Almost free tickets - what is current visa registration scam?

[akdiver 3]

Well, last night we got two tickets on Alaska/Delta from Anchorage to Seattle to JFK to Moscow and back for $123 and 100,000 Alaska Airlines miles (LV April 16th, RETURN May 7th). Not bad I guess - since if we had to buy the same tickets for cash, they would have been $2700, even using a "buy one get one for $50" coupon for the ANC to SEA segment. Travel time one way is about 25 hours, with a 2 hr layover in Seattle and about a 1 hour "change planes but same flight #" layover at JFK (both ways). The next best option we had was to spend about $2500 for Anchorage to Frankfurt on Condor and then Lufthansa to Moscow. Much faster trip, since they go over the pole, but we would have had to overnight in Frankfurt on the way back (cost estimate included in that $2500 figure). So, the travel time is a lot longer than we would like, but cost wise we did OK. Wife says we'll spend less than $200 on flights inside Russia once we get there.

Last time I was in Russia was in March 2005. My wife (then fiance) got the invitation from some agency, had it faxed to me, and once I got there, I registered at some hotel we stayed in while I was in Moscow (more to that story, but not pertinent here). This time, there are two differences. Wife is now here in the US and is arranging invitation through some company that she is not familiar with and we just have to hope they do not screw it up.

Second, and this is where my question is, my understanding is that the whole visa registration thing has changed quite a bit since the last time I was there. Can anyone point out what the current procedure is? I should point out that we do NOT plan to stay at a hotel in Moscow or anywhere else. We'll fy into Moscow, goof off a bit until it's time for the flight to Kazan, and then stay with a friend there for a couple of days before going to Bavly. Once there, we will stay with her parents. My understanding is that we can register the visa through the OVIR or whatever there - but I've heard that in these small towns, the people involved in this kind of thing are generally clueless. Bavly is a small town and I expect to encounter cluelessness. So - does anyone actually know what today's skinny is on this topic? Not looking for speculation - I can do that on my own. I'm hoping to hear from a recent traveler who has done something similar (i.e. not stayed in a hotel, but used a tourist, rather than visitor/homestay visa).

Thanks!

AKDiver

[eekee 182]

I use http://www.visatorussia.com. They'll send you a voucher by email for 30$ (or 45$ if you want it the next day), and I printed it out and took it to the embassy with no problems. They have offices in Moscow and St. Petersburg, and you simply go there and register your visa and they'll take care of everything.

Basically the only thing that changed is that they changed the paper you get when you register and the fine for not registering is heftier.

Edited February 19, 2008 by eekee

[eekee 182]

I use http://www.visatorussia.com. They'll send you a voucher by email for 30$ (or 45$ if you want it the next day), and I printed it out and took it to the embassy with no problems. They have offices in Moscow and St. Petersburg, and you simply go there and register your visa and they'll take care of everything.

Basically the only thing that changed is that they changed the paper you get when you register and the fine for not registering is heftier.

Ack, I just read you'll be a small town... basically, you need to register everywhere you stay more than 72 hours. You will probably be able to find a travel agency in the town who can do it for you. I think that's the only way you can register visas now unless you're staying at a hotel. That's the impression that I've gotten.

[Kazan' Tiger 1]

This is technically true, but who would know? I made many a side trip that lasted more than 72 hours in other towns during my year in Kazan'. The local militsiya has no idea how many days you are where ever you are (especially whilst staying at a private residence). The key is being registered somewhere for the duration of your stay. The best choice being the main location of your stay.

I use http://www.visatorussia.com. They'll send you a voucher by email for 30$ (or 45$ if you want it the next day), and I printed it out and took it to the embassy with no problems. They have offices in Moscow and St. Petersburg, and you simply go there and register your visa and they'll take care of everything.

Basically the only thing that changed is that they changed the paper you get when you register and the fine for not registering is heftier.

Ack, I just read you'll be a small town... basically, you need to register everywhere you stay more than 72 hours. You will probably be able to find a travel agency in the town who can do it for you. I think that's the only way you can register visas now unless you're staying at a hotel. That's the impression that I've gotten.

