Hillary: Those who want to deport illegals are "living in some other universe"

[HAL 9000 96]

I guess because I've asked this question, I get lumped into the camp of 'illegal lovers'. Is that honesty on the part of those people who use that term? I hardly think so.

Don't we all get lumped as illegal lovers... #######, RJ... #######... no matter how much humanity you try to remind our fellow VJers, its nearly impossible to give humanity a break.

Too sad

[SteveLaura 0]

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

The Hijack-A-Thread award has already been announced. Nice try, tho.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

The Hijack-A-Thread award has already been announced. Nice try, tho.

LOL

[HAL 9000 96]

And... Illinois may not be a Border State, but it sure has lotsa Mexicans!! Legals and Illegals... so where are the ER clogs?? Kind of like a Tootsie Pop...

That's #5 on the overall estimated (DHS) population of ilegales out of all 50 states.

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

The Hijack-A-Thread award has already been announced. Nice try, tho.

AArrrggghhhhhh

LOL

Disclaimer- I knew someone would actually be reading carefully...

[GaryC 7]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

We are talking about people invading a country contrary to the law not elk migrating to their winter feeding land. They have no right to be here and therefore no right to anything this country gives to the people that are here legally.

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

If I were in another country illegally and needed medical treatment I would most likely get it in jail. No other country in the world is contemplating giving rights to those that invade their country in massive numbers like we have been assaulted with. Try going to Mexico illegally and getting government funded health care. See what happens.

[Ban Hammer 13,360]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

oh please, spare me the emotional appeal filed under humanitarian reasons. every country has the right to determine who gets in and who does not. and you're right, i'm not in health care. want to take another attempt at a cheap shot?

[HAL 9000 96]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

We are talking about people invading a country contrary to the law not elk migrating to their winter feeding land. They have no right to be here and therefore no right to anything this country gives to the people that are here legally.

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

If I were in another country illegally and needed medical treatment I would most likely get it in jail. No other country in the world is contemplating giving rights to those that invade their country in massive numbers like we have been assaulted with. Try going to Mexico illegally and getting government funded health care. See what happens.

What will happen is that I be airlifted at my insurance carrier's expense to UT Medical Branch in Galveston for medical treatment since I am a USC.

Or UM Jackson if I am in Cancún illegally.

Sí, Gary... the problem is USCs don't really have illegal problems most anywhere, right? Its not an even-level playing field.

[GaryC 7]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

We are talking about people invading a country contrary to the law not elk migrating to their winter feeding land. They have no right to be here and therefore no right to anything this country gives to the people that are here legally.

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

If I were in another country illegally and needed medical treatment I would most likely get it in jail. No other country in the world is contemplating giving rights to those that invade their country in massive numbers like we have been assaulted with. Try going to Mexico illegally and getting government funded health care. See what happens.

What will happen is that I be airlifted at my insurance carrier's expense to UT Medical Branch in Galveston for medical treatment since I am a USC.

Or UM Jackson if I am in Cancún illegally.

Sí, Gary... the problem is USCs don't really have illegal problems most anywhere, right? Its not an even-level playing field.

Not if you were there illegally. You would go to jail first.

Other than emergency care people here illegally should get NOTHING from us other than a plane ticket home. Zero tolerance for illegals.

Edited February 4, 2008 by GaryC

[HAL 9000 96]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

oh please, spare me the emotional appeal filed under humanitarian reasons. every country has the right to determine who gets in and who does not. and you're right, i'm not in health care. want to take another attempt at a cheap shot?

Don't get so touchy. Were we not talking about clogged ER rooms for those illegals that are already here? That, at least is what I refer to when I mention basic human respect. Apparently its still not enough for you to beckon yourself to the cause of humanity yet. Why jump the logical gun this time?

As for the rest, of course. We have the right to control our borders.

[Ban Hammer 13,360]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

oh please, spare me the emotional appeal filed under humanitarian reasons. every country has the right to determine who gets in and who does not. and you're right, i'm not in health care. want to take another attempt at a cheap shot?

Don't get so touchy. Were we not talking about clogged ER rooms for those illegals that are already here? That, at least is what I refer to when I mention basic human respect. Apparently its still not enough for you to beckon yourself to the cause of humanity yet. Why jump the logical gun this time?

As for the rest, of course. We have the right to control our borders.

we were not discussing clogged er rooms, you must have me confused with someone else.

keep trying though with your logical gun.

[HAL 9000 96]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

We are talking about people invading a country contrary to the law not elk migrating to their winter feeding land. They have no right to be here and therefore no right to anything this country gives to the people that are here legally.

