond all reason. Where would you draw the line? The last time it was 3000 people and two of the tallest buildings in the world. The next time it may be a nuclear bomb in NYC or Washington. Or it may be a nerve gas attack or maybe a germ warfare agent that kills hundreds of thousands. Is the keeping of your email or phone call private worth that? There is an old adage, the good of the many out weighs the good of the few. Isn't this the rational that the left uses to justify taxing everyone for government run health care? Why is taking my liberty (the fact that I can choose my health care on my own) away and taxing me for the good of the rest OK but this is not? Personally I don't give a damn if the government data mines my emails or phone calls. They already know what I have in the bank (I report it every year on my taxes). It's not like they have 300 million people listening in on our 300 million people. They don't do it for some thrill. I just don't get it. People are willing to put the entire country at risk over some computer mining data from the internet or phones. I guess if you all get your wish and elect Obama you will not cry about it when your family gets killed in the next attack. An attack that could have been prevented by the sensible provisions of the Patriot Act. Mav is right, you get the government you deserve.

Too many simply succumb to fear. You guys are being played. Our ports are wide open while the government is busy listening to my phone conversations and checking what books I picked up at the local library? Meanwhile we're pouring oil into the very fire we're being told is about to burn us. And that somehow makes me safer in any way? What a joke.

Obama is an open borders advocate. So you want to take all security away from us? What a joke. Your the one being played my friend.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Too many simply succumb to fear. You guys are being played. Our ports are wide open while the government is busy listening to my phone conversations and checking what books I picked up at the local library? Meanwhile we're pouring oil into the very fire we're being told is about to burn us. And that somehow makes me safer in any way? What a joke.

Obama is an open borders advocate. So you want to take all security away from us? What a joke. Your the one being played my friend.

What security? I'm quite aware of the futility of any attempt to actually seal a country such as this one off. But I'm not the one running around pretending that the Patriot Act or the fanning of the flames in the Middle East is making anyone safer. It simply doesn't and I believe it's best to acknowledge that. It's also worth acknowledging that our allowing them to dictate what freedoms and liberties we maintain and which we are willing to sacrifice at this supposed altar of security actually hands them a win. I don't like this defeatist attitude that Bush and Co have been shoving down Americas throat.

Edited May 13, 2008 by Mr. Big Dog

[GaryC 7]

Too many simply succumb to fear. You guys are being played. Our ports are wide open while the government is busy listening to my phone conversations and checking what books I picked up at the local library? Meanwhile we're pouring oil into the very fire we're being told is about to burn us. And that somehow makes me safer in any way? What a joke.

Obama is an open borders advocate. So you want to take all security away from us? What a joke. Your the one being played my friend.

What security? I'm quite aware of the futility of any attempt to actually seal a country such as this one off. But I'm not the one running around pretending that the Patriot Act or the fanning of the flames in the Middle East is making anyone safer. It simply doesn't and I believe it's best to acknowledge that.

Does this sound like security to you? It's Obama's immigration platform.

Barack Obama

Sen. Obama (D-IL), the son of a Kenyan immigrant, has spoken out on immigration and voted on numerous immigration bills since taking office in January 2005. Obama, whose Illinois constituents include a high percentage of Mexican immigrants, voted against the English as a National Language Amendment in 2006. Obama proposed three amendments that were included in the Senate Immigration Reform Bill last year, including one that mandates that jobs be offered to American workers at a “prevailing wage” before they are offered to guest workers. Another of these amendments makes it a requirement that employers are able to prove that their workers are all legally permitted to work in the United States. His third amendment grants the FBI $3 million a year to improve efficiency for background checks on immigrants applying for citizenship. Obama has also called for sweeping amnesty for illegal immigrants. However, he voted for the Secure Fence Act of 2006.

Obama opposed an amendment to the Senate immigration reform bill of June 2007 that would prevent immigrants with a criminal record from gaining legal status (AP).

Obama supports granting driver's licenses to illegal immigrants, and has called it a "public safety concern."

http://www.cfr.org/publication/14766/

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Too many simply succumb to fear. You guys are being played. Our ports are wide open while the government is busy listening to my phone conversations and checking what books I picked up at the local library? Meanwhile we're pouring oil into the very fire we're being told is about to burn us. And that somehow makes me safer in any way? What a joke.

Obama is an open borders advocate. So you want to take all security away from us? What a joke. Your the one being played my friend.

What security? I'm quite aware of the futility of any attempt to actually seal a country such as this one off. But I'm not the one running around pretending that the Patriot Act or the fanning of the flames in the Middle East is making anyone safer. It simply doesn't and I believe it's best to acknowledge that.

Does this sound like security to you? It's Obama's immigration platform.

Barack Obama

Sen. Obama (D-IL), the son of a Kenyan immigrant, has spoken out on immigration and voted on numerous immigration bills since taking office in January 2005. Obama, whose Illinois constituents include a high percentage of Mexican immigrants, voted against the English as a National Language Amendment in 2006. Obama proposed three amendments that were included in the Senate Immigration Reform Bill last year, including one that mandates that jobs be offered to American workers at a “prevailing wage†before they are offered to guest workers. Another of these amendments makes it a requirement that employers are able to prove that their workers are all legally permitted to work in the United States. His third amendment grants the FBI $3 million a year to improve efficiency for background checks on immigrants applying for citizenship. Obama has also called for sweeping amnesty for illegal immigrants. However, he voted for the Secure Fence Act of 2006.

Obama opposed an amendment to the Senate immigration reform bill of June 2007 that would prevent immigrants with a criminal record from gaining legal status (AP).

Obama supports granting driver's licenses to illegal immigrants, and has called it a "public safety concern."

http://www.cfr.org/publication/14766/

Actually, there isn't a candidate running that represents me on illegal immigration. It's tough titties on that one. Well, that is unless McSame flip-flops on that one too prior to November to appease some section of the Republican spectrum his campaign feels they need more than the Hispanics.

Edited May 13, 2008 by Mr. Big Dog

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

Dissapointments will follow. Al Gore? John Kerry? You Dems put so so much hope in your in your basket. Cya in november. Barry is gonna get trashed and yet you will hold on to him like your saviour

When will you learn the lesson?