Hillary: Those who want to deport illegals are "living in some other universe"

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Given that these candidates are now frontrunners in the presidential race - I'd say it suggests that the immigration issue either isn't as important to the public at large as its been made out to be, or the moderate approach to this issue has a pretty strong public following.

[Dan J 277]

How much does it cost to deport 12-14 million people? I've heard $90 billion (from schwarzenegger). This may be more than their current estimated "cost" to the taxpayer and economy. Are people willing to pay higher taxes to support such an undertaking?

Suggestions of a tax hike to support the war have been shot down. So i seriously doubt it.

But the cost isn't just one time either, We need to pay for increased enforcement to keep the status quo.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

I'd rather the focus of enforcement be towards employers instead of individuals

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Given that these candidates are now frontrunners in the presidential race - I'd say it suggests that the immigration issue either isn't as important to the public at large as its been made out to be, or the moderate approach to this issue has a pretty strong public following.

Exactly. The anti-illegal crowd is all bark and no bite. They can talk a lot, make a lot of noise, but they're not good for much worse. They couldn't even nominate a single anti-illegal from either party.

Talk about pathetic.

[SteveLaura 0]

Blinded by ignorance.....

I hope you're not going to sit back in your cubicle and take that slur on your eyesight, Troll.

[Sofargone 2]

Does anybody really believe those who are here illegally will ever pay these "fines" that Hillary speaks of ? What a crock of poop if they try and pass this off as immigration reform, it is amnesty plain and simple. Every single one of these people who entered the US illegally had the chance to apply for a visa but instead chose to cross illegally.

Sofargone

Hmmm.... from what you have just posted it is clear that you have no idea of what really happens outside of your bubble. If these people had an opportunity to come here legally don't you think they would? Most of them are people who are decent and hard workers who want nothing else but to survive. Get your facts straight... The immigration system is broken and it only appeals to those who don't have a necessity to come here. As a matter of fact alot of those people who the system favors are those corrupt politics who are running away from the law in their countries.

So therefore don't speak without knowing exactly what happens. Just another piece of information for you.... alot of these illigal immigrants do pay their taxes and never see a penny back from tax returns. I don't see any statistical information on this being shown... reason for this is that most people opposed to "illigal immigration" really are opposed to immigration as a whole... Yet i'm not surprise since that has been the history of the USA. New flow of immigrants come in and are discriminated against. Don't forget the great immigration of the Italians and the Irish and the Chinese. Have you ever been down to Little Italy? do you know why it exist? Because the nature of humans is to congregate with their own kind. This does not mean immigrants don't want to assimilate but it simply points to human nature. Anyways i think i have said enough. Have a great day!

Get my facts straight ???

Hey if you wanna believe in the big pipe dream that if those here illegally had the chance they would have come here legally then go ahead. But dont come in here popping off about getting my facts straight. Now can you get your facts straight and please tell me and everyone else in here how these people were prevented from coming here legally. Please tell us inquiring minds would like to know.

Ok and another thing IF they are here illegally then what taxes are they paying and whose SSN or Tax ID are they using ? Whatever taxes they may be paying sure as hell arent listed under their name as they have no legal basis or right to work. So please get your facts straight or STFU ! You really are living in another world if you think the immigrants of today compare at all to those of the past. The Irish, Italians and Chinese that you speak of most ALL of them came here legally and came here to be Americans and for a better way of life. they did not cross illegally and then have the beliefs that they should be entitled to all sorts of basic government benefits.

Furthermore I challenge you to make your lame case that illegals should be allowed to stay. What part of illegal do YOU not understand. Its attitudes like your spewing that makes it harder and more difficult for those trying to do it legally.

Lastly, I don't recall seeing anyone or myself saying anything against people immigrating to the USA. If people wanna come here and do it legally for a better way of life then hey that's what immigration is all about. But the assumption that they are here illegally because they cant be legal is not any kind of argument at all and really makes one wonder how you could even make a statement like that.

Game on.

Sofargone

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Given that these candidates are now frontrunners in the presidential race - I'd say it suggests that the immigration issue either isn't as important to the public at large as its been made out to be, or the moderate approach to this issue has a pretty strong public following.

Exactly. The anti-illegal crowd is all bark and no bite. They can talk a lot, make a lot of noise, but they're not good for much worse. They couldn't even nominate a single anti-illegal from either party.

Talk about pathetic.

I guess we'll know for sure what candidate's priorities are when the election race starts proper.

[no name 1]

I'd rather the focus of enforcement be towards employers instead of individuals

and borders!

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Blinded by ignorance.....

I hope you're not going to sit back in your cubicle and take that slur on your eyesight, Troll.

hahaha.

It's no slur. Her side is the losing side in this debate. I've always been confident that the people of this country are mostly good. The nominating process, so far, has borne that belief out. The bigots who are afraid of change have lost. Again

[garya505 2]

Those with criminal records will not be able to get legal status and their numbers will dwindle through deportation and attrition.

That sounds a lot like the la-la land that Shrillery was referring to. If you think that the 12-14 million are going to dwindle, then reality isn't setting in. In my opinion, its very jingoistic to say they are cutting in-line and not waiting their turn, but come on, 12-14 MILLION. You simply cannot get that many people to leave. Securing the border is a good step toward trying to make sure that the 12-14 figure doesn't increase. But the fact remains the government simply doesn't have the resources to deport those who are already here.

