Russia girls are amazing!

[slim 1,533]

She was good to me on my first visit to her. I was immediatley fascinated by her willingness for affection. ............. how I feel when I am with her (yeah, go ahead I know that you are thinking, that I am a hopeless romantic).

I'm actually not thinking you're a hopeless romantic. I'm thinking your fascination for her willingness for affection is what perpetuated this whole process.

(And is also what's exacerbating the communications problems right now. When you can't talk to each other, it's a lot harder to keep the feelings going when you can't show affection. But, keeping it going... now that makes you a hopeless romantic!)

[slim 1,533]

But this is about you and I recommend a translated phone call(s). It could work wonders in clearing things up. I know it saved our relationship more than once.

So what are you going to do once she's here? Have a translator on stand-by?

Or are you hoping that she'll learn enough English and you'll learn enough Russian that you'll make it work?

If you guys want to make it work, then it will work, but seriously, the communications thing is going to have to get worked out.

[sense1 0]

Hello Mox, Irish44, Slim, and everyone!

I can speak some Russian and Elvira speaks about 12 words in English. I sent her an English learning language program many months ago (she seems to be in no hurry to learn my language). On all 3 of my visits to her we communicated with an electronic translator. However, by my third visit to Russia I did not need to use it very much. I used an interpreter in the early stages of our relationship. Now I speak to her directly by phone and of course, many emails. I believe the current problem that may or may not end our relationship is the fact that she is being to stubburn to get help from others who have more knowledge.

Elvira(my fiancee) sent me an email with an itemized listing of expenses that I must pay for in order for her to get everything required for her visa. The list is as follows:

$450 for translation and apistle and stamp for all of her documents.

$900 for 2 round-trip train tickets from Ufa to Moscow and back(she and her son must both go to Moscow)

$150 a night for 7 night stay in Moscow for her and her son.

That is over $2000. I have read here that translation, train tickets, and hotels can be found for less money. $2000 may or may not seem like alot of money to you but to me it is incredible! I will add that I send her money every month for food and apartment ($600 per month). I have been doing this for a year. I have set aside money for her and her son's plane ticket to America (courtesy of income tax refund). I already know that I will spend $262($131 x 2) on interview fees, $200 on medical exams($100 x 2), and another $100 for food for her trip to Moscow(I have no problem with this).

A very kind member of this community has offered to speak by email with my fiance to help her find better ways to do things (ie save a little money). My fiance refuses to speak with her and has insulted her (my fiance does not even know this person). She accused me of wanting to be with the person who only wants to help her(yes, she is suspicious of Russian women). I can't figure out why she is being so bull-headed. I do not want to think that she is asking for an inflated amount of money for a shopping excursion but it has crossed my mind. Obviously, I have come to the conclusion that my fiancee is not going to listen to any of my suggestions. On one of my trips to Ufa, her and I rode the train from Ufa to Moscow. The cost was $71 each and we were in a cabin all by ourselves( a premium accommodiation if you will, ha ha!). I will entertain all offers of advice and especially suggestions of how to get my fiance to communicate with someone other than me about this visa process...

P.S. is she my fiance or fiancee? Which is the proper one to use?

[eekee 182]

Fiancee.

I hate to say it, but it doesn't look very good for you. 900$ dollars? You could FLY to Russia for less. 450$ for translation? Seriously, she's not even making it believable.

Hello Mox, Irish44, Slim, and everyone!

I can speak some Russian and Elvira speaks about 12 words in English. I sent her an English learning language program many months ago (she seems to be in no hurry to learn my language). On all 3 of my visits to her we communicated with an electronic translator. However, by my third visit to Russia I did not need to use it very much. I used an interpreter in the early stages of our relationship. Now I speak to her directly by phone and of course, many emails. I believe the current problem that may or may not end our relationship is the fact that she is being to stubburn to get help from others who have more knowledge.

Elvira(my fiancee) sent me an email with an itemized listing of expenses that I must pay for in order for her to get everything required for her visa. The list is as follows:

$450 for translation and apistle and stamp for all of her documents.

