Cooking with Wine ??

[AlHayatZween 2]

Haraam or La Haraam.

How does your SO feel about it?

[sereia 0]

My husband doesn't concern himself with any of that... But I think generally it is haram. My MIL was very suspicious when I brought a bottle of balsamic vinegar from Italy because she thought it was wine.

[Jenn! 918]

Balsamic vinegar does have alcohol in it, I think.

[ya falaha! 0]

Husband believes it's haram however, that does not stop him from consuming it both cooked and uncooked on occasion.

[sarahaziz 0]

He won't touch it and doesn't allow me or my dad to consume it

[a1angied 0]

Well if it is cooked in a hot enough temp them the alcohol would burn off so it would not contain alcohol.

If your husband or wife doesn't drink then I don't believe that you should use it to cook. I am an alcoholic and I don't use alochol in any form. I see it as having an alergy to it because it causes me to have problems when ingested so I view it as dangerous for me. Just as my husband see's pork. I check everything to be sure that it is safe for him. I am aware that his beliefs are that pork is not acceptable. It all turns out to be personal choice anyway.

We all grow up and develop our own attitudes, values and beliefs then we base our decisions on what we developed so I respect mine and have boundries and when I married my husband I found out what his value system and beliefs where and learned not voliate his and he learned mine as to not volilate mine. This is harmoney.

PRESONAL CHOICE

[Henna Rose 0]

We do partake of these, "loaded grapes" on occasion together. It is important to both of us that we know are limits, and when we do drink, it's mostly in private. As for the cooking, I believe most of the alcohol burns off, unless you use it in a sauce over a dessert that is not cooked. Using different wines does lend some great flavors to different dishes, especially a nice Merlot mushroom sauce over steak!

[Jenn! 918]

Well if it is cooked in a hot enough temp them the alcohol would burn off so it would not contain alcohol.

I don't think that's true:

Table from USDA Showing Percent of Alcohol Retained After Cooking

Preparation Method Percent of Alcohol Retained

alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat 85%

alcohol flamed 75%

no heat, stored overnight 70%

baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture 45%

baked/simmered, alcohol stirred into mixture:

15 minutes 40%

30 minutes 35%

1 hour 25%

1.5 hours 20%

2 hours 10%

2.5 hours 5%

[a1angied 0]

Thanks for clarifying. I am glad that I don't cook with it so I don't really have to worry!

[Nutty 2]

My husband is fine with it as long as the alcoholic component (that part that gets you drunk) is evaporated.

Edited February 27, 2008 by Nutty

[AlHayatZween 2]

i confess that i cook with it here in the US for certain recipes.

not in Morocco, just because i try to be "good" while i'm there.... and Habibi tries to be good...

Ooooo! Merlot Mushroom sauce!! Yummy...

[dawnnhatem 0]

Well if it is cooked in a hot enough temp them the alcohol would burn off so it would not contain alcohol.

I don't think that's true:

Table from USDA Showing Percent of Alcohol Retained After Cooking

Preparation Method Percent of Alcohol Retained

alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat 85%

alcohol flamed 75%

no heat, stored overnight 70%

baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture 45%

baked/simmered, alcohol stirred into mixture:

15 minutes 40%

30 minutes 35%

1 hour 25%

1.5 hours 20%

2 hours 10%

2.5 hours 5%

interesting data, Jenn

(tho I kinda wish I didn't see this)

So if I bake cookies containing alchol-based vanilla extract, I am indeed giving my husband alcohol. I have been believing that the alcohol is long gone. These numbers seem high to me. I think I am going to believe that the numbers are skewed by faulty detection methods that can't distinguish alcohol from sugar accurately. yeah. these numbers are way misleading.

but interesting information

Edited February 27, 2008 by dawnnhatem

[doodlebugg 10]

Well if it is cooked in a hot enough temp them the alcohol would burn off so it would not contain alcohol.

I don't think that's true:

Table from USDA Showing Percent of Alcohol Retained After Cooking

Preparation Method Percent of Alcohol Retained

alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat 85%

alcohol flamed 75%

no heat, stored overnight 70%

baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture 45%

baked/simmered, alcohol stirred into mixture:

15 minutes 40%

30 minutes 35%

1 hour 25%

1.5 hours 20%

2 hours 10%

2.5 hours 5%

interesting data, Jenn

(tho I kinda wish I didn't see this)

So if I bake cookies containing alchol-based vanilla extract, I am indeed giving my husband alcohol. I have been believing that the alcohol is long gone. These numbers seem high to me. I think I am going to believe that the numbers are skewed by faulty detection methods that can't distinguish alcohol from sugar accurately. yeah. these numbers are way misleading.

but interesting information

What I have read from different sources is that if the alcohol content is so miniscule that it's not even listed in the ingrediants then the final product is halal. NOW......I'm not sure exactly what percentage it needs to be to show up on an ingrediant list, does anyone else have any idea?

