WE SURE HAVE COME A LONG WAY!

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Out of curiosity does anyone know what the general standard level of education was 35 years ago? Was it lower or higher than it is today?

Lower, if you mean percentage of US population that graduated from each level of schooling.

I'd be surprised if it hadn't - in my dad's generation in the UK very few people did continuing studies and next to none went to uni. These days a degree is the bare minimum requirement on most job applications.

People might have fond memories of the 70's but were people generally really better off than they are today? Depends on how you measure it I suppose but we have social problems today, just as we did years ago. On the whole I'd say we're better off today... for one thing I can travel the NY subway and not be mugged

[GaryC 7]

The option of corporal punishment has been taken away all together today. That is a mistake. A spanking isn't abuse IMO. There were a lot less problems in schools 35 years ago. I am not saying it's all because of the new way of punishment but it is at least a part of it. Kids need to learn that actions have consequences. Until they reach a certain age reasoning with them is not effective. A good spanking is a valid tool for an disrespectful outburst.

There are many ways to deal with an unruly child's behavior that don't involve physical pain.

Yes there are but spanking is also a valid option. I am not talking about a flogging, I am talking about a spanking. It's been used since the begining of time and that is because it works.

[Sylvia_n_Joseph 3]

The hunting part interesting side effects. I noticed that teacher where a lot more forgiving of the students that were experenced at gutting dear. Needless to say I have had a few interesting issues with the California school system and my childern. The state that spends the most and educates the least.

[Empress of Groovy 373]

I'd be surprised if it hadn't - in my dad's generation in the UK very few people did continuing studies and next to none went to uni. These days a degree is the bare minimum requirement on most job applications.

People might have fond memories of the 70's but were people generally really better off than they are today? Depends on how you measure it I suppose but we have social problems today, just as we did years ago. On the whole I'd say we're better off today... for one thing I can travel the NY subway and not be mugged

That's funny you mention the 70s. I've been thinking about what a crazy decade it was. Fortunately, I was a little kid and don't remember a whole lot (except that I wore plaid bell bottoms and we had hideous wallpaper and carpeting), but I can image the 70s being pretty crazy--unprecedented crime, a terrible ongoing war in which tens of thousands of Americans were killed and survivors coming back completely scarred if not disabled, political turmoil, the fear that the Soviets were going to kill us all... geez. And so many unbelievably violent movies! There's so much talk about violence in entertainment these days. I think it was worse in the 70s, and there were many fewer movies made and TV stations back then.

Aside from housing and health insurance being super-expensive comparatively, things seem better today.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I'd be surprised if it hadn't - in my dad's generation in the UK very few people did continuing studies and next to none went to uni. These days a degree is the bare minimum requirement on most job applications.

People might have fond memories of the 70's but were people generally really better off than they are today? Depends on how you measure it I suppose but we have social problems today, just as we did years ago. On the whole I'd say we're better off today... for one thing I can travel the NY subway and not be mugged

That's funny you mention the 70s. I've been thinking about what a crazy decade it was. Fortunately, I was a little kid and don't remember a whole lot (except that I wore plaid bell bottoms and we had hideous wallpaper and carpeting), but I can image the 70s being pretty crazy--unprecedented crime, a terrible ongoing war in which tens of thousands of Americans were killed and survivors coming back completely scarred if not disabled, political turmoil, the fear that the Soviets were going to kill us all... geez. And so many unbelievably violent movies! There's so much talk about violence in entertainment these days. I think it was worse in the 70s, and there were many fewer movies made and TV stations back then.

Aside from housing and health insurance being super-expensive comparatively, things seem better today.

This is a little O/T but I read a reader's report for a book at work the other day. Basically a SF novel written in the late 60's that has a controversial theme about Jesus and Christianity. Very good book actually - it won a major award on first publication - but the person who read the book for us reccommended that we not buy it because too many people may get offended, and that "this kind of thing was more acceptable in the 60's when people were more open about stuff like that".

You mean in the 60's you could actually write a book in which Jesus Christ was portrayed as a profoundly retarded hunchback, but which didn't diss the religion itself; and people would actually discuss the themes rather than rounding on the author and saying "look at what that guy did to my God".

I grew up during the 80's which didn't have much to recommend it either. Maggie Thatcher, unemployment riots, and Ronald Reagan.

Edited January 16, 2008 by Number 6

[Don_Joy's Prince 0]

The 70's are not a good time period in our school system, at least to use as an example. The education system around the turn of the century was leaps and bounds better. I found a test online that was an 8th grade finals test from 1900 that was about the equivalent of a first year college test today. From the 70's until now is like comparing ####### to #######. Six of one, half dozen of the other. What was accepted as general knowledge back then dwarfs our expectations of today. If I can find it again I will post it.

[Don_Joy's Prince 0]

Could You Have Passed the 8th Grade in 1895?

Probably Not...Take a Look: This is the eighth-grade final exam from 1895 from Salina, Kansas. It was taken from the original document on file at the Smoky Valley Genealogical Society and Library in Salina, Kansas and reprinted by the Salina Journal.

8th Grade Final Exam: Salina, Kansas - 1895 Examination Graduation Questions of Saline County, Kansas

April 13, 1895

J.W. Armstrong, County Superintendent.

Examinations at Salina, New Cambria, Gypsum City, Assaria, Falun, Bavaria and District No. 74 (in Glendale Twp.)

Reading and Penmanship - The Examination will be oral and the Penmanship of Applicants will be graded from the manuscripts.

GRAMMAR (Time, one hour)

1. Give nine rules for the use of Capital Letters.

2. Name the Parts of Speech and define those that have no modifications.

3. Define, Verse, Stanza and Paragraph.

4. What are the Principal Parts of a verb? Give Principal Parts of do, lie, lay and run.

5. Define Case. Illustrate each Case.

6. What is Punctuation? Give rules for principal marks of Punctuation.

7-10. Write a composition of about 150 words and show therein that you understand the practical use of the rules of grammar.

