Non-Muslims married to Muslim MENA

[Nasturtium 500]

within the range of the type of things that occur when any 2 people marry and merge their 2 lives into one.

Yes! I agree. Really most of our differences have been personal differences... he is a neat freak and I'm not, I love cats, he doesn't love them inside, etc. He is an insomniac and I love to sleep. So it is more of a matter of just merging two lives.

[S and S 12]

My husband is always worried about me going to the mosque, but I explain to him there are few other ways for me to learn Islam from others and interact with other muslim women. Often times I feel like such a minority with little help to grow into my religion and practice it properly. Every day I learn new things and I thank God he has guided me thus far. Yet for my husband, he is uncomfortable with the idea of me going there because he doesn't know the mosque or the people. It is a compromise to let me go, but I promise to let him know how it went and who I talked to. The funny thing is, when I went to a mosque in the middle east, I came through the same entrance as the men. Here in the United States I always have to go through the women's entrance. One would think it would be the opposite!

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

Yes Melinda and Mohamed and your little dog Toto too.... PLEASE TELL MOHAMED THE GOOD GUYS ALWAYS WIN IN AMERICAN MOVIES AND THE WITCHES AND MONSTERS USUALLY GET THEIRS

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Then you must be getting yours very soon.

I'm not at all surprised that you are a booster of this situation. When was the last time you were right about anything you posted here having to do with the sharia?

. . . . ah, never.

Edited April 19, 2008 by Virtual wife

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

Yes Melinda and Mohamed and your little dog Toto too.... PLEASE TELL MOHAMED THE GOOD GUYS ALWAYS WIN IN AMERICAN MOVIES AND THE WITCHES AND MONSTERS USUALLY GET THEIRS

oh and this one too

[Hanna&Mohamed 0]

Good ones Wahrania

[mohamed N melinda 0]

hahahaha typical virtual wife ignorant and just spread wrong information

you know it is waste my time to read your posting and answer it

old mam like you just keep home praying and ask forgivness for what she did allover her life

and oh please dont pretend to be angel good muslim while you arenot and show your ugly old face thats all i can say about you . and by sorry i see some new muslim believe her lie about islam it is very sad . but Allah know best

dont you know by marrying non muslim man u admmit shirk and u should say shahada again

i wish you do before you die cause i really wish you die muslim not mushrika .

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

Good ones Wahrania

It s more likely that an Imam would be more accepting of a young couple with a baby than a woman who married outside of Islam and was a muslima.

You may win battles on paper,VW but you look like a complete ###, nasty,uncaring and witch like.No compassionate normal person,especially a woman would stand in judgement of these kids or seek to mar their happiness. You are decades older than your husband and cant have kids with him or give him what he deserves as a young man.Instead he gets an old nasty carping hag.Poor kid

[mohamed N melinda 0]

Good ones Wahrania

It s more likely that an Imam would be more accepting of a young couple with a baby than a woman who married outside of Islam and was a muslima.

You may win battles on paper,VW but you look like a complete ###, nasty,uncaring and witch like.No compassionate normal person,especially a woman would stand in judgement of these kids or seek to mar their happiness. You are decades older than your husband and cant have kids with him or give him what he deserves as a young man.Instead he gets an old nasty carping hag.Poor kid

i wonder since she cant give him kids why he married her for then? we all know why she marriied him . sure for young ###### as she said the old ummah wasnot shy to talk about sexual matters .

what make young man need to make new familly marry old woman cant give him kids

just wonder

[mohamed N melinda 0]

Marriage between Muslims and non-Muslims are not considered to be the ideal. However, Allah allows for them under certain cirsumstances. They are:

Q 5:5 That they be between chaste Muslims and chaste people of the Book (Christians and Jews)

Q 24:3 That they be between Muslim fornicators and non-believers (this is a specific class of non-Muslim)

Q 2:222 That Muslims avoid marriage with those who worship false Gods (some would include Christians among them)

Q 60:10-11 That we avoid marriage with those hostile to Islam and Muslims (quite reasonable)

Sorry, the evidence is not to be avoided so it can be pc. And, it's not a matter of intending to insult anyone; everyone knows what category they are in better than I do.

Aren't the two bolded ones contradictory?

I saved your post for last, jenn, because I knew it would come. And I was so glad it did. Mohammed also asked me how I can justify mixed marriage for Muslims if the ayat 2:221 and 60:10-11 forbid it.

