Cutting ties or helping with AOS

[southernchic 0]

Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I know this is easier said than done, so good for you, and best of luck!

You're right. Honestly, its hard to bring someone to the US and see all the things that they have to learn and discover to survive here and not worry if they'll be okay once you cut them off -- esp if you know that that person makes really bad decisions. Moving on won't be a piece of cake bc my husband was always a very sweet guy, but it has to happen. I'm very optimistic about my future. I'm just glad that I protected myself by not applying for the AOS.

thanks for the support.

[*JG* 2]

Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I know this is easier said than done, so good for you, and best of luck!

You're right. Honestly, its hard to bring someone to the US and see all the things that they have to learn and discover to survive here and not worry if they'll be okay once you cut them off -- esp if you know that that person makes really bad decisions. Moving on won't be a piece of cake bc my husband was always a very sweet guy, but it has to happen. I'm very optimistic about my future. I'm just glad that I protected myself by not applying for the AOS.

thanks for the support.

I do understand that feeling of wanting to make sure they are okay. I always want to save everyone in the world. But, in the end, you have to weigh that feeling against the feeling that he will just use you over and over again for his own means. There comes a time when you have to say ENOUGH and protect yourself.

[Nutty 2]

He entered into the marriage based on lies. Lies that have now been discovered. You say that if he did not lie and you had known the truth, you would not have married him. So in reality, your marriage is based on lies and untruths created by your husband.

In my opinion, a person who enters into marriage on false pretenses is not worthy of being helped further.

It sounds to me that you got him here, he's willing to go underground to stay here....

You are only asking for trouble if you want to continue being obligated to him by assisting in AOS.

Dear VJ community:

I'm truly between a rock and a hard place. My husband and I are now separated and heading towards divorce. After almost 2 years of drama and mental anguish dealing with this man, I am ready to move on with my life. As soon as he arrived in the US i learned that he'd been lying to me about some serious issues. I tried to see if there was a way to work it out but I kept catching in lie after lie after lie.

Finally I had enough and forced him to leave. Mind you, he was telling me that he loved me and couldn't live without me but when he knew his time was coming to an end (just before he moved out) I discovered that he was on dating sites aggressively looking to meet other women.

THE CHALLENGE IS THIS. I know for a fact that he'd rather live in the US illegally than to return to his home country without a wife, a child or money. His family doesn't even know that we're separated. I worry about him living in the US as an illegal. But my delimna is that I don't want to sponsor him. To date, I haven't even applied for the AOS. Time is running out. I have to make up my mind.

This isn't about punishment or revenge. Its about not wanting to be a victim and not wanting having financial responsibility for this guy. Did we have a legit relationship? Maybe. But I'm not sure because he's lied so much and had he not lied in the first place we'd probably never have gotten marrried.

Part of me wants to help him out of compassion over how he will survive as an illegal. But there is another part of me that just wants to cut ties. I welcome respectful and non-judgemental advice - esp from those who've experienced something like this. here are my three questions:

Should I help him or cut ties and walk away?

Is is possible to help with the AOS process and to end my sponsorship some time down the road?

What is the level of financial obligation for a sponsor? Under what conditions would I have to pay money?

[StillThePrettiest 3]

I think she's made her decision now

[diadromous mermaid 36]

southernchic, with the situations as you describe, he's not entitled to it. Many, if not most, file for AOS soon after their partner is eligible, and in that case, you need to show that the marriage was entered into in good faith and (here's the kicker) that it's still ongoing.

To *remove* conditions, the marriage need not still be viable. But in order to be eligible in the first place, there has to be a viable marriage. If you don't have that now, he's not eligible to adjust status.

Thanks everyone. Obviously I had some misconceptions about this part of the process. Glad I decided NOT to file for the AOS when he arrived. I feel better already. Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I am probably not going to be liked for saying this, but the alien whose USC spouse withholds information that is required for an adjustment of status application submission can be found to have "controlled" the aliens situation and that *could* play well into an abuse claim

[pushbrk 13,076]

southernchic, with the situations as you describe, he's not entitled to it. Many, if not most, file for AOS soon after their partner is eligible, and in that case, you need to show that the marriage was entered into in good faith and (here's the kicker) that it's still ongoing.

To *remove* conditions, the marriage need not still be viable. But in order to be eligible in the first place, there has to be a viable marriage. If you don't have that now, he's not eligible to adjust status.