$900 for 2 round-trip train tickets from Ufa to Moscow and back(she and her son must both go to Moscow)

$150 a night for 7 night stay in Moscow for her and her son.

That is over $2000. I have read here that translation, train tickets, and hotels can be found for less money. $2000 may or may not seem like alot of money to you but to me it is incredible! I will add that I send her money every month for food and apartment ($600 per month). I have been doing this for a year. I have set aside money for her and her son's plane ticket to America (courtesy of income tax refund). I already know that I will spend $262($131 x 2) on interview fees, $200 on medical exams($100 x 2), and another $100 for food for her trip to Moscow(I have no problem with this).

A very kind member of this community has offered to speak by email with my fiance to help her find better ways to do things (ie save a little money). My fiance refuses to speak with her and has insulted her (my fiance does not even know this person). She accused me of wanting to be with the person who only wants to help her(yes, she is suspicious of Russian women). I can't figure out why she is being so bull-headed. I do not want to think that she is asking for an inflated amount of money for a shopping excursion but it has crossed my mind. Obviously, I have come to the conclusion that my fiancee is not going to listen to any of my suggestions. On one of my trips to Ufa, her and I rode the train from Ufa to Moscow. The cost was $71 each and we were in a cabin all by ourselves( a premium accommodiation if you will, ha ha!). I will entertain all offers of advice and especially suggestions of how to get my fiance to communicate with someone other than me about this visa process...

P.S. is she my fiance or fiancee? Which is the proper one to use?

[Bobalouie 0]

Hello Mox, Irish44, Slim, and everyone!

I can speak some Russian and Elvira speaks about 12 words in English. I sent her an English learning language program many months ago (she seems to be in no hurry to learn my language). On all 3 of my visits to her we communicated with an electronic translator. However, by my third visit to Russia I did not need to use it very much. I used an interpreter in the early stages of our relationship. Now I speak to her directly by phone and of course, many emails. I believe the current problem that may or may not end our relationship is the fact that she is being to stubburn to get help from others who have more knowledge.

Elvira(my fiancee) sent me an email with an itemized listing of expenses that I must pay for in order for her to get everything required for her visa. The list is as follows:

$450 for translation and apistle and stamp for all of her documents.

$900 for 2 round-trip train tickets from Ufa to Moscow and back(she and her son must both go to Moscow)

$150 a night for 7 night stay in Moscow for her and her son.

That is over $2000. I have read here that translation, train tickets, and hotels can be found for less money. $2000 may or may not seem like alot of money to you but to me it is incredible! I will add that I send her money every month for food and apartment ($600 per month). I have been doing this for a year. I have set aside money for her and her son's plane ticket to America (courtesy of income tax refund). I already know that I will spend $262($131 x 2) on interview fees, $200 on medical exams($100 x 2), and another $100 for food for her trip to Moscow(I have no problem with this).

A very kind member of this community has offered to speak by email with my fiance to help her find better ways to do things (ie save a little money). My fiance refuses to speak with her and has insulted her (my fiance does not even know this person). She accused me of wanting to be with the person who only wants to help her(yes, she is suspicious of Russian women). I can't figure out why she is being so bull-headed. I do not want to think that she is asking for an inflated amount of money for a shopping excursion but it has crossed my mind. Obviously, I have come to the conclusion that my fiancee is not going to listen to any of my suggestions. On one of my trips to Ufa, her and I rode the train from Ufa to Moscow. The cost was $71 each and we were in a cabin all by ourselves( a premium accommodiation if you will, ha ha!). I will entertain all offers of advice and especially suggestions of how to get my fiance to communicate with someone other than me about this visa process...

