Non-Muslims married to Muslim MENA

[Michaela_Hassan 1]

How has the geography of religion evolved over the centuries, and where has it sparked wars? Our map gives us a brief history of the world's most well-known religions: Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, and Judaism. Selected periods of inter-religious bloodshed are also highlighted. Want to see 5,000 years of religion in 90 seconds? Ready, Set, Go!

http://www.mapsofwar.com/ind/history-of-religion.html

That map is great Ganja Girl thanks!

[Aymsgirl 0]

I just want to say that what Bridget is saying is correct regarding the embassy. They are the reason why lots of couples were not allowed to legalize and register their marriages. I know this firsthand, done been there and tried it.

I just sat here and read 17 pages of debates on the way people live their life and it makes me ill to my stomach to see the judgement passed onto others. This is my first post that I have written to where I am almost ashamed to have joined this site. I came here for support and advice and not to be judged. I personally did not join into this conversation because of this reason until now.

I am not thoroughly educated on Islam to comment but I do take offense when people start slandering others, especially when there is a child involved. I would think that it should be up to Allah to judge if a sin has been committed. Posts such as some of these are so offensive that a non-believer could be so turned off and never want to have anything to do with religion. What a shame that would be!

[SaadBell 0]

Children are precious, no one has any right to tell you different.

[sarahaziz 0]

I just want to say that what Bridget is saying is correct regarding the embassy. They are the reason why lots of couples were not allowed to legalize and register their marriages. I know this firsthand, done been there and tried it.

I just sat here and read 17 pages of debates on the way people live their life and it makes me ill to my stomach to see the judgement passed onto others. This is my first post that I have written to where I am almost ashamed to have joined this site. I came here for support and advice and not to be judged. I personally did not join into this conversation because of this reason until now.

I am not thoroughly educated on Islam to comment but I do take offense when people start slandering others, especially when there is a child involved. I would think that it should be up to Allah to judge if a sin has been committed. Posts such as some of these are so offensive that a non-believer could be so turned off and never want to have anything to do with religion. What a shame that would be!

[Elghazi2008 4]

This is a really interesting topic to me as well, although my story doesn't exactly address the question. I thought I'd post anyway though because I would like some feedback too, in case my current understanding is off.

I was raised as a Christian and my fiance is Muslim. We've talked about this and we're finding that our beliefs are actually quite similar; more or less because my beliefs aren't set in stone the same way his are. I can imagine a marriage between non-Muslims and Muslims requiring much more work if there is no amount of tolerance or understanding of eachother's religion. We usually don't talk about religion unless I ask him to explain something that I couldn't understand from reading an online version of the Koran. He is pretty knowledgeable about Christianity and likes to help me out, occasionally throwing in a good word for Islam. I don't mind his subtle attempts to remind me that converting is always an option though, instead I kind of wish that I had as much faith in the beliefs I was raised with as he does in Islam.

As a non-Muslim, I admit that I do not believe some of the things that are taken as truth in the religion of Islam, but I don't mind compromise. When we decide to start a family, he would like our children to be raised as Muslims. We have a little bit more to discuss as far as that goes, but I am more than happy to raise our children that way as long as he and I establish some understanding of how other religions are going to be presented and such. I think we both want our children to understand that each person's religion is their own and they should be respected, whether they agree with the beliefs or not. I must say that I do have trouble accepting that it's okay for a Muslim man to marry a non-Muslim, and it's not okay for a Muslim woman to marry a non-Muslim...But I'm learning and I understand that it's a belief that I need to respect and come to terms with.

Luckily, my fiance understands my beliefs and I do my best to understand his, but it's not guaranteed that a mutual respect will always be present between every couple. Talking and understanding what you both expect from eachother and for your family before situations arise is definitely a plus, as it is in every relationship.

[sarahaziz 0]

This topic is a perfect example of the problem with religion;

Mideast

Jews and Muslims are slaughtering each other over religion. They are fighting for 'their' sacred ground. They kill in the name of God or Allah and according to the scriptures. They fight against the 'great satan' which is America.

Ireland

Protestants and Catholics are slaughtering each other over religion.

Serbia/Croatia

Catholic Croats and Orthodox Christian Serbs slaughtered each other over religion while both slaughtered the Bosnian Muslims over religion.

Pakistan

Sunni Muslims and Shite Muslims slaughter each other over religion.

Algeria

Crusaders for God hack to death thousands and cut off their heads over religion.