To me, for example, when I added the tablespoon of dijon mustard, which has white wine in it, to my beef stew, it did not make my meal haram because the percentage of alcohol wouldn't even register as 1% of the total final product and therefore if it were sold it wouldn't have the ingredient listed on the label. I think that would hold true for using vanilla extract in cookies but you'd have to calculate the exact percentage, taking into consideration that say 1 tbsp of vanilla isn't 100% alcohol but more like 5% or whatever.

however, if I were to dip something in the dijon mustard that would be haram or if I were to drink straight from the vanilla extract bottle that would be haram.

Edited February 27, 2008 by bridget

[doodlebugg 10]

Ok I found where I read that:

http://members.aol.com/qadriattari1/hhfood.htm

Alcohol (Ethyl alcohol) is a colorless, flammable organic liquid. It is used in extracting Vanilla flavors from Vanilla beans. lt is also used as a solvent in both artificial & natural flavoring. Alcohol has a flash point of 56 degrees F & boiling point of 185 degrees F. Evaporation or flash point is a short rapid application of heat so that a small volume is quickly distilled off carrying with it the greater part of the Volatiles. Fermentation of fruits and berries occur naturally without human involvement. Alcohol is also produced by yeast fermentation of flour's sugar during bread baking process. Alcohol containing flavors are added at the level of 0.25 percent to 2.0 percent in Ice Cream & baked goods formulations. Alcohol is not mentioned under Ingredients statement due to its incidental status. This small portion of Alcohol is subjected to 400-450 degrees F oven heat in baked goods, pasteurization temperature of 145-170 degrees F in Ice Cream & juice manufacturing process and other process where heat is utilized. Alcohol is evaporated at these temperatures. This is the reason food products containing flavors are placed under halal foods, on the other hand alcohol in AIM toothpaste & wine in Grey Poupon Dijon Mustard are mentioned in the ingredients statement, indicating that it is used in large quantity in the formula and may be present in the finished product.

bolded emphasis mine

Then again I also just found this:

http://qa.sunnipath.com/issue_view.asp?HD=...48&CATE=107

Question:

I have heard that it's okay to consume any type of food containing wine, if the food has been boiled for a good amount of time, so that the wine evaporates. Is this permissible?

Answer:

In the name of Allah, Most Compassionate, Most Merciful

Although conventional wisdom suggests that alcohol burns off after cooking, that does not hold true in most cases. The following is a chart prepared by the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA):

Alcohol Burn-off Chart

Preparation Method - Percent Retained

alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat 85%

alcohol flamed 75%

no heat, stored overnight 70%

baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture 45%

Baked/simmered dishes with alcohol stirred into mixture:

15 minutes cooking time 40%

30 minutes cooking time 35%

1 hour cooking time 25%

1.5 hours cooking time 20%

2 hours cooking time 10%

2.5 hours cooking time 5%

(http://homecooking.about.com/library/archive/blalcohol12.htm)

Since it is evident that at least some percentage of wine would still be retained in the food after cooking, eating the food in question would be forbidden.

Jabir ibn `Abdullah (RA) reports:

‏"The Prophet (may Allah's peace and mercy be upon him) said: whatever intoxicates in a large quantity, a small quantity of it is forbidden." (Abu Dawood; similar tradition reported in Nasai) note i have no idea how strong this hadith is

All four Sunni schools are unanimous on the prohibition of consuming wine in any quantity. As well, wine is a type of najasa (filth). With reference to wine, the classical Arabic Hanafi fiqh text Al-Hidayah states:

It is filth - severe filth, similar to urine. (Al-Hidayah, Book of Drinks)

As a result, the mixture would become filthy as soon as the wine is added to it. Hence, even if the wine were to evaporate after extensive boiling or cooking, it would make no difference.

Deriving benefit from filth is forbidden. (Al-Hidayah, Book of Drinks)

Therefore, consuming any food or mixture in which wine has been added is forbidden, regardless of how little of it is present in the finished product.

Verily, Allah knows best.

Sikander Ziad Hashmi

Montreal, Canada

[♥JP♥ 5]

I'm sorry but I think there is a huge difference here. Drinking a glass wine or a bottle of beer would be haram, eating a chocolate chip cookie isn't.

This is the kind of stuff that happens when things are over analyzed.