A Protest Over Bus and Train Citizenship Checks

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Can you be asked to demonstrate your citizenship or residency if you are riding on Amtrak or Greyhound inside the United States?

The answer, apparently, is yes — according to the United States government’s border and transportation officials.

But the frequency of this practice in New York State has raised protests from immigration advocates, who demonstrated in a march on Wednesday afternoon between Pennsylvania Station and Port Authority Bus Terminal.

It used to be a practice that was heard about only once in a while near upstate cities like Buffalo and Syracuse, said Maria Muentes, a spokeswoman with Families For Freedom, a group that helps people fight deportation. “Now we’re seeing it several times a week.”

The group had one instance in which a family was stopped and the mother detained on the train between New York and Chicago. “They should warn people that this could happen,” Ms. Muentes said.

Customs and Border Protection, a division of the Department of Homeland Security, said the stops are just part of routine practice that has gotten more frequent as the manpower on the Canadian border has increased. In the last few years, the number of agents along the northern border has tripled, according to Ramon Rivera, an agency spokesperson.

That is still but a fraction of the southern border — 3,000 agents for a 4,000-mile border compared with 13,000 agents on the 2,000-mile Mexican border.

Amtrak has agreed to cooperate with border inspections on a random basis within 75 miles of the border, said Cliff Cole, an Amtrak spokesperson. “We’re merely facilitating their request to board the train,” he said. The train between Chicago and New York, called the Lakeshore Limited, passes within 75 miles of the border, he said.

Greyhound also said it simply complies with law enforcement requests, be it local, state or federal. “We are under no obligation to inform customers of law enforcement activity at any time,” said Dustin Clark, a Greyhound spokesman. And the bus company plays no role in the inspections. “The frequency and timing is up to the law enforcement,” he said.

While Ms. Muentes said anecdotal reports showed that the agents were focusing on Latinos in the inspections, Mr. Rivera said, “We don’t racial profile in the United States Border Patrol.”

So what exactly are the agents looking for?

If you are a permanent resident in the country, that is a green card holder, you are obligated to keep your resident alien identification card (which is not green, by the way) with you at all times.

But how does one exactly prove citizenship? It’s not like we’re walking around with citizenship cards, despite attempts at a national ID card, or a proxy for one. Hardly anyone carries birth certificates (which don’t have photos anyway, and even if they did, who looks the same as when they were one-day old?). And driver’s licenses, which may or may not become de facto national IDs, are not equated to legal residence as the furor over issuing licenses to illegal immigrants have shown.

“All you have to do is state you are a U.S. citizen,” Mr. Rivera said of the Border and Customs Patrol.

That’s it? That seemed suspiciously simple. What if people lie?

And indeed they do. Each year, “We have thousands of people falsely claiming to a U.S. citizens,” he said.

Well, then a simple declarative statement of citizenship doesn’t seem to be a very effective filter, does it?

That’s where the biometric fingerprints, background checks and interviews come in, he explained.

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/04/...zenship-checks/

[Ban Hammer 13,355]

enforce the laws, people complain.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

If you are a permanent resident in the country, that is a green card holder, you are obligated to keep your resident alien identification card (which is not green, by the way) with you at all times.

But how does one exactly prove citizenship? It’s not like we’re walking around with citizenship cards, despite attempts at a national ID card, or a proxy for one. Hardly anyone carries birth certificates (which don’t have photos anyway, and even if they did, who looks the same as when they were one-day old?). And driver’s licenses, which may or may not become de facto national IDs, are not equated to legal residence as the furor over issuing licenses to illegal immigrants have shown.

“All you have to do is state you are a U.S. citizen,” Mr. Rivera said of the Border and Customs Patrol.

Is my wife supposed to carry around with at all times her the Alien Reg Card (now expired since we are I-751'ing) along with the letter extending it by 1 year?

Or just the expired card?

[Ban Hammer 13,355]

If you are a permanent resident in the country, that is a green card holder, you are obligated to keep your resident alien identification card (which is not green, by the way) with you at all times.

But how does one exactly prove citizenship? It’s not like we’re walking around with citizenship cards, despite attempts at a national ID card, or a proxy for one. Hardly anyone carries birth certificates (which don’t have photos anyway, and even if they did, who looks the same as when they were one-day old?). And driver’s licenses, which may or may not become de facto national IDs, are not equated to legal residence as the furor over issuing licenses to illegal immigrants have shown.

