82% of Americans (and 62% of Republicans) believe the country is on the wrong track

[HAL 9000 96]

There is an old adage, the good of the many out weighs the good of the few.

I thought it was from Star Trek 2?

More so that really sounds like a Communist slogan...

It also quite accurately describes the problem with democratic elections - majority rules and all that, whether that losing minority is 10% or 49%.

I just think it gives some folks the misconception that might makes right. Sure, that is the way things have been... victors tend to write the history books for those younglings to have to learn, but that does not equate to either right... or wrong.

[mawilson 2,133]

I just think it gives some folks the misconception that might makes right. Sure, that is the way things have been... victors tend to write the history books for those younglings to have to learn, but that does not equate to either right... or wrong.

How about "might makes righthistory"? PC enough for you?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

the terrorist event that sparked the patriot act involved the deaths of over 3000 people and millions, if not billions of dollars in damage, and many more at ground zero have developed respiratory problems from that day. is this what you call small time?

No, 9/11 was not small time and took years to plan. It would be virtually impossible to perpetrate

an attack of this magnitude in a post-9/11 USA -- people are much more vigilant these days.

I've always wondered why there haven't been more incidents like the train bombings in Madrid and London. You see the crowds of people swarming the platforms at Penn Station, Liverpool Street or Waterloo in rush hour - surely there's not really much that the police could do in terms of security - at least not without paralysing the whole infrastructure.

The terrorists acting in Europe did not come from the Middle East to perpetrate their

attacks - they were born in Europe and it is in Europe that they became "born-again"

Muslims and political radicals. Radical Islamism in Europe is homegrown - it's not an import.

I don't think the US is facing the same problems with radical Islamic elements. Although

the US undoubtedly has its fair share of racial problems, it's one of the most culturally

diverse countries on earth. Because of America's unique history as a country of immigrants,

people are bound together not by race, ethnicity, or religion, but by their shared values

and a common goal of seeking their fortune in a vast new land of opportunities.

The history of cultural diversity in Europe is quite different. Until very recently, there

was no large-scale immigration into Europe. European countries are still ethnically and

culturally homogeneous, and Europeans in their respective countries (Italians in Italy, etc)

are still very xenophobic. Refusing to abandon their original cultural attributes and conform

entirely to the behaviours and customs of the majority of the native-born population,

immigrants tend to become socio-economically marginalized, and as a result, become

ready recruits for radical mobilization.

Right - but even in Europe I wonder why this hasn't happened more than it has, given that anyone with a backpack can get on a crowded train and noone is any the wiser...

In the 80's the IRA used to shut down almost entire cities with call-in bomb threats.

[HAL 9000 96]

I just think it gives some folks the misconception that might makes right. Sure, that is the way things have been... victors tend to write the history books for those younglings to have to learn, but that does not equate to either right... or wrong.

How about "might makes righthistory"? PC enough for you?

SSDD brother Marc...

[mawilson 2,133]

Right - but even in Europe I wonder why this hasn't happened more than it has, given that anyone with a backpack can get on a crowded train and noone is any the wiser...

It's probably not as easy as it sounds -- and I doubt there are many "volunteers"

ready to die for a questionable cause.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Right - but even in Europe I wonder why this hasn't happened more than it has, given that anyone with a backpack can get on a crowded train and noone is any the wiser...

It's probably not as easy as it sounds -- and I doubt there are many "volunteers"

ready to die for a questionable cause.

I dunno - they had that whole Finsbury Park Mosque thing a while back - with hook-hand. There does seem to be a base for this kind of thing.

From what I remember from commuting - the trains are pretty much wide-open. Its frightening...

[HAL 9000 96]

Right - but even in Europe I wonder why this hasn't happened more than it has, given that anyone with a backpack can get on a crowded train and noone is any the wiser...

It's probably not as easy as it sounds -- and I doubt there are many "volunteers"

ready to die for a questionable cause.

I dunno - they had that whole Finsbury Park Mosque thing a while back - with hook-hand. There does seem to be a base for this kind of thing.

From what I remember from commuting - the trains are pretty much wide-open. Its frightening...