You should read more carefully and not misrepresent what I said.

If we secure the border, don't allow legal status to anyone who has a criminal record, and deport those who do have a criminal record, the numbers who are criminals will dwindle. Only a small percentage of the 12-14 million illegals are criminals.

It's not practical to have mass deportations of those who do not have a criminal record. It that de-facto amnesty? Well in effect it is, but if we're aggressively enforcing the border and deporting the bad guys, that's probably the best we can do. And, we don't give any special advantage (ID or VISA) to those are here illegally.

Edited February 1, 2008 by garya505

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

Given that these candidates are now frontrunners in the presidential race - I'd say it suggests that the immigration issue either isn't as important to the public at large as its been made out to be, or the moderate approach to this issue has a pretty strong public following.

Exactly. The anti-illegal crowd is all bark and no bite. They can talk a lot, make a lot of noise, but they're not good for much worse. They couldn't even nominate a single anti-illegal from either party.

Talk about pathetic.

Two words: protest candidate

[no name 1]

Given that these candidates are now frontrunners in the presidential race - I'd say it suggests that the immigration issue either isn't as important to the public at large as its been made out to be, or the moderate approach to this issue has a pretty strong public following.

Am I against illegalls? Yes. Do I think deporting 12 million is realistic? No. Nor does anyone else with half a brain.

So yes, moderate is the way to go.

Blinded by ignorance.....

I hope you're not going to sit back in your cubicle and take that slur on your eyesight, Troll.

hahaha.

It's no slur. Her side is the losing side in this debate. I've always been confident that the people of this country are mostly good. The nominating process, so far, has borne that belief out. The bigots who are afraid of change have lost. Again

So you speak for America now? What arrogance.

[tom&tata 2]

Those with criminal records will not be able to get legal status and their numbers will dwindle through deportation and attrition.

That sounds a lot like the la-la land that Shrillery was referring to. If you think that the 12-14 million are going to dwindle, then reality isn't setting in. In my opinion, its very jingoistic to say they are cutting in-line and not waiting their turn, but come on, 12-14 MILLION. You simply cannot get that many people to leave. Securing the border is a good step toward trying to make sure that the 12-14 figure doesn't increase. But the fact remains the government simply doesn't have the resources to deport those who are already here.

But then what people always forget, is half of them, never came through the border illegally.

Deporting 12-14 million people is unrealistic. Can we even do that, without seriously impeding privacy for all people in the US?

Restricting ability to work and live, wont send many of them home. Even the underground economy in the US can be better than what they have to go home too. Since they wont turn to the police, there are many who would take advantage of a work force, that they could effectively employ for almost free.

Does anybody have data on % of illegal immigrant with income from underground economy and income working for companies who do not bother checking their employment auth (despite lack of SSN)?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Given that these candidates are now frontrunners in the presidential race - I'd say it suggests that the immigration issue either isn't as important to the public at large as its been made out to be, or the moderate approach to this issue has a pretty strong public following.

Am I against illegalls? Yes. Do I think deporting 12 million is realistic? No. Nor does anyone else with half a brain.

So yes, moderate is the way to go.

Blinded by ignorance.....

I hope you're not going to sit back in your cubicle and take that slur on your eyesight, Troll.

hahaha.

It's no slur. Her side is the losing side in this debate. I've always been confident that the people of this country are mostly good. The nominating process, so far, has borne that belief out. The bigots who are afraid of change have lost. Again

So you speak for America now? What arrogance.

I don't think anyone can claim to speak for America - but you've got to admit that its a little strange that major candidates are not taking the sort of strong, draconian stand on this issue that many would like. Got to wonder why that is - whether the folks are not listening to the people, or that simply its not that big a priority to many people.

I don't know what the answer is - have to wait until the election campaign starts in earnest to see what the major issues the candidates choose to campaign on.

My guess however, is that the country's economy will be foremost in people's minds when they cast their ballots, rather than immigration.

[garya505 2]

Those with criminal records will not be able to get legal status and their numbers will dwindle through deportation and attrition.

That sounds a lot like the la-la land that Shrillery was referring to. If you think that the 12-14 million are going to dwindle, then reality isn't setting in. In my opinion, its very jingoistic to say they are cutting in-line and not waiting their turn, but come on, 12-14 MILLION. You simply cannot get that many people to leave. Securing the border is a good step toward trying to make sure that the 12-14 figure doesn't increase. But the fact remains the government simply doesn't have the resources to deport those who are already here.

But then what people always forget, is half of them, never came through the border illegally.

Deporting 12-14 million people is unrealistic. Can we even do that, without seriously impeding privacy for all people in the US?

Restricting ability to work and live, wont send many of them home. Even the underground economy in the US can be better than what they have to go home too. Since they wont turn to the police, there are many who would take advantage of a work force, that they could effectively employ for almost free.

Does anybody have data on % of illegal immigrant with income from underground economy and income working for companies who do not bother checking their employment auth (despite lack of SSN)?

I suspect most employers do check ID, but it's easy to get fake IDs, and employers are not allowed to question ID validity. I know a manager of a local fast food place and I asked him. He said yeah, he knows a lot of the IDs are fake, but that's not his problem. If he checks the ID he has complied with the law.