[eekee 182]

The fine is huge now, so I would rather register than take a risk, especially if you're someone who the police would be inclined to stop. As a young blonde woman, I've never been stopped, but if I were a man, especially one with dark hair, I would definitely be sure to do it.

This is technically true, but who would know? I made many a side trip that lasted more than 72 hours in other towns during my year in Kazan'. The local militsiya has no idea how many days you are where ever you are (especially whilst staying at a private residence). The key is being registered somewhere for the duration of your stay. The best choice being the main location of your stay.

I use http://www.visatorussia.com. They'll send you a voucher by email for 30$ (or 45$ if you want it the next day), and I printed it out and took it to the embassy with no problems. They have offices in Moscow and St. Petersburg, and you simply go there and register your visa and they'll take care of everything.

Basically the only thing that changed is that they changed the paper you get when you register and the fine for not registering is heftier.

Ack, I just read you'll be a small town... basically, you need to register everywhere you stay more than 72 hours. You will probably be able to find a travel agency in the town who can do it for you. I think that's the only way you can register visas now unless you're staying at a hotel. That's the impression that I've gotten.

[Bobalouie 0]

I use http://www.visatorussia.com. They'll send you a voucher by email for 30$ (or 45$ if you want it the next day), and I printed it out and took it to the embassy with no problems. They have offices in Moscow and St. Petersburg, and you simply go there and register your visa and they'll take care of everything.

Basically the only thing that changed is that they changed the paper you get when you register and the fine for not registering is heftier.

If you use visatorussia.com or gotorussia.com they will register you for your entire stay at their Moscow office. If you have some time in Moscow and can get it done, this is the best way.

I usually have someone I know over there take my passport to a local hotel and the hotel registers me for my entire stay for a small "fee". I dont know if this is an option for you since you are in a small town, but you can have your lady take it to the hotel and ask them if they will register it, or maybe one of her friends knows someone who knows someone. I am sure in a small town, if they have a hotel, someone will be OK with a little extra money in their hand.

I have no experience with this, but I do know a guy who goes to Russia all the time and visits his lady. She lives in a small town and he always registers with OVIR. He told me it is no big deal, and the worst that happens is that you will wait around a while if you go alone. If you have a Russian speaker with you, it makes it much easier and you wait much less time.

[akdiver 3]

I use They have offices in Moscow and St. Petersburg, and you simply go there and register your visa and they'll take care of everything.

I think you missed my point. The only place I will be going in Moscow is the airport.

[Satellite 1]

The key is being registered somewhere for the duration of your stay. The best choice being the main location of your stay.

Not true based on personal experience of having to pay a fine for not registering in Sochi for a 9 day trip while being duly registered in Tomsk for 3 months. Also while in Moscow, had to produce Moscow registration again being registered in Tomsk, had that registration so no fines. Fine in Sochi was an arbitrary 150 rubles in 2004.

Not being a recent traveler I can only post the information you need:

http://blogs.waytorussia.net/item/59

http://www.waytorussia.net/RussianVisa/Registration.html

I can only speak of the private visa and that one has not changed based on my reading. Anyone in Russia sponsors "gets" the invitation from the OVIR and then he or she registers you at the OVIR.

As far as "goof off" a bit in Moscow, if it is under 72 hours you will only need to show your visa entry stamp to prove it is has been less than 72 hours. So no registration needed.

Worst case scenario on the registration, you go to the OVIR and they redirect you somewhere else. You lose a day, stand in line, get frustrated, and wonder why you came to Russia.

[akdiver 3]

As far as "goof off" a bit in Moscow, if it is under 72 hours you will only need to show your visa entry stamp to prove it is has been less than 72 hours. So no registration needed.

Well, the "goof off in Moscow" bit it more like sitting at the airport for 6 or 7 hours, waiting for my next flight.

[akdiver 3]

Good links - thanks Sat.

Cheers!

AKDiver

[eekee 182]

I use They have offices in Moscow and St. Petersburg, and you simply go there and register your visa and they'll take care of everything.