Pretty sickening... why do you think European-grown "Islamic" terrorism is able to gain adepts in modern times? Perhaps its the closeness to the homeland?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Right - but even in Europe I wonder why this hasn't happened more than it has, given that anyone with a backpack can get on a crowded train and noone is any the wiser...

It's probably not as easy as it sounds -- and I doubt there are many "volunteers"

ready to die for a questionable cause.

I dunno - they had that whole Finsbury Park Mosque thing a while back - with hook-hand. There does seem to be a base for this kind of thing.

From what I remember from commuting - the trains are pretty much wide-open. Its frightening...

Pretty sickening... why do you think European-grown "Islamic" terrorism is able to gain adepts in modern times? Perhaps its the closeness to the homeland?

Long-established immigration links between the UK and Pakistan/Bangladesh, not to mention that we take in a lot of refugees from pretty much every major war zone - from Bosnia to Iraq.

Edited May 13, 2008 by Number 6

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

The UK is way too nice to its ex colonies.

In the interests of self preservation, they may want to stop.

[HAL 9000 96]

Interesting...

[one...two...tree 2,762]

the terrorist event that sparked the patriot act involved the deaths of over 3000 people and millions, if not billions of dollars in damage, and many more at ground zero have developed respiratory problems from that day. is this what you call small time?

No, 9/11 was not small time and took years to plan. It would be virtually impossible to perpetrate

an attack of this magnitude in a post-9/11 USA -- people are much more vigilant these days.

I've always wondered why there haven't been more incidents like the train bombings in Madrid and London. You see the crowds of people swarming the platforms at Penn Station, Liverpool Street or Waterloo in rush hour - surely there's not really much that the police could do in terms of security - at least not without paralysing the whole infrastructure.

The terrorists acting in Europe did not come from the Middle East to perpetrate their

attacks - they were born in Europe and it is in Europe that they became "born-again"

Muslims and political radicals. Radical Islamism in Europe is homegrown - it's not an import.

I don't think the US is facing the same problems with radical Islamic elements. Although

the US undoubtedly has its fair share of racial problems, it's one of the most culturally

diverse countries on earth. Because of America's unique history as a country of immigrants,

people are bound together not by race, ethnicity, or religion, but by their shared values

and a common goal of seeking their fortune in a vast new land of opportunities.

The history of cultural diversity in Europe is quite different. Until very recently, there

was no large-scale immigration into Europe. European countries are still ethnically and

culturally homogeneous, and Europeans in their respective countries (Italians in Italy, etc)

are still very xenophobic. Refusing to abandon their original cultural attributes and conform

entirely to the behaviours and customs of the majority of the native-born population,

immigrants tend to become socio-economically marginalized, and as a result, become

ready recruits for radical mobilization.

Excellent post, mawilson. Wow!

[Sister Fracas 5]

Excellent post, mawilson. Wow!

I double that!

[mawilson 2,133]

Excellent post, mawilson. Wow!

I've been saying it over and over again, but people usually disagree with the

statement that Europe is less welcoming to immigrants than America.

For all the tolerance and love and acceptance they preach and teach, they

certainly don't seem to extend that to foreigners.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Excellent post, mawilson. Wow!

I've been saying it over and over again, but people usually disagree with the

statement that Europe is less welcoming to immigrants than America.

For all the tolerance and love and acceptance they preach and teach, they

certainly don't seem to extend that to foreigners.

Yeah that is true, pretty much.

[HAL 9000 96]

Excellent post, mawilson. Wow!

I've been saying it over and over again, but people usually disagree with the

statement that Europe is less welcoming to immigrants than America.

For all the tolerance and love and acceptance they preach and teach, they

certainly don't seem to extend that to foreigners.

I think they're still working on the "getting to love themselves" part after centuries of butchering each other on the battlefields of the continent. Cut 'em some slack... they'll get on with the project.

At least in Spain they are not too bad in extending visas to Latin Americans having been ex colonies under very bipolar conditions... then again, they too in Spain practice in many areas what is known as xenophobia akin to that which is practiced by some elements that despise any immigration to this country.