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

If I were in another country illegally and needed medical treatment I would most likely get it in jail. No other country in the world is contemplating giving rights to those that invade their country in massive numbers like we have been assaulted with. Try going to Mexico illegally and getting government funded health care. See what happens.

What will happen is that I be airlifted at my insurance carrier's expense to UT Medical Branch in Galveston for medical treatment since I am a USC.

Or UM Jackson if I am in Cancún illegally.

Sí, Gary... the problem is USCs don't really have illegal problems most anywhere, right? Its not an even-level playing field.

Not if you were there illegally. You would go to jail first.

Just like here. But we're talking about two different things aren't we? How could a USC be put in Jail in México for being there illegally? Visa overstays there are usually handled financially and/or followed by immediate deportation. I mean, come on... we have an obvious image of Mexican prisons that are by far less of a decent standard than most condemned US prisons but that is not the topic we're talking about.

Well, compare immigration procedures TO México to name an example country... vs TO the USA. Then look at the playing field.

So what's it going to be Charles? Humanitarian treatment of people already here or closing the border off. U pick.

[GaryC 7]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

We are talking about people invading a country contrary to the law not elk migrating to their winter feeding land. They have no right to be here and therefore no right to anything this country gives to the people that are here legally.

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

If I were in another country illegally and needed medical treatment I would most likely get it in jail. No other country in the world is contemplating giving rights to those that invade their country in massive numbers like we have been assaulted with. Try going to Mexico illegally and getting government funded health care. See what happens.

What will happen is that I be airlifted at my insurance carrier's expense to UT Medical Branch in Galveston for medical treatment since I am a USC.

Or UM Jackson if I am in Cancún illegally.

Sí, Gary... the problem is USCs don't really have illegal problems most anywhere, right? Its not an even-level playing field.

Not if you were there illegally. You would go to jail first.

Just like here. But we're talking about two different things aren't we? How could a USC be put in Jail in México for being there illegally? Visa overstays there are usually handled financially and/or followed by immediate deportation. I mean, come on... we have an obvious image of Mexican prisons that are by far less of a decent standard than most condemned US prisons but that is not the topic we're talking about.

Well, compare immigration procedures TO México to name an example country... vs TO the USA. Then look at the playing field.

So what's it going to be Charles? Humanitarian treatment of people already here or closing the border off. U pick.

There is no playing field. That is the point. We have laws and they have been ignored. Those that break the law get no rights here. Why do you keep talking about playing fields? This isn't a game. And to answer your question to Charles, Close the borders and then deport the illegals. Let their own country take care of them.

[Ban Hammer 13,360]

So what's it going to be Charles? Humanitarian treatment of people already here or closing the border off. U pick.

like i said earlier, spare me the emotional appeal bs. it really trivializes anything you have to say and if your argument is solely based on that, then you've lost.

[HAL 9000 96]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

We are talking about people invading a country contrary to the law not elk migrating to their winter feeding land. They have no right to be here and therefore no right to anything this country gives to the people that are here legally.

These are human beings, not elk, Gary. Imagine yourself in country X in dire need of medical attention. Oh... right... we have money or at least the representation of money via our nationality not burdening us with having to duck for cover when the law becomes more important than our humanity.

And since it is an issue of a human invasion, besieging every livable space, making it intolerable for anti-immigrant Americans to exist, then these same anti-immigrant Americans really need to push for a more isolationist foreign policy so that we not only close off the borders but also stop giving foreigners an excuse to come here. Illegally, that is.

Right is a legal state of mind, not an absolute. The law can also be changed to reflect quotas, as it once did from certain countries back in the day. See?

If I were in another country illegally and needed medical treatment I would most likely get it in jail. No other country in the world is contemplating giving rights to those that invade their country in massive numbers like we have been assaulted with. Try going to Mexico illegally and getting government funded health care. See what happens.

What will happen is that I be airlifted at my insurance carrier's expense to UT Medical Branch in Galveston for medical treatment since I am a USC.

Or UM Jackson if I am in Cancún illegally.

Sí, Gary... the problem is USCs don't really have illegal problems most anywhere, right? Its not an even-level playing field.

Not if you were there illegally. You would go to jail first.

Just like here. But we're talking about two different things aren't we? How could a USC be put in Jail in México for being there illegally? Visa overstays there are usually handled financially and/or followed by immediate deportation. I mean, come on... we have an obvious image of Mexican prisons that are by far less of a decent standard than most condemned US prisons but that is not the topic we're talking about.

Well, compare immigration procedures TO México to name an example country... vs TO the USA. Then look at the playing field.

So what's it going to be Charles? Humanitarian treatment of people already here or closing the border off. U pick.