Europe - Crusades and Inquisitions

Christianity spread across Europe and butchered or burned Muslims, Jews and Protestants - over religion. "Nulla salus extra ecclesium" ("Outside the Church there is no salvation.") It was "open season" on those who taught any doctrine other than that which the Pope allowed and this made such people enemies of the Catholic Church. How does this sound?... "Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnoset" or "Kill them all. God will know His own." answer from Arnaud-Armaury, the Abbot of Citeaux in the 1200's as to how to identify the heretics. All 20,000 residents of the town were slaughtered.

Americas

In the New World, Christian missionaries slaughtered and butchered the Aztecs, Incas and Mayas and destroyed their 'sacred' temples over religion.

Moses

This man was a killing machine! Again, the killing was over religion, directed by God and carried out in God's name.

The first two conflicts in your list are over land, not religion. Casual observers may become confused because the opposing sides are of different religions/ethnicities. But if you study the roots of these two conflicts, you will see a similar pattern -- the invasion by a more powerful group of foreigners/outsiders, and their forcible confiscation and "settlement" of native-owned land.

Several of the others on your list have been quite over-simplified as well. Do not underestimate the motivations of wealth, power, and competition for resources and strategic influence.

I think ganja girl was right. The land is "holy" therefore they are fighting to save a religious holy land.

[Ban Hammer 13,110]

Children are precious, no one has any right to tell you different.

as long as they stay outta my yard

[morocco4ever 63]

I won't even go into the religious discussion, since I am far from versed in it. I do have my ideas and opinions of what is right and wrong.

I can see that getting married in Egypt is not an easy task. On the other hand, if these marriages that are not legally recoginized are not accepted by Islam then trying to justify why you married in that manor is basically justifying having sex, nothing more nothing less. Since I don't know much about Islam I really can't say for sure.

Don't get me wrong, anyone can do what they want, I don't have a problem with that, and if that is your choice then it really is none of my business, nor will I try to put your down for your choices. To each his own, I am just voicing my opinion, that is all.

Like I said, I am not well versed in Islam, but I have known both Sunni and Shiite men. My husband, who is Sunni, does not believe in this kind of marriage. The men I know that are Shiite have been married in this fashion (in the state I live in). One of these men confided in me and told me that it isn't a real marriage, but it is an agreement with God to have sex with a friend, nothing more nothing less. He told me that men here are doing these marriages because the women here don't understand it and will take care of all of their needs (cooking, cleaning, money, etc) without the real committment. Their ultimate goal was to eventually go back to their country and find a "woman that derserves them" (his words). My friend married one of these men in this fashion. She told me that with this marriage there is a time frame for the life of the marriage. In her case it was 2 years. Weird to me but whatever. He used her for a place to live, washing cooking, money while he went out with many many other women. Now he left her for another woman. He has the same type marriage with this new woman, and 3 kids with her as well (2 of them were born while he was still with my friend).

Isn't this a little screwed up? I just can't see the validity of a marriage like this. If this is the acceptable manner of this type of marriage I will pass.

Sorry if this offends anyone, I really don't judge any of your choices, its just my view.

[SaadBell 0]

as long as they stay outta my yard

[Jenn! 918]

Marriage between Muslims and non-Muslims are not considered to be the ideal. However, Allah allows for them under certain cirsumstances. They are:

Q 5:5 That they be between chaste Muslims and chaste people of the Book (Christians and Jews)

Q 24:3 That they be between Muslim fornicators and non-believers (this is a specific class of non-Muslim)

Q 2:222 That Muslims avoid marriage with those who worship false Gods (some would include Christians among them)

Q 60:10-11 That we avoid marriage with those hostile to Islam and Muslims (quite reasonable)

Sorry, the evidence is not to be avoided so it can be pc. And, it's not a matter of intending to insult anyone; everyone knows what category they are in better than I do.

Aren't the two bolded ones contradictory?

[sara..... 371]

I won't even go into the religious discussion, since I am far from versed in it. I do have my ideas and opinions of what is right and wrong.

I can see that getting married in Egypt is not an easy task. On the other hand, if these marriages that are not legally recoginized are not accepted by Islam then trying to justify why you married in that manor is basically justifying having sex, nothing more nothing less. Since I don't know much about Islam I really can't say for sure.

Don't get me wrong, anyone can do what they want, I don't have a problem with that, and if that is your choice then it really is none of my business, nor will I try to put your down for your choices. To each his own, I am just voicing my opinion, that is all.