I think you missed my point. The only place I will be going in Moscow is the airport.

that's why i amended my post with a followup... visajourney limits the amount of time you have to edit.

by the way the fines have increased exponentially for not registering. i was a student when they changed it last year and my program said it was now thousands of dollars. 150 rouble fines are now a distant memory.

Edited February 19, 2008 by eekee

[Kazan' Tiger 1]

How did they know your were in Sochi for 9 days? I registered only in Kazan' and went where ever I pleased. If I were ever stopped, (which I was once) I just said, I'm passing through.

The key is being registered somewhere for the duration of your stay. The best choice being the main location of your stay.

Not true based on personal experience of having to pay a fine for not registering in Sochi for a 9 day trip while being duly registered in Tomsk for 3 months. Also while in Moscow, had to produce Moscow registration again being registered in Tomsk, had that registration so no fines. Fine in Sochi was an arbitrary 150 rubles in 2004.

Not being a recent traveler I can only post the information you need:

http://blogs.waytorussia.net/item/59

http://www.waytorussia.net/RussianVisa/Registration.html

I can only speak of the private visa and that one has not changed based on my reading. Anyone in Russia sponsors "gets" the invitation from the OVIR and then he or she registers you at the OVIR.

As far as "goof off" a bit in Moscow, if it is under 72 hours you will only need to show your visa entry stamp to prove it is has been less than 72 hours. So no registration needed.

Worst case scenario on the registration, you go to the OVIR and they redirect you somewhere else. You lose a day, stand in line, get frustrated, and wonder why you came to Russia.

[dmhweb 0]

...

Second, and this is where my question is, my understanding is that the whole visa registration thing has changed quite a bit since the last time I was there. Can anyone point out what the current procedure is? I should point out that we do NOT plan to stay at a hotel in Moscow or anywhere else. We'll fy into Moscow, goof off a bit until it's time for the flight to Kazan, and then stay with a friend there for a couple of days before going to Bavly. Once there, we will stay with her parents. My understanding is that we can register the visa through the OVIR or whatever there - but I've heard that in these small towns, the people involved in this kind of thing are generally clueless. Bavly is a small town and I expect to encounter cluelessness. So - does anyone actually know what today's skinny is on this topic? Not looking for speculation - I can do that on my own. I'm hoping to hear from a recent traveler who has done something similar (i.e. not stayed in a hotel, but used a tourist, rather than visitor/homestay visa).

Thanks!

AKDiver

AK,

I posted briefly on this last year, Thread

The following seems to be a first hand, clear & detailed description of the new registration process. As the person notes below you no longer deal with OVIR. It is now UFMS & the Post Office or local Police and it's the landlord or the inviting party that is responsible for the registration.

TK wrote:

I am Russian, my husband is British. We just came back from Moscow and St. Petersburgh (June-July 2007). He had a visa done by one of the travel agencies, and I registered him under my own passport in Moscow. It was rather easy, though slightly time-consuming. This is what I remember about the procedure.

Preparation

1) 2 registration forms – here http://www.fmsmoscow.ru/docs/uvedomlenie_p...grac_uchetu.doc

I recommend to have at least 4-6 blank copies with you just in case, or 2 filled in copies and 2-4 blank. (They did not have blank registration forms at the postoffice.) Have white-out (aka Tippex) with you just in case (though miraculously they did have one at the postoffice). This is because you cannot make any corrections on the form, the postoffice clerk will reject any forms with cross-outs etc. (leave the unused ones with the post worker, help the “needy”)

2) 2 photocopies of foreigner’s passport

3) 2 photocopies of host’s passport

4) 2 photocopies of foreigner’s migration form (the one that you get when you get the visa)

5) host’s original passport (you do not need the original foreigner’s passport) – but have to show host’s at the postoffice.

6) In addition to the address where foreigner will be registered, do also get the name of the administrative area where the address belongs to. That is, if you are in Moscow, which “administrativnyi okrug” (Zapadnyi, etc.), which raion (Mosfilmovskii, etc.). Try to find out the address of the corresponding “Upravlenie Federal’noi Migragratsionnoi Sluzhby”, or UFMS. Again, such address has to be for the subarea, not just the big “okrug”.