Thanks everyone. Obviously I had some misconceptions about this part of the process. Glad I decided NOT to file for the AOS when he arrived. I feel better already. Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I am probably not going to be liked for saying this, but the alien whose USC spouse withholds information that is required for an adjustment of status application submission can be found to have "controlled" the aliens situation and that *could* play well into an abuse claim

Would you be kind enough to elaborate on what you mean and maybe give an example?

[diadromous mermaid 36]

southernchic, with the situations as you describe, he's not entitled to it. Many, if not most, file for AOS soon after their partner is eligible, and in that case, you need to show that the marriage was entered into in good faith and (here's the kicker) that it's still ongoing.

To *remove* conditions, the marriage need not still be viable. But in order to be eligible in the first place, there has to be a viable marriage. If you don't have that now, he's not eligible to adjust status.

Thanks everyone. Obviously I had some misconceptions about this part of the process. Glad I decided NOT to file for the AOS when he arrived. I feel better already. Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I am probably not going to be liked for saying this, but the alien whose USC spouse withholds information that is required for an adjustment of status application submission can be found to have "controlled" the aliens situation and that *could* play well into an abuse claim

Would you be kind enough to elaborate on what you mean and maybe give an example?

Sure. In the typical case of a marriage not well-suited, it is reasonable that a US citizen spouse might choose not to cooperate in submitting documents to adjust an alien's status, since the marriage is headed for divorce and the divorce is imminent. The issue becomes a little less clear when an USC chooses not to participate in an alien's adjustment of status, yet the marriage continues indefinitely. In some circumstances this *could* be viewed as a tool to exercise control over an alien's future. And, believe me, it has been used as a tool. (Not saying that southernchic has done this, mind you). It is a control that an alien cannot escape. The litmus test to determine whether the USC took advantage over the alien's situation and subjected the alien to psychologival abuse would relate to to length of time the alien was not able to begin to adjust his or her status, and whether or not the alien felt trapped, fell out of status, was not able to end the marriage for fear that he or she would never be able to get back in status without his or her US citizen spouse.

[southernchic 0]

southernchic, with the situations as you describe, he's not entitled to it. Many, if not most, file for AOS soon after their partner is eligible, and in that case, you need to show that the marriage was entered into in good faith and (here's the kicker) that it's still ongoing.

To *remove* conditions, the marriage need not still be viable. But in order to be eligible in the first place, there has to be a viable marriage. If you don't have that now, he's not eligible to adjust status.

Thanks everyone. Obviously I had some misconceptions about this part of the process. Glad I decided NOT to file for the AOS when he arrived. I feel better already. Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I am probably not going to be liked for saying this, but the alien whose USC spouse withholds information that is required for an adjustment of status application submission can be found to have "controlled" the aliens situation and that *could* play well into an abuse claim

Would you be kind enough to elaborate on what you mean and maybe give an example?

Sure. In the typical case of a marriage not well-suited, it is reasonable that a US citizen spouse might choose not to cooperate in submitting documents to adjust an alien's status, since the marriage is headed for divorce and the divorce is imminent. The issue becomes a little less clear when an USC chooses not to participate in an alien's adjustment of status, yet the marriage continues indefinitely. In some circumstances this *could* be viewed as a tool to exercise control over an alien's future. And, believe me, it has been used as a tool. (Not saying that southernchic has done this, mind you). It is a control that an alien cannot escape. The litmus test to determine whether the USC took advantage over the alien's situation and subjected the alien to psychologival abuse would relate to to length of time the alien was not able to begin to adjust his or her status, and whether or not the alien felt trapped, fell out of status, was not able to end the marriage for fear that he or she would never be able to get back in status without his or her US citizen spouse.

I can't let this go without a response. I've never withheld any information. I'm sure that your discussion of this issue is purely theorectical. But...I never intended to control my husband. I told him upfront when he arrived that I had issues about both continueing the relationship AND taking long term responsibility for him via the visa. I took care of him when he was unemployed, sick and just plain demanding. I'm not a victim and neither is he. Not trying to sound defensive. I just need to distance myself from any kind of discussion or allegation about control or abuse of any kind.

[Boiler 45,965]

To counter that comment, I completed my adjustment paperwork, got it all ready, my spouse just signed the bits needed.

I strikes me that if he had done this, and you or anyone else had refused to sign it and used it as some sort of blackmail, there might be a case.

