McCain’s Canal Zone Birth Prompts Queries About Whether That Rules Him Out

[Empress of Groovy 373]

This is a non issue. He was born on an American military base to 2 USCs. Agree with Gary. Anyone making an issue out of this is should be ashamed. And no, I dont think naturalized USC should be able to hold that office. No way. Never.

Why not? Why is birthplace so important?

Does the title of this thread make anyone else instantly think of vaginas?

Canal...zone...birth...and it's all over.

Only reconstructed ones.

[Dan J 277]

I'm curious about other scenarios and how they might be perceived. McCain's situation is not going to cause any problems for him. Its pretty clear, both of his parents were US citizens. Even if it hasn't been tested, no one is going to challenge it.

If a child was born to a USC parent, and given citizenship under the rules that pertain to that situation, would that cause a problem if that child wanted to run for president?

What if we complicate the scenario and assume the child was born illegitimately (You can still get citizenship assuming the rules were met)?

What if the spouse of the candidate was not a citizen, could that cause problems?

As the law is written, all the scenarios would be legal. But i think there could be problems with perception. A non-USC spouse could be perceived as a national security issue.

[Dan J 277]

This is a non issue. He was born on an American military base to 2 USCs. Agree with Gary. Anyone making an issue out of this is should be ashamed. And no, I dont think naturalized USC should be able to hold that office. No way. Never.

Why not? There are people that have spent most of thier lives here and are just as American as you. But for whatever reason were born outside the US, and were naturalized when they were young. Why shouldn't they get to have the chance to be president if they so choose?

[SqdnGuns 21]

What if the spouse of the candidate was not a citizen, could that cause problems?

That one made me think, it might make it an issue.

Back in '89, in the final screening steps to become an Interrogator/Translator in the USMC, I was denied by DoD because my step-mother was not a citizen (Singaporean). Imagine the Intel the Prez is privy to..............

Bad example maybe

[Empress of Groovy 373]

What if the spouse of the candidate was not a citizen, could that cause problems?

That one made me think, it might make it an issue.

Back in '89, in the final screening steps to become an Interrogator/Translator in the USMC, I was denied by DoD because my step-mother was not a citizen (Singaporean). Imagine the Intel the Prez is privy to..............

Bad example maybe

Aside from some usual mindless mudslinging, not much was said about John Kerry's wife, a naturalized USC of Portuguese parents (I think she grew up in Africa).

I was thinking of the scenario of someone being born here, growing up elsewhere, and returning to the U.S. Is there any kind of residency requirement? It seems odd that someone who grew up overseas (and not, say, on a U.S. military base) could return and run for prez, but someone born elsewhere and brought here as an infant could not. The idea that birth on U.S. soil somehow equates to loyalty seems simplistic and reflects some kind of misplaced fear of the Other.

Edited February 28, 2008 by AOS despair

[Alex+R 0]

What if the spouse of the candidate was not a citizen, could that cause problems?

That one made me think, it might make it an issue.

Back in '89, in the final screening steps to become an Interrogator/Translator in the USMC, I was denied by DoD because my step-mother was not a citizen (Singaporean). Imagine the Intel the Prez is privy to..............

Bad example maybe

Aside from some usual mindless mudslinging, not much was said about John Kerry's wife, a naturalized USC of Portuguese parents (I think she grew up in Africa).

I was thinking of the scenario of someone being born here, growing up elsewhere, and returning to the U.S. Is there any kind of residency requirement? It seems odd that someone who grew up overseas (and not, say, on a U.S. military base) could return and run for prez, but someone born elsewhere and brought here as an infant could not. The idea that birth on U.S. soil somehow equates to loyalty seems simplistic and reflects some kind of misplaced fear of the Other.

You have to live here for 14 years. I think they have to be consecutive but I'm not sure.

[SqdnGuns 21]

From WiKi: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_Two_o...ions_for_office

Article 2 of the Constitution:

Clause 5: Qualifications for office

No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

By the time of their inauguration, the President and Vice President must be:

* natural born citizens (or citizens at the time of the Constitution's adoption)

* at least thirty-five years old

* inhabitants for at least fourteen years of the United States.

The Twenty-second Amendment also prevents a President from being elected more than twice.

The natural born citizen clause is a subject of debate. No law or court ruling has ever established the precise definition of a natural born citizen. It is generally agreed that a natural born citizen of the United States is any person born in one of the 50 states or the District of Columbia. But it is not firmly agreed[citation needed] if this definition should also include persons born in United States overseas territories or persons born to United States citizens living abroad. To date, no such person has been nominated for President or Vice President by a major political party, although some serious candidates for nomination (most recently George W. Romney, who was born in Mexico, and John McCain, who was born in the Panama Canal Zone) have fallen into the area of uncertainty. There is currently a movement to abolish the natural born citizen clause and allow immigrants to be President, thereby also eliminating the controversies regarding the definition of natural born. It has received exceptional support from California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger who was born in Austria.

[panamania79 2]

Does the title of this thread make anyone else instantly think of vaginas?

Canal...zone...birth...and it's all over.

Not unless you go for the rejuvenation afterwards.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

What if the spouse of the candidate was not a citizen, could that cause problems?

That one made me think, it might make it an issue.

Back in '89, in the final screening steps to become an Interrogator/Translator in the USMC, I was denied by DoD because my step-mother was not a citizen (Singaporean). Imagine the Intel the Prez is privy to..............

Bad example maybe

A similar thing happened to my cousin (Navy) who was married to a German (he was based there) - I can't remember exactly what the job was, but it was similar

[almaty 19]

The day a person born to two USC while one of them is serving in the military and cannot be president is the day I will be ashamed of my country. Whether you like McCain or not isn't the question. He has the same rights as I do. If someone with a political agenda makes a big issue out of this he will wish he wasn't born.

i agree totally..

[Caladan 19]

The day a person born to two USC while one of them is serving in the military and cannot be president is the day I will be ashamed of my country. Whether you like McCain or not isn't the question. He has the same rights as I do. If someone with a political agenda makes a big issue out of this he will wish he wasn't born.

It may depend on the immigration laws at the time. Under current immigration laws, someone born today like McCain counts as a citizen. But there's a lot of weird loops in laws. There was a time (pre-1907) I think, where an American woman who married a foreigner no longer counted as an American, and her kids would have their dad's citizenship. And there's been all sorts of bizarre loopholes over the years. Even today, children of citizens aren't necessarily automatically citizens if they weren't born here under some particular circumstances. If, for example, C. and I have a kid in Canada, that kid will be a citizen. But the kid's kids won't be American citizens unless a few other requirements are met.

Just guessing, but in McCain's case, it probably matters that he was born overseas, and it matters whether the law at the time counted the military base as sufficient to make you a citizen (it might not have if the hospital served the local area, because then anyone's baby would become a citizen), and whether he needed to live a certain number of years in the U.S. before turning eighteen.

Still, it seems that it's not someone with a political agenda making a big deal about it, but the McCain campaign itself. Good to ensure your candidate is eligible for the office.