The problem is that novices often generalize the specific in the text and specify the general in the text while plucking a single ayah away form surrounding ayah, the contextual history of its revelation, the linguistics involved, and how the Prophet personified the text.

If one merely isolated the two bolded sections you refer to, it would be easy to deduce that Christians are not allowed in marriage to Muslims. But, there is more to it than that.

We already know that not all Muslims will enter heaven. Allah is not as interested in what label you give yourself as He is in your acts. The Quran is the only sacred Abrahamic text that specifically allows for mixed marriages, and the only one that declares that there will be non-Muslims in heaven. It is careful to avoid blanketing entire groups of people as heretics, but bases one’s piety on character, values and behavior.

For example, in 2:221, the terminology used is definitive, and refers to practice rather than an entire group of people. The same is true for 60:10, and 5:5. There are characteristics involved that qualify an individual as halal or not, just as the directive that unchaste Muslims marry only other unchaste Muslims or an unbeliever. Islam teaches that we will be judged by Him as individuals, for our own acts and deeds, not for those of others around you.

The term “unbeliever” is commonly abused one in transliterations of the Arabic. It is not meant to refer to all non-Muslims, and the Arabic is more nuanced than the agenda behind the common use of that word. Therefore, there are those among non-Muslims who are devoted to God and in service to His Creation, who worship sincerely and keep to His laws, who avidly seek to please Him in Word and deed. They are not perfect, but are earnest. Allah says it matter not that they abide by the scriptures of the Torah or the Bible, their reward will be with Him.

Those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Sabians and the Christians,- any who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness,- on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve. Q 5.69

In the Prophets inner circle, there were mixed faith couples where the wife was Muslim and the husband was not. He didn’t ask them to divorce as long as there was harmony in the union. That was also the case with his own daughter, Zaynab, who remained with her non-Muslim husband, until he became kafir by engaging in hostilities against the Muslims in the Battle of Badr (Q 60:10), and they were separated until his conversion.

If one keeps in mind that the premise of the Message is that all humans have free will to decie if and how they follow God, then individual practice gains more emphasis and importance, lessening the concept that whole groups are to be condemned because they do not call themselves Muslim. If there were no pious Christians or Jews, we would not be allowed to marry among them unless for the reason of fornication.

Allah actually intends for us to believe differently from each other as a test for how we learn to live together and to obey Him (Q 5:48 & 49:13). He expects us to protect the mutual God-given rights of all humanity, male and female:

O mankind! reverence your Guardian-Lord, who created you from a single person, created, of like nature, His mate, and from them twain scattered (like seeds) countless men and women;- reverence God, through whom ye demand your mutual (rights), and (reverence) the wombs (That bore you): for God ever watches over you. Q 4.1

We are created of like nature, one not superior one over the other due to nationality, ethnicity, race, or gender.

O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise (each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of God is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And God has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things). Q 49:13

Life is a test of faith. We are to learn how to live a God centered life, and to do it without animosity toward those whom God has chosen to adhere to faiths unlike our own.

And hold fast, all together, by the rope which God (stretches out for you), and be not divided among yourselves; and remember with gratitude God's favor on you; for ye were enemies and He joined your hearts in love, so that by His Grace, ye became brethren; and ye were on the brink of the pit of Fire, and He saved you from it. Thus doth God make His Signs clear to you: That ye may be guided. Q 3.103

To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what God hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to the e. To each among you have we prescribed a law and an open way. If God had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) to test you in what He hath given you: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to God; it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute; Q 5.48

Our Nabi married a variety of women, consulted the Jewish scriptures for guidance, took santuary from a Christian king for the safety of his ummah, sought the consul of strong females, and was not distracted by interfaith marriages between Muslim women and non-Muslim men. He depended upon the character of his allies, and the strength of their faith and values rather than their gender or labels to when seeking them out. This is the best example we follow when earning trust and forming unions.

I hope this is helpful to you.