“All you have to do is state you are a U.S. citizen,” Mr. Rivera said of the Border and Customs Patrol.

Is my wife supposed to carry around with at all times her the Alien Reg Card (now expired since we are I-751'ing) along with the letter extending it by 1 year?

Or just the expired card?

what seems a better course to you?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

All I can say is I am glad we don't live near a border. None of that ####### to worry about.

[nane1104 146]

If you are a permanent resident in the country, that is a green card holder, you are obligated to keep your resident alien identification card (which is not green, by the way) with you at all times.

But how does one exactly prove citizenship? It’s not like we’re walking around with citizenship cards, despite attempts at a national ID card, or a proxy for one. Hardly anyone carries birth certificates (which don’t have photos anyway, and even if they did, who looks the same as when they were one-day old?). And driver’s licenses, which may or may not become de facto national IDs, are not equated to legal residence as the furor over issuing licenses to illegal immigrants have shown.

“All you have to do is state you are a U.S. citizen,” Mr. Rivera said of the Border and Customs Patrol.

Is my wife supposed to carry around with at all times her the Alien Reg Card (now expired since we are I-751'ing) along with the letter extending it by 1 year?

Or just the expired card?

The card and the letter, just to be on the safe side? Or at least a copy of the extension letter?

Don't naturalized USC have something like a citizenship card? My husband needed his mother's alien number for his top secret clearance papers and I remember she said something like "I have to check on my card" something of that nature...

[Alex+R 0]

All I can say is I am glad we don't live near a border. None of that ####### to worry about.

No, actually my friend just wrote an article about a bunch of people who live in New York and were arrested on the way to Florida. They were arrested by New York officers. Some of the arrested were legal, some weren't.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

All I can say is I am glad we don't live near a border. None of that ####### to worry about.

No, actually my friend just wrote an article about a bunch of people who live in New York and were arrested on the way to Florida. They were arrested by New York officers. Some of the arrested were legal, some weren't.

Where were they arrested? At an airport?

I realize it's important to have all your papers when you travel. I'm just saying I've never heard or seen anything like an immigration checkpoint in the course of my daily activities here in the Middlesex or Somerset county areas (NJ).

[Niels Bohr 72]

This is all the Mexicans fault!

[GabiandVi 34]

The group had one instance in which a family was stopped and the mother detained on the train between New York and Chicago. “They should warn people that this could happen,” Ms. Muentes said.

This reminds me of when the drug dogs came to the school where I was teaching and the students got upset because they hadn't been warned ahead of time.

[nane1104 146]

This is all the Mexicans fault!

I hope this was a joke, right?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

This is all the Mexicans fault!

Yeah we should stone the next Mezikan we see

[Alex+R 0]

All I can say is I am glad we don't live near a border. None of that ####### to worry about.

No, actually my friend just wrote an article about a bunch of people who live in New York and were arrested on the way to Florida. They were arrested by New York officers. Some of the arrested were legal, some weren't.

Where were they arrested? At an airport?

I realize it's important to have all your papers when you travel. I'm just saying I've never heard or seen anything like an immigration checkpoint in the course of my daily activities here in the Middlesex or Somerset county areas (NJ).

On an Amtrak bus leaving from I think Port Authority.

It's not an immigration checkpoint, they just come on the bus whenever, including before it leaves the station. Amtrak allows them to do this.

[Niels Bohr 72]

This is all the Mexicans fault!

I hope this was a joke, right?

Not all Mexicans, the illegal ones. Most illegals came from Mexico the mexico border (Not all of them are from Mexico) last time I checked my sources. Don't know if it's been changed. Small percentage of 12 million illegals are Asians, and Canadian, Cubans.

Edited April 3, 2008 by consolemaster

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

All I can say is I am glad we don't live near a border. None of that ####### to worry about.

No, actually my friend just wrote an article about a bunch of people who live in New York and were arrested on the way to Florida. They were arrested by New York officers. Some of the arrested were legal, some weren't.

Where were they arrested? At an airport?

I realize it's important to have all your papers when you travel. I'm just saying I've never heard or seen anything like an immigration checkpoint in the course of my daily activities here in the Middlesex or Somerset county areas (NJ).

On an Amtrak bus leaving from I think Port Authority.

It's not an immigration checkpoint, they just come on the bus whenever, including before it leaves the station. Amtrak allows them to do this.

That is very interesting. Seems wrong, somehow.