7) Have a large envelope just in case – or you can buy an envelope on the post office.

You can register at the local UFMS office (which might be a hassle), or at the post office which is assigned to the address at which the foreigner will be registered. Alternatively I suggest to go to the central post office of your area. If you are in Moscow, I recommend one of the 3 central post offices:

Central Telegraph (Tsentralnyy Telegraf), Tverskaya ul., 7 (M. Okhotnyy Ryad), Daily 8-22

Main Post Office (Glavpochtamt) Myasnitskaya ul., 26/2 (M. Chistye Prudy), Mo-Su 8-19:45

International Post Office (Mezhdunarodnyy Pochtamt), Varshavskoe shosse, 37 (M. Nagatinskaya) Mo-Su 9-20;

We went to Central Telegraph on Tverskaya, asked where to do registration, joined a line of about 8 people (it was in the middle of the afternoon, at other times the line could be longer or shorter). Next to the relevant window there was an example of how to fill in the form (the forms have to be filled in Russian). We made photocopies of passport pages in the nearby photo service “laryek”. I asked for the address of UFMS, was given a folder with the addresses, found the address (you search first under the big “okrug” then search for the raion). One set of registration form and copies of passports and migr. card is kept at the postoffice, the other set is sent in the envelope to the UFMS via “tsennoe pis’mo”. For “tsennoe pis’mo” one needs to fill in 2 copies of content list (blanks for content list are available at the window). You write the UFMS address 3 times – on the envelope, and on the 2 copies of content list (as you will see later, it is a good idea to write the full address of UFMS on the content list).

I was rather slow (made a few mistakes while filling in the forms) so it took me about 40 minutes – but others may do it faster. As far as I remember, I paid less than 150 rubles – for the processing of the “tsennoe pis’mo”. (The registration itself is free.)

They give you the bottom portion of one of the forms, and one of the copies of the content list (as I understand, this is what people call the “coupon”), both stamped and signed. Make a copy of both of them straight away just in case.

Before we left, my husband gave both the bottom portion and the “coupon” (the content list) to my father (we kept the copies of both), who then sent both of them via “zakaznoe pis’mo” to the address of UFMS to which we sent our registration form in the first place (remember that this is why it is a good idea to write the full address of UFMS on the content list). He went to an arbitrary post office, and it cost him less than 50 rubles (possibly with an envelope). One needs to send this form within two (working) days after the foreigner’s departure. According to some law regarding foreigners, the govt has to take off foreigner’s name from their database upon his/her departure – and obviously it would be easier for the govt to comply with the law if the hosts does send the bottom part and if the same UFMS handles both registration and taking off from the database.

13/07 17:14:43

[akdiver 3]

Hey, good info. Thanks!

AKDiver

[eekee 182]

or you could take five minutes out of your day and go to a local travel agent when you arrive and have them make you a fiktivniy registration.

this thread is the first time i've ever heard of anyone getting a private visa instead of a tourist or business visa.

...

Second, and this is where my question is, my understanding is that the whole visa registration thing has changed quite a bit since the last time I was there. Can anyone point out what the current procedure is? I should point out that we do NOT plan to stay at a hotel in Moscow or anywhere else. We'll fy into Moscow, goof off a bit until it's time for the flight to Kazan, and then stay with a friend there for a couple of days before going to Bavly. Once there, we will stay with her parents. My understanding is that we can register the visa through the OVIR or whatever there - but I've heard that in these small towns, the people involved in this kind of thing are generally clueless. Bavly is a small town and I expect to encounter cluelessness. So - does anyone actually know what today's skinny is on this topic? Not looking for speculation - I can do that on my own. I'm hoping to hear from a recent traveler who has done something similar (i.e. not stayed in a hotel, but used a tourist, rather than visitor/homestay visa).

Thanks!

AKDiver

AK,

I posted briefly on this last year, Thread

The following seems to be a first hand, clear & detailed description of the new registration process. As the person notes below you no longer deal with OVIR. It is now UFMS & the Post Office or local Police and it's the landlord or the inviting party that is responsible for the registration.