It is his adjustment, not yours.

[diadromous mermaid 36]

southernchic, with the situations as you describe, he's not entitled to it. Many, if not most, file for AOS soon after their partner is eligible, and in that case, you need to show that the marriage was entered into in good faith and (here's the kicker) that it's still ongoing.

To *remove* conditions, the marriage need not still be viable. But in order to be eligible in the first place, there has to be a viable marriage. If you don't have that now, he's not eligible to adjust status.

Thanks everyone. Obviously I had some misconceptions about this part of the process. Glad I decided NOT to file for the AOS when he arrived. I feel better already. Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I am probably not going to be liked for saying this, but the alien whose USC spouse withholds information that is required for an adjustment of status application submission can be found to have "controlled" the aliens situation and that *could* play well into an abuse claim

Would you be kind enough to elaborate on what you mean and maybe give an example?

Sure. In the typical case of a marriage not well-suited, it is reasonable that a US citizen spouse might choose not to cooperate in submitting documents to adjust an alien's status, since the marriage is headed for divorce and the divorce is imminent. The issue becomes a little less clear when an USC chooses not to participate in an alien's adjustment of status, yet the marriage continues indefinitely. In some circumstances this *could* be viewed as a tool to exercise control over an alien's future. And, believe me, it has been used as a tool. (Not saying that southernchic has done this, mind you). It is a control that an alien cannot escape. The litmus test to determine whether the USC took advantage over the alien's situation and subjected the alien to psychologival abuse would relate to to length of time the alien was not able to begin to adjust his or her status, and whether or not the alien felt trapped, fell out of status, was not able to end the marriage for fear that he or she would never be able to get back in status without his or her US citizen spouse.

I can't let this go without a response. I've never withheld any information. I'm sure that your discussion of this issue is purely theorectical. But...I never intended to control my husband. I told him upfront when he arrived that I had issues about both continueing the relationship AND taking long term responsibility for him via the visa. I took care of him when he was unemployed, sick and just plain demanding. I'm not a victim and neither is he. Not trying to sound defensive. I just need to distance myself from any kind of discussion or allegation about control or abuse of any kind.

southernchic,

I wasn't necessarily stating that you had taken deliberate steps to have control over your spouse, but I can understand you being a little defensive. Let me first clarify what I am trying to convey.

If a US citizen marries a foreign-born individual, the US government extends to the alien the privilege of living in the USA with his or her citizen spouse. This is done as a benefit to the US citizen. In turn, that US citizen vouches to hold the government harmless from any requirement to keep that alien above poverty level. Now, filing an Affidavit of Support in conjunction with an Adjustment of Status application is the action that triggers that obligation to the government. When a US citizen partakes in an alien's adjustment of status, he or she is also making it possible for the alien to secure permanent residency and ultimately satisfy the Affidavit of Support~ thus relieving the US citizen of the burden to agree to support the alien and prevent the alien from becoming a ward of the government.

If the US citizen has concern about the financial obligation that he or she will inherit by participating in adjusting the alien's status, and chooses not to pursue it, in essence, the citizen is preventing the alien from moving forward in his or her immigrant process. That can be construed as having control over the alien's life.

[*JG* 2]

southernchic, with the situations as you describe, he's not entitled to it. Many, if not most, file for AOS soon after their partner is eligible, and in that case, you need to show that the marriage was entered into in good faith and (here's the kicker) that it's still ongoing.

To *remove* conditions, the marriage need not still be viable. But in order to be eligible in the first place, there has to be a viable marriage. If you don't have that now, he's not eligible to adjust status.

Thanks everyone. Obviously I had some misconceptions about this part of the process. Glad I decided NOT to file for the AOS when he arrived. I feel better already. Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I am probably not going to be liked for saying this, but the alien whose USC spouse withholds information that is required for an adjustment of status application submission can be found to have "controlled" the aliens situation and that *could* play well into an abuse claim

Would you be kind enough to elaborate on what you mean and maybe give an example?