P.S. is she my fiance or fiancee? Which is the proper one to use?

eekee is completely correct. I looked this up yesterday, and I believe that your fiancee is from Ufa. If I am incorrect, it still does not change the numbers I am about to give you very much. Train tickets are about $150-$175 each for a return trip from Ufa-Moscow-Ufa. My fiancee just went from Sochi to Moscow and back for about $150 to her interview (she had 2nd class tickets with food). Translation costs should be no more than 100 rubles per document. Even if using an outrageous amount of 250 rubles per document that would still be around 40 documents translated for it to be $450. My fiancee needed to get less than 10 documents translated, which included her diploma and university transcripts and the police certificate (which does not need to be translated). I think your translation costs should be $100 or less. $150 per night is what I pay as a westerner to stay in a hotel in Moscow. As a Russian she should be able to stay somewhere for $70-$80 per night.

You need to figure out if she is taking advantage of your good nature, or if someone is inflating the prices on her because they know you are an American.

[eekee 182]

For buying train tickets it wouldn't even come up. You just go up to the window and buy them. I have also never been charged more for speaking Russian with an American accent.

You need to figure out if she is taking advantage of your good nature, or if someone is inflating the prices on her because they know you are an American.

Edited April 6, 2008 by eekee

[Bobalouie 0]

For buying train tickets it wouldn't even come up. You just go up to the window and buy them. I have also never been charged more for speaking Russian with an American accent.

You need to figure out if she is taking advantage of your good nature, or if someone is inflating the prices on her because they know you are an American.

Thats true eekee, but I dont know if he is going thru an agency that is "taking care of everything" for her. But, the whole thing seems wrong to me as well. My fiancee would tell someone who was doing that she would do it herself if they wanted that much money. Like I said, I have a bad feeling about this.

[visaveteran1 33]

The costs she quotes for trains and translation indicate dishonesty and greed. And a lack of common sense...if she's going to scam you she ought to give you some credit for checking out the costs before you send her a large sum of money. The costs for these things is easy to get via the internet and Google.

If you want to test her feelings for you, I'd tell her you'll buy the tickets yourself and handle getting her documents translated. See what she has to say.

This is a bit unique given you've met her 3 times...usually scam artists attempt to get money before an actual meeting. I would have thought with 3 meetings you'd have a pretty solid relationship.

My advice, be very cautious.

[sense1 0]

No, we are not using an agency. On all of my trips to Russia I went to the same city and visited the same girl. She is not willing to discuss the outrageous prices that she is proposing I must pay. The follow is an excerpt from a recent email that she sent me:

"You

can call to the railway station yourself , and they"ll explain you

that a ticket to Moscow costs $230, and the back one as much .So it

twice $230 for me and twice $230 for Andrei.And you can call to a

Moscow hotel and ask the cost of ne night stay . I can show you all

the

tickets and checks for travelling and hotel when I come to you .I

didn"t set these price myself , and I can"t walk to Moscow by feet . I

have no money for travelling ."

I really am at a loss for how to get through to her and make her understand...

[eekee 182]

Agency as in travel agency.

I don't know what to say... there is only so much we can say on VJ... you ultimately have to make the decision yourself. But if you're sending her 600$ every month??? Is this normal practice?

No, we are not using an agency. On all of my trips to Russia I went to the same city and visited the same girl. She is not willing to discuss the outrageous prices that she is proposing I must pay. The follow is an excerpt from a recent email that she sent me:

"You

can call to the railway station yourself , and they"ll explain you

that a ticket to Moscow costs $230, and the back one as much .So it

twice $230 for me and twice $230 for Andrei.And you can call to a

Moscow hotel and ask the cost of ne night stay . I can show you all

the

tickets and checks for travelling and hotel when I come to you .I

didn"t set these price myself , and I can"t walk to Moscow by feet . I

have no money for travelling ."

I really am at a loss for how to get through to her and make her understand...

Edited April 6, 2008 by eekee

[visaveteran1 33]

No, we are not using an agency. On all of my trips to Russia I went to the same city and visited the same girl. She is not willing to discuss the outrageous prices that she is proposing I must pay. The follow is an excerpt from a recent email that she sent me:

"You

can call to the railway station yourself , and they"ll explain you

that a ticket to Moscow costs $230, and the back one as much .So it

twice $230 for me and twice $230 for Andrei.And you can call to a

Moscow hotel and ask the cost of ne night stay . I can show you all

the

tickets and checks for travelling and hotel when I come to you .I

didn"t set these price myself , and I can"t walk to Moscow by feet . I

have no money for travelling ."