There is no playing field. That is the point. We have laws and they have been ignored. Those that break the law get no rights here. Why do you keep talking about playing fields? This isn't a game. And to answer your question to Charles, Close the borders and then deport the illegals. Let their own country take care of them.

Ay Gary... you brought up the jail time in México, not me. But you are definitely on to something:

Of course there is no playing field ("analogy"). By that logic, the same corrupt officials in country X that derive benefit from dealing with our corrupt multinational interests that result in a poor population that in turn has no financial solvency to 1. survive and 2. qualify for valid legal visas to America *mind you, this has been explained so many dozens of times*, will by default come and walk, swim, and fly their way around any closed border since they are doing what they have to do to make a living.

Only if the hardheaded ones that label foreign corruption as something to be solely dealt with on foreign soil while ignoring our commitment via our companies that continually operate to feed this corruption were to actually look at the flow of things... perhaps they'd realize that by treating a sympton they do not cure the disease.

Does that mean that I am advocating an open border? Not really. We can continue to waste tax money on fences and security systems that fail time after time while we continue to allow the bulk flow of illegal immigration in as a result of those that profit corruptly. Please spare the polar argument that maybe we shouldn't do business outside the country... it just has to be done right if we are to label ourselves as clean, ethical citizens of not just one nation but of an entire planet that extends itself beyond our borders.

The question for Charles still stands.

[kaydee457 13]

thanks, even some people on here can't tell the difference between a discussion about legal immigration and illegal immigration.

And some people can't seem to understand that human beings deserve basic respect and attention when in need. Independent of migratory status. Maybe that's why you're not in health care.

oh please, spare me the emotional appeal filed under humanitarian reasons. every country has the right to determine who gets in and who does not. and you're right, i'm not in health care. want to take another attempt at a cheap shot?

Don't get so touchy. Were we not talking about clogged ER rooms for those illegals that are already here? That, at least is what I refer to when I mention basic human respect. Apparently its still not enough for you to beckon yourself to the cause of humanity yet. Why jump the logical gun this time?

As for the rest, of course. We have the right to control our borders.

We certainly are discussing "clogged ER's" as these illegals aren't vacationers here on a tourist visa but rather squatters that make use of social services that wouldn't be afforded them if they obeyed our immigration laws.

Yes, it's humane, and in fact the law to treat illegals, but many illegals, having no health insurance make use of the emergency room for basic everyday care.

This point seems lost on you, or is just simply something you again choose to ignore. I cited one story a few posts back that's describing some hospitals in Dalls which by necessity have begun to deny that kind of service to illegals as a matter of fiscal survivabilty.

I will once again post that article for your perusal:

Dallas hospital cares for illegal immigrants

But it's U.S. taxpayers who are footing the multi-million-dollar bill

source

The cost of medical care

August 3:

DALLAS - Parkland Memorial Hospital — the same iconic institution where doctors tried to save John F. Kennedy in 1963 — is today where tens of thousands of illegal immigrants receive taxpayer subsidized care.

“Whether they come from this country or somewhere else, doesn’t matter how I treat them,” says Richard Benson, a doctor at Parkland Hospital.

The most common patients here are expectant mothers. Each year about 16,000 babies are born at Parkland. The hospital estimates about 70 percent of them are delivered by undocumented mothers.

Among the new mothers is a woman who didn't want to be identified — an illegal immigrant from Mexico. Her medical bills will run more than $6,000.

But with no insurance, Parkland — a public hospital — is forced to cover the cost.

“We have to figure out how to continue to deal with this because it’s very difficult to fund it,” says Parkland President Dr. Ron Anderson.

Anderson says the cost of treating undocumented immigrants — millions of dollars each year — is unsustainable.

Still, he says, his hospital will never turn away patients.

“You are going to make some awful mistakes when you decide that one person is worthy and one person isn’t worthy,” Anderson says.

But 30 miles away, a Fort Worth public hospital is making those decisions, requiring patients to prove they're here legally before picking up the tab for non-emergency treatment.

“In some cases, you can’t afford 100 percent subsidized care to everyone that walks in here,” Robert Earley with John Peter Smith Hospital says.

The decision has drawn fire from Hispanic rights groups and people like Dominga Valderama, with her newborn baby at Parkland. She's a U.S. citizen, but has undocumented relatives.

"Can you put a price on someone’s health, put a price on a baby’s life?” says Valderama. “Everyone’s entitled to basic rights.”

But who should pay?

That’s a question one of the nation's top public hospitals is struggling to answer.

source

Well, frankly not everyone is entitled to basic rights but rather to emergency care. Having a baby is not an emergency!