Sure. In the typical case of a marriage not well-suited, it is reasonable that a US citizen spouse might choose not to cooperate in submitting documents to adjust an alien's status, since the marriage is headed for divorce and the divorce is imminent. The issue becomes a little less clear when an USC chooses not to participate in an alien's adjustment of status, yet the marriage continues indefinitely. In some circumstances this *could* be viewed as a tool to exercise control over an alien's future. And, believe me, it has been used as a tool. (Not saying that southernchic has done this, mind you). It is a control that an alien cannot escape. The litmus test to determine whether the USC took advantage over the alien's situation and subjected the alien to psychologival abuse would relate to to length of time the alien was not able to begin to adjust his or her status, and whether or not the alien felt trapped, fell out of status, was not able to end the marriage for fear that he or she would never be able to get back in status without his or her US citizen spouse.

I can't let this go without a response. I've never withheld any information. I'm sure that your discussion of this issue is purely theorectical. But...I never intended to control my husband. I told him upfront when he arrived that I had issues about both continueing the relationship AND taking long term responsibility for him via the visa. I took care of him when he was unemployed, sick and just plain demanding. I'm not a victim and neither is he. Not trying to sound defensive. I just need to distance myself from any kind of discussion or allegation about control or abuse of any kind.

southernchic,

I wasn't necessarily stating that you had taken deliberate steps to have control over your spouse, but I can understand you being a little defensive. Let me first clarify what I am trying to convey.

If a US citizen marries a foreign-born individual, the US government extends to the alien the privilege of living in the USA with his or her citizen spouse. This is done as a benefit to the US citizen. In turn, that US citizen vouches to hold the government harmless from any requirement to keep that alien above poverty level. Now, filing an Affidavit of Support in conjunction with an Adjustment of Status application is the action that triggers that obligation to the government. When a US citizen partakes in an alien's adjustment of status, he or she is also making it possible for the alien to secure permanent residency and ultimately satisfy the Affidavit of Support~ thus relieving the US citizen of the burden to agree to support the alien and prevent the alien from becoming a ward of the government.

If the US citizen has concern about the financial obligation that he or she will inherit by participating in adjusting the alien's status, and chooses not to pursue it, in essence, the citizen is preventing the alien from moving forward in his or her immigrant process. That can be construed as having control over the alien's life.

I think this reasoning is ridiculous. If you are controlling the situation for the sake of controlling the person, then, yes, I think it's wrong. And, there are hateful people out there who do this sort of thing.

But, to withhold information that by providing said information forces you to support this person for 10 years, who MADE THEIR OWN CHOICES to basically defraud you, is smart IMO. You are controlling your own destiny. This man made his choices and now he must live with the consequences of said choices.

[Ta Ta 1]

What all includes means tested benefits ? Food stamps I know but what else would she have to pay back if he goes for that ?

Can the alien during the divorce ask for monthly support from his spouse like everyone can for alimony ? Lets say he does not work and he

wants several hundred per month to support him ? How does that work in the court of law with an alien ?

[*JG* 2]

What all includes means tested benefits ? Food stamps I know but what else would she have to pay back if he goes for that ?

Can the alien during the divorce ask for monthly support from his spouse like everyone can for alimony ? Lets say he does not work and he

wants several hundred per month to support him ? How does that work in the court of law with an alien ?

Any type of government assistance they seek and receive. My SIL has rental assistance, child care assistance, WIC, Food Stamps, and Medicaid.

And, yes, alimony can be requested. As well as child support if children are involved.

[diadromous mermaid 36]

southernchic, with the situations as you describe, he's not entitled to it. Many, if not most, file for AOS soon after their partner is eligible, and in that case, you need to show that the marriage was entered into in good faith and (here's the kicker) that it's still ongoing.

To *remove* conditions, the marriage need not still be viable. But in order to be eligible in the first place, there has to be a viable marriage. If you don't have that now, he's not eligible to adjust status.

Thanks everyone. Obviously I had some misconceptions about this part of the process. Glad I decided NOT to file for the AOS when he arrived. I feel better already. Now, I have to focus on getting the divorce and completely moving on with my life.

I am probably not going to be liked for saying this, but the alien whose USC spouse withholds information that is required for an adjustment of status application submission can be found to have "controlled" the aliens situation and that *could* play well into an abuse claim

Would you be kind enough to elaborate on what you mean and maybe give an example?