Like I said, I am not well versed in Islam, but I have known both Sunni and Shiite men. My husband, who is Sunni, does not believe in this kind of marriage. The men I know that are Shiite have been married in this fashion (in the state I live in). One of these men confided in me and told me that it isn't a real marriage, but it is an agreement with God to have sex with a friend, nothing more nothing less. He told me that men here are doing these marriages because the women here don't understand it and will take care of all of their needs (cooking, cleaning, money, etc) without the real committment. Their ultimate goal was to eventually go back to their country and find a "woman that derserves them" (his words). My friend married one of these men in this fashion. She told me that with this marriage there is a time frame for the life of the marriage. In her case it was 2 years. Weird to me but whatever. He used her for a place to live, washing cooking, money while he went out with many many other women. Now he left her for another woman. He has the same type marriage with this new woman, and 3 kids with her as well (2 of them were born while he was still with my friend).

Isn't this a little screwed up? I just can't see the validity of a marriage like this. If this is the acceptable manner of this type of marriage I will pass.

Sorry if this offends anyone, I really don't judge any of your choices, its just my view.

the Islamic marraige is legal in Egypt but it can not be registered with the court unless the embassy gives a papers basicly giving permission for the usa citizen.......Egypt laws not usa laws.......but in the eyes of Islam the couple is married even if it is not recorded in the court it is recorded in the mosque and there is a marraige contract that makes it completely legal in always accept in the usa embassy because it was not registered with the court thats usa laws not Egypt law.........i hope that helps clear it up some

[morocco4ever 63]

I won't even go into the religious discussion, since I am far from versed in it. I do have my ideas and opinions of what is right and wrong.

I can see that getting married in Egypt is not an easy task. On the other hand, if these marriages that are not legally recoginized are not accepted by Islam then trying to justify why you married in that manor is basically justifying having sex, nothing more nothing less. Since I don't know much about Islam I really can't say for sure.

Don't get me wrong, anyone can do what they want, I don't have a problem with that, and if that is your choice then it really is none of my business, nor will I try to put your down for your choices. To each his own, I am just voicing my opinion, that is all.

Like I said, I am not well versed in Islam, but I have known both Sunni and Shiite men. My husband, who is Sunni, does not believe in this kind of marriage. The men I know that are Shiite have been married in this fashion (in the state I live in). One of these men confided in me and told me that it isn't a real marriage, but it is an agreement with God to have sex with a friend, nothing more nothing less. He told me that men here are doing these marriages because the women here don't understand it and will take care of all of their needs (cooking, cleaning, money, etc) without the real committment. Their ultimate goal was to eventually go back to their country and find a "woman that derserves them" (his words). My friend married one of these men in this fashion. She told me that with this marriage there is a time frame for the life of the marriage. In her case it was 2 years. Weird to me but whatever. He used her for a place to live, washing cooking, money while he went out with many many other women. Now he left her for another woman. He has the same type marriage with this new woman, and 3 kids with her as well (2 of them were born while he was still with my friend).

Isn't this a little screwed up? I just can't see the validity of a marriage like this. If this is the acceptable manner of this type of marriage I will pass.

Sorry if this offends anyone, I really don't judge any of your choices, its just my view.

the Islamic marraige is legal in Egypt but it can not be registered with the court unless the embassy gives a papers basicly giving permission for the usa citizen.......Egypt laws not usa laws.......but in the eyes of Islam the couple is married even if it is not recorded in the court it is recorded in the mosque and there is a marraige contract that makes it completely legal in always accept in the usa embassy because it was not registered with the court thats usa laws not Egypt law.........i hope that helps clear it up some

So is Egypt mostly a Shiite country? This would explain to me how they would accept this marriage. I am still not totally convinced it is accepted by Islam however, when I see so many different opinions on it. I guess I could read the Quran for myself, but then it would simply be my interpretation of it.

I find it a shame that we have so many Muslims here in the US that pronounce they are Muslim, but go about doing everything that Islam forbids (except eat pork). To many people judge the entire religion on this.

[sarahaziz 0]

Islam & Christianity (I'm not educated about the Torah) can be simplified together as one as far as the Old Testaments. They are the same religion until the New testament is in Place.

If you are an American Christian and living in a Middle eastern country you would also say common phrases as Salaam alikum (peace be unto you) If you ran into a Christian in a Middle East country it's same to how they would talk to you.

A Muslim and Non Muslim marrying doesn't look wrong in MY eyes

Scholars, People with degrees in Islam they can always clear up the path and misunderstanding of Islam but it's true only God can show you what he accepts and doesn't. Who knows maybe it was God's plan to bring together Christian And Muslim by Marriages.