TK wrote:

I am Russian, my husband is British. We just came back from Moscow and St. Petersburgh (June-July 2007). He had a visa done by one of the travel agencies, and I registered him under my own passport in Moscow. It was rather easy, though slightly time-consuming. This is what I remember about the procedure.

Preparation

1) 2 registration forms – here http://www.fmsmoscow.ru/docs/uvedomlenie_p...grac_uchetu.doc

I recommend to have at least 4-6 blank copies with you just in case, or 2 filled in copies and 2-4 blank. (They did not have blank registration forms at the postoffice.) Have white-out (aka Tippex) with you just in case (though miraculously they did have one at the postoffice). This is because you cannot make any corrections on the form, the postoffice clerk will reject any forms with cross-outs etc. (leave the unused ones with the post worker, help the “needy”)

2) 2 photocopies of foreigner’s passport

3) 2 photocopies of host’s passport

4) 2 photocopies of foreigner’s migration form (the one that you get when you get the visa)

5) host’s original passport (you do not need the original foreigner’s passport) – but have to show host’s at the postoffice.

6) In addition to the address where foreigner will be registered, do also get the name of the administrative area where the address belongs to. That is, if you are in Moscow, which “administrativnyi okrug” (Zapadnyi, etc.), which raion (Mosfilmovskii, etc.). Try to find out the address of the corresponding “Upravlenie Federal’noi Migragratsionnoi Sluzhby”, or UFMS. Again, such address has to be for the subarea, not just the big “okrug”.

7) Have a large envelope just in case – or you can buy an envelope on the post office.

You can register at the local UFMS office (which might be a hassle), or at the post office which is assigned to the address at which the foreigner will be registered. Alternatively I suggest to go to the central post office of your area. If you are in Moscow, I recommend one of the 3 central post offices:

Central Telegraph (Tsentralnyy Telegraf), Tverskaya ul., 7 (M. Okhotnyy Ryad), Daily 8-22

Main Post Office (Glavpochtamt) Myasnitskaya ul., 26/2 (M. Chistye Prudy), Mo-Su 8-19:45

International Post Office (Mezhdunarodnyy Pochtamt), Varshavskoe shosse, 37 (M. Nagatinskaya) Mo-Su 9-20;

We went to Central Telegraph on Tverskaya, asked where to do registration, joined a line of about 8 people (it was in the middle of the afternoon, at other times the line could be longer or shorter). Next to the relevant window there was an example of how to fill in the form (the forms have to be filled in Russian). We made photocopies of passport pages in the nearby photo service “laryek”. I asked for the address of UFMS, was given a folder with the addresses, found the address (you search first under the big “okrug” then search for the raion). One set of registration form and copies of passports and migr. card is kept at the postoffice, the other set is sent in the envelope to the UFMS via “tsennoe pis’mo”. For “tsennoe pis’mo” one needs to fill in 2 copies of content list (blanks for content list are available at the window). You write the UFMS address 3 times – on the envelope, and on the 2 copies of content list (as you will see later, it is a good idea to write the full address of UFMS on the content list).

I was rather slow (made a few mistakes while filling in the forms) so it took me about 40 minutes – but others may do it faster. As far as I remember, I paid less than 150 rubles – for the processing of the “tsennoe pis’mo”. (The registration itself is free.)

They give you the bottom portion of one of the forms, and one of the copies of the content list (as I understand, this is what people call the “coupon”), both stamped and signed. Make a copy of both of them straight away just in case.

Before we left, my husband gave both the bottom portion and the “coupon” (the content list) to my father (we kept the copies of both), who then sent both of them via “zakaznoe pis’mo” to the address of UFMS to which we sent our registration form in the first place (remember that this is why it is a good idea to write the full address of UFMS on the content list). He went to an arbitrary post office, and it cost him less than 50 rubles (possibly with an envelope). One needs to send this form within two (working) days after the foreigner’s departure. According to some law regarding foreigners, the govt has to take off foreigner’s name from their database upon his/her departure – and obviously it would be easier for the govt to comply with the law if the hosts does send the bottom part and if the same UFMS handles both registration and taking off from the database.

13/07 17:14:43

Edited February 20, 2008 by eekee