I really am at a loss for how to get through to her and make her understand...

If she's buying first class train tickets maybe those prices make sense...but not for second class which is the normal way average Russians travel.

[mox 298]

I really am at a loss for how to get through to her and make her understand...

I think she understands plenty. The part of all of this that has me convinced you're being taken for a ride is that she refuses to talk to another Russian woman who has already been through this process, and was openly hostile to her. When I suggested to Nadya that one of the wives here was willing to talk to her about what she needed for the interview, what to expect for the medical, and a little bit about life here in the US, she jumped at the chance. They had a great conversation together and it really cleared up a lot of things for her. I've yet to hear about one of the Russian fiancee's being rude and refusing to talk to one of the wives until now. Honestly (and I say this with no glee) I think she has no intention of coming to you. I think she knows that you won't stay around forever without her going through this process, and now that she's at the end of it, she's after one last score. Once you pay all this money she will probably come up with more reasons that you need to send her money, until finally you're completely tapped, and then she'll say she can't do it because you don't have the money.

Even if you're not convinced at this point, consider that her current behavior isn't going to stop once she's in the US. If she's stubborn and unwilling to be helped in Russia, she'll be stubborn here too. It's important that she learn the language, and her refusal to learn English means that she'll feel isolated and alone. A situation like that can't stand forever...she'd either give in and learn English or return to Russia. In either case it means some unhappy times ahead.

One other thing you could try: ask her to fax the documents to you, and you will have them translated for her. I know a woman who will do it for $0.05/word, others may know someone cheaper. You could then fax the translations back. Certainly she should have no problem at all doing this. And if she does, once again her behavior now is and indicator of future behavior. Do you really want to fight with her over every single little thing?

Best of luck to you!

[visaveteran1 33]

I will add that sending $600 a month for a year should get you "King status" as that is very generous. Maybe this explains why she asks for so much for travel to Moscow...she sees you as a "rich American" with pockets full of gold.

[Satellite 1]

This is a bit unique given you've met her 3 times...usually scam artists attempt to get money before an actual meeting. I would have thought with 3 meetings you'd have a pretty solid relationship.

Boy are you in for surprise if you think this is so. The best scammers wait until they get to the US and get their unconditional cards or have a decent WAVA petition. See I-360 for more information. Too many sad stories here in the last three years for both scenarios.

As for the pricing issue, it almost sounds cheaper to make a fourth trip out there and handle everything yourself. Also consider looking for a place in the Moscow suburbs. Those can run for only a $100 a week or less and you take a 1 hour commuter train or less into Moscow everyday. Small inconvenience when you consider the savings. Try http://www.irr.ru and the print version of it to for the best craigslist style prices.

Also consider dumping the agency or is your communication so poor that this can't be done. I'll agree with others that someone is making a decent commission here, whether it be the agency or your fiancée, only time will tell.

Edited April 6, 2008 by Satellite

[sense1 0]

I believe the reason for our difficulty certainly stems from the fact that she makes hasty decisions and always portrays a dire need for whatever seems urgent at the moment. The "Official state translation agency" has her convinced that she must translate all of her documents and they all need to be stamped, apistiled, certified, and clad in gold:) They have convinced her that she must have her documents done this way in order for her to receive her visa in Moscow. In other words "they see her coming" and stick her(I mean ME) with the maximum price available. She prefers to take their advice over mine because I am only an American man ( I can't possibly know anything about Russia).

After all this time I don't feel that she is a scammer. But, I do feel that she has been spoiled in her previous relationships. I get the feeling that she is unfamiliar with someone telling her to try to conserve money. I guess I should just give her whatever her little heart desires:wacko: (I am being sarcastic of course). I really appreciate all of the input from everyone regarding this matter. Thank you!