Edited April 18, 2008 by sarahaziz

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

The first two conflicts in your list are over land, not religion. Casual observers may become confused because the opposing sides are of different religions/ethnicities. But if you study the roots of these two conflicts, you will see a similar pattern -- the invasion by a more powerful group of foreigners/outsiders, and their forcible confiscation and "settlement" of native-owned land.

Several of the others on your list have been quite over-simplified as well. Do not underestimate the motivations of wealth, power, and competition for resources and strategic influence.

I think ganja girl was right. The land is "holy" therefore they are fighting to save a religious holy land.

You may think so, but if you will read some history, you will see otherwise:

The Israeli-Palestinian conflict resulted from competing Jewish and Arab national aspirations for the region of Palestine, conflicting promises by the British in the forms of the Hussein-McMahon Correspondence and the Balfour Declaration of 1917, and several outbreaks of violence between Jewish and Arab residents of the region of Palestine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli-Palestinian_conflict

The conflict between Palestinian Arabs and Jews is a modern phenomenon, which began around the turn of the 20th century. Although these two groups have different religions (Palestinians include Muslims, Christians and Druze), religious differences are not the cause of the conflict. It is essentially a struggle over land.

http://www.merip.org/palestine-israel_prim...isr-primer.html

At the heart of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is a dispute over land and borders.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/spl/hi/midd...tml/default.stm

Of course the territory of Ireland is not considered the "Holy Land," but like I said, it is also a conflict over land:

The origins of conflict between Catholics and Protestants in the north of Ireland lie in the British settler-colonial Plantation of Ulster in 1609, which confiscated native owned land and settled Ulster with (mainly Protestant) English and Scottish "planters".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Troubles

I don't mean to derail the thread. We can discuss the subject further if you like in a new topic.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I won't even go into the religious discussion, since I am far from versed in it. I do have my ideas and opinions of what is right and wrong.

I can see that getting married in Egypt is not an easy task. On the other hand, if these marriages that are not legally recoginized are not accepted by Islam then trying to justify why you married in that manor is basically justifying having sex, nothing more nothing less. Since I don't know much about Islam I really can't say for sure.

Don't get me wrong, anyone can do what they want, I don't have a problem with that, and if that is your choice then it really is none of my business, nor will I try to put your down for your choices. To each his own, I am just voicing my opinion, that is all.

Like I said, I am not well versed in Islam, but I have known both Sunni and Shiite men. My husband, who is Sunni, does not believe in this kind of marriage. The men I know that are Shiite have been married in this fashion (in the state I live in). One of these men confided in me and told me that it isn't a real marriage, but it is an agreement with God to have sex with a friend, nothing more nothing less. He told me that men here are doing these marriages because the women here don't understand it and will take care of all of their needs (cooking, cleaning, money, etc) without the real committment. Their ultimate goal was to eventually go back to their country and find a "woman that derserves them" (his words). My friend married one of these men in this fashion. She told me that with this marriage there is a time frame for the life of the marriage. In her case it was 2 years. Weird to me but whatever. He used her for a place to live, washing cooking, money while he went out with many many other women. Now he left her for another woman. He has the same type marriage with this new woman, and 3 kids with her as well (2 of them were born while he was still with my friend).

Isn't this a little screwed up? I just can't see the validity of a marriage like this. If this is the acceptable manner of this type of marriage I will pass.

Sorry if this offends anyone, I really don't judge any of your choices, its just my view.

the Islamic marraige is legal in Egypt but it can not be registered with the court unless the embassy gives a papers basicly giving permission for the usa citizen.......Egypt laws not usa laws.......but in the eyes of Islam the couple is married even if it is not recorded in the court it is recorded in the mosque and there is a marraige contract that makes it completely legal in always accept in the usa embassy because it was not registered with the court thats usa laws not Egypt law.........i hope that helps clear it up some

So is Egypt mostly a Shiite country? This would explain to me how they would accept this marriage. I am still not totally convinced it is accepted by Islam however, when I see so many different opinions on it. I guess I could read the Quran for myself, but then it would simply be my interpretation of it.

I find it a shame that we have so many Muslims here in the US that pronounce they are Muslim, but go about doing everything that Islam forbids (except eat pork). To many people judge the entire religion on this.

NOOOOOOOOOOOO

The American embassy for the longest time recently (I am unsure if they do now) wasnt providing the egyptian government what they needed (the couples)to get married. I also could not wade through the paperwork necessary to marry in Algeria.This has nothing to do with sunnis or shias..This was also NOT a muta marriage.They did the best they could to get married as did I .Morocco is far easier to marry in....It s completely horrible what people are insinuating...Their marriage is halal and that hag should lay off these kids