I know you addressed Jen, but this post was very helpful to me. I have a friend who is muslim and married to a Christian. She is convinced she is living in sin but can't leave her husband because she loves him so much and knows he is a good Christian man. She wants to have children but she is afraid that it will only add to her sin. I will pass this information to her in the hopes it helps her and comforts her.

you can do what you want and pass those wrong information to her to make her feel comfots as you say . but just know you will be sharing her in sin

quraan is clear and complete and for youe knowledge as new muslim some ayats of quran not any muslim can understand it or explained it . you need some one to help you to understand the right meaning and explaining of it by some shiekh not one explain due to thier personal desire if your hubby is muslim please ask him to explain it for or he can ask some certain shiekh about it. by sorry i am not perfect in english to explain islamic to you in arabic yes i can

[Ban Hammer 13,110]

ya know, i'm not muslim but i can sure tell who knows what they are talking about and who don't know their ####### from a hole in the ground.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

ya know, i'm not muslim but i can sure tell who knows what they are talking about and who don't know their ####### from a hole in the ground.

No one is saying that certain people are not very well read or knowledgable about Islam.Its when their need to be right overcomes good common sense and they start to abuse others.....then knowledge no longer matters if its delivered with abuse.

Salafists do nothing but study Islam day and night.But some advocate strict interpretation of certain verses that encourage jihad and killing in the name of Islam.When you as a lay practicioner are at the point you declare people not married and you make pronouncements about the intentions of a husband towards their wife and you are NO IMAM and you persist on saying nasty, belittling things,eventually someone will snap back at you,which is what happened...

[Ban Hammer 13,110]

ya know, i'm not muslim but i can sure tell who knows what they are talking about and who don't know their ####### from a hole in the ground.

No one is saying that certain people are not very well read or knowledgable about Islam.Its when their need to be right overcomes good common sense and they start to abuse others.....then knowledge no longer matters if its delivered with abuse.

Salafists do nothing but study Islam day and night.But some advocate strict interpretation of certain verses that encourage jihad and killing in the name of Islam.When you as a lay practicioner are at the point you declare people not married and you make pronouncements about the intentions of a husband towards their wife and you are NO IMAM and you persist on saying nasty, belittling things,eventually someone will snap back at you,which is what happened...

that's all well and wonderful but geg/vw is not salafi.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

ya know, i'm not muslim but i can sure tell who knows what they are talking about and who don't know their ####### from a hole in the ground.

No one is saying that certain people are not very well read or knowledgable about Islam.Its when their need to be right overcomes good common sense and they start to abuse others.....then knowledge no longer matters if its delivered with abuse.

Salafists do nothing but study Islam day and night.But some advocate strict interpretation of certain verses that encourage jihad and killing in the name of Islam.When you as a lay practicioner are at the point you declare people not married and you make pronouncements about the intentions of a husband towards their wife and you are NO IMAM and you persist on saying nasty, belittling things,eventually someone will snap back at you,which is what happened...

that's all well and wonderful but geg/vw is not salafi.

I would not know but by attacking the marriage of this couple,she is attacking several couples on the boards,all with young children,who arrived in Egypt last year after they changed the law making it impossible for these mixed American Egyptian marriages to marry in the courts.This is the AMERICAN government that would not give them the adequate papers to satisfy the Egyptian governnment to get married,not the other way around.

GEG aka virtual wife has declared their marriages invalid as if she is a Caliph and in effect their children bastards...She belittled and mistreated one of the Egyptian husbands on the board who is a new father and frankly I read another post by a similar girl married with a baby and became incensed.I doubt any Imam ,scholar or anyone else in Islam would belittle and mistreat these couples as she has.If people were harsh back,frankly they have every reason to be.

[sara535 15]

Wahrania its just weird to see you in here heroically defending who you perceive to be the underdog when there are pages and pages and pages in this forum of YOU attacking other people's marriages!

not trying to attack you but come on, this is now pages and pages of back and forth arguing and although you may not agree with some of her conclusions, VW has put forth her opinion backed by evidence of how she formed it and you have responded by making the very sort of ugly personal attacks that you claim to hate. I certainly dont know enough about Islam to comment on any of it and even if I did I doubt I would join this train wreck about it but I feel pretty sure that its totally unnecessary to make jabs about her age and looks. Either debate with her on her level and beat her at her own game by providing some research and opinions not cut and pasted from other websites or back out of it~ surely you can see that some of her frustration has been that for example, mohammed and melinda have posted articles that contradicted what they were trying to say which means they didnt even read them all the way, which is just sloppy debate practice. If you really think she is wrong then try to prove it, but frothing at the mouth and calling her an old hag really doesnt add any credibility to your 'side'.

(sorry VW and mohamed/melinda, not trying to put words in your mouth nor am I choosing a 'side')