Sure. In the typical case of a marriage not well-suited, it is reasonable that a US citizen spouse might choose not to cooperate in submitting documents to adjust an alien's status, since the marriage is headed for divorce and the divorce is imminent. The issue becomes a little less clear when an USC chooses not to participate in an alien's adjustment of status, yet the marriage continues indefinitely. In some circumstances this *could* be viewed as a tool to exercise control over an alien's future. And, believe me, it has been used as a tool. (Not saying that southernchic has done this, mind you). It is a control that an alien cannot escape. The litmus test to determine whether the USC took advantage over the alien's situation and subjected the alien to psychologival abuse would relate to to length of time the alien was not able to begin to adjust his or her status, and whether or not the alien felt trapped, fell out of status, was not able to end the marriage for fear that he or she would never be able to get back in status without his or her US citizen spouse.

I can't let this go without a response. I've never withheld any information. I'm sure that your discussion of this issue is purely theorectical. But...I never intended to control my husband. I told him upfront when he arrived that I had issues about both continueing the relationship AND taking long term responsibility for him via the visa. I took care of him when he was unemployed, sick and just plain demanding. I'm not a victim and neither is he. Not trying to sound defensive. I just need to distance myself from any kind of discussion or allegation about control or abuse of any kind.

southernchic,

I wasn't necessarily stating that you had taken deliberate steps to have control over your spouse, but I can understand you being a little defensive. Let me first clarify what I am trying to convey.

If a US citizen marries a foreign-born individual, the US government extends to the alien the privilege of living in the USA with his or her citizen spouse. This is done as a benefit to the US citizen. In turn, that US citizen vouches to hold the government harmless from any requirement to keep that alien above poverty level. Now, filing an Affidavit of Support in conjunction with an Adjustment of Status application is the action that triggers that obligation to the government. When a US citizen partakes in an alien's adjustment of status, he or she is also making it possible for the alien to secure permanent residency and ultimately satisfy the Affidavit of Support~ thus relieving the US citizen of the burden to agree to support the alien and prevent the alien from becoming a ward of the government.

If the US citizen has concern about the financial obligation that he or she will inherit by participating in adjusting the alien's status, and chooses not to pursue it, in essence, the citizen is preventing the alien from moving forward in his or her immigrant process. That can be construed as having control over the alien's life.

I think this reasoning is ridiculous. If you are controlling the situation for the sake of controlling the person, then, yes, I think it's wrong. And, there are hateful people out there who do this sort of thing.

But, to withhold information that by providing said information forces you to support this person for 10 years, who MADE THEIR OWN CHOICES to basically defraud you, is smart IMO. You are controlling your own destiny. This man made his choices and now he must live with the consequences of said choices.

It is not ridiculous. I specifically said in the beginning of this discussion, that there is a clear distinction between a USC hesitating to participate in adjustment of status, for a brief period, as a direct consequence of a marriage breaking down so that he or she can proceed with divorce and spare him/herself from further financial obligations as a result of the alien, and a USC spouse that chooses not to participate in adjusting the alien's status for a protracted period of time, yet does not dismantle the marriage. Once again, for the purposes of discussion right now, let's just remove any suggestion of "fraud" from the picture, as circumstances change considerably for the USC if there is evidence of fraud on the part of the alien.

But if an alien cannot purse legal adjustment without the spouse, and yet the spouse has no impetus to get going on it, the alien falls out of status, yet is completely without options as to get back in lawful status. That is a misuse of the USC's power and *could* in certain circumstances be construed as a form of abuse.

Look let's look at it from another perspective. An alien must have the cooperation of his or her spouse to be able to submit an AOS package. An AOS package without an Affiavit of Support will be rejected. Case closed, alien is fat out of luck. Unless there has been abuse, in which case the USCIS says, "show me your abuse, and if we are satisfied, we will permit you to pursue legal immigration without your USC spouse's participation".

[Caladan 19]

diaddie's right to the extent that e.g., refusing to file for someone's green card in order to keep 'control' over them can be construed as abuse which allows the alien to petition on his or her own for permanent residency. It gives a hypothetical abusive spouse way too much power to leave the immigrant spouse's ability to live here legally and work. I'll hit you, #######, and if you go to the cops they'll deport you.

This doesn't mean, however, that 'not filing because the marriage is falling apart' is 'abusing someone', and it's clear diaddie was just offering it as overall information.

__

Jomo's girl, not all means-tested benefits. There are some exclusions. Plus, the process is that the sponsor's income is counted as income when determining eligibility; if the person is still eligible after that (SCHIP, e.g.), it should be okay. That, and benefits that go to someone other than the sponsored immigrant (their citizen child, e.g.) don't count under the I-864.