ARITHMETIC (Time 1 1/2 hours)

1. Name and define the Fundamental Rules of Arithmetic.

2. A wagon box is 2 ft. deep, 10 feet long, and 3 ft. wide. How many bushels of wheat will it hold?

3. If a load of wheat weighs 3,942 lbs., what is it worth at 50 cents per bushel, deducting 1,050 lbs. for tare?

4. District No. 33 has a valuation of $35,000. What is the necessary levy to carry on a school seven months at $50 per month, and have $104 for incidentals?

5. Find cost of 6,720 lbs. coal at $6.00 per ton.

6. Find the interest of $512.60 for 8 months and 18 days at 7 percent.

7. What is the cost of 40 boards 12 inches wide and 16 ft. long at $20 per in.?

8. Find bank discount on $300 for 90 days (go grace) at 10 percent.

9. What is the cost of a square farm at $15 per acre, the distance around which is 640 rods?

10. Write a Bank Check, a Promissory Note, and a Receipt.

U.S. HISTORY (Time, 45 minutes)

1. Give the epochs into which U.S. History is divided.

2. Give an account of the discovery of America by Columbus.

3. Relate the causes and results of the Revolutionary War.

4. Show the territorial growth of the United States.

5. Tell what you can of the history of Kansas.

6. Describe three of the most prominent battles of the Rebellion.

7. Who were the following: Morse, Whitney, Fulton, Bell, Lincoln, Penn and Howe?

8. Name events connected with the following dates: 1607, 1620, 1800, 1849 and 1865.

ORTHOGRAPHY (time, one hour)

1. What is meant by the following: Alphabet, phonetic, orthography, etymology, syllabication?

2. What are elementary sounds? How classified?

3. What are the following, and give examples of each: Trigraph, subvocals, diphthong, cognate letters, linguals?

4. Give four substitutes for caret "u".

5. Give two rules for spelling words with final "e". Name two exceptions under each rule.

6. Give two uses of silent letters in spelling. Illustrate each.

7. Define the following prefixes and use in connection with a word: Bi, dis, mis, pre, semi, post, non, inter, mono, super.

8. Mark diacritically and divide into syllables the following, and name the sign that indicates the sound: Card, ball mercy, sir, odd, cell, rise, blood, fare, last.

9. Use the following correctly in sentences: Cite, site, sight, fane, fain, feign, vane, vain, vein, raze, raise, rays.

10. Write 10 words frequently mispronounced and indicate pronunciation by use of diacritical marks and by syllabication.

GEOGRAPHY (time, one hour)

1. What is climate? Upon what does climate depend?

2. How do you account for the extremes of climate in Kansas?

3. Of what use are rivers? Of what use is the ocean?

4. Describe the mountains of N.A.

5. Name and describe the following: Monrovia, Odessa, Denver, Manitoba, Heela, Yukon, St. Helena, Juan Fermandez, Aspinwall, and Orinoco.

6. Name and locate the principal trade centers of the U.S.

7. Name all the republics of Europe and give capital of each.

8. Why is the Atlantic Coast colder than the Pacific in the same latitude?

9. Describe the process by which the water of the ocean returns to the sources of rivers.

10. Describe the movements of the earth. Give inclination of the earth.

PHYSIOLOGY (Time, 45 minutes)

1. Where are the saliva, gastric juice, and bile secreted? What is the use of each in digestion?

2. How does nutrition reach the circulation?

3. What is the function of the liver? Of the kidneys?

4. How would you stop the flow of blood from an artery in case of laceration?

5. Give some general directions that you think would be beneficial to preserve the human body in a state of health.

--- Imagine a college student who went to public school trying to pass this test, even if the few outdated questions were modernized. Imagine their professors even being able to pass the 8th Grade. Can Americans, student and professor alike, get back up to the 8th Grade level of 1895?

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a2e3e636e6d.htm

[Don_Joy's Prince 0]

It always comes down to corporal punishment doesn't it.... Sheesh.

Solving all your problems with your fists. Priceless.

Corporal punishment does not involve fists. Open hand or belt on a$$ comes to mind. I am so thankful that my mother gave me proper discipline. One of the most abusive forms of punishment you can give a child is to not teach him/her discipline and respect.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

It always comes down to corporal punishment doesn't it.... Sheesh.

Solving all your problems with your fists. Priceless.

Corporal punishment does not involve fists. Open hand or belt on a$$ comes to mind. I am so thankful that my mother gave me proper discipline. One of the most abusive forms of punishment you can give a child is to not teach him/her discipline and respect.

You can do that without corporal punishment, or certainly without using it as the first and every resort, IMO.

Edited January 16, 2008 by Number 6

[Jeraly 4]

Hahahahahahahaha - yes I think things are pretty similar in the UK but without the guns

[chri'stina 190]

Something left out of the 1967 school scenario...

A black student walks up to a white school...

1967 He is harassed and ran off the campus

2007 No one notices him because schools are much more diverse

(yah I made it up myself hehehe)

I get what the 1967 thing is saying, but there are things that were not better in 1967. I agree kids are spoiled and way more bratty these days, but going back to 1967 will not solve it. (I am not against parents spanking their kids btw. "Whipping" their butts I am against, I don't think spanking is supposed to be very painful, just a little sting)

[Jenn! 918]

Something left out of the 1967 school scenario...

A black student walks up to a white school...

1967 He is harassed and ran off the campus

2007 No one notices him because schools are much more diverse

(yah I made it up myself hehehe)

I get what the 1967 thing is saying, but there are things that were not better in 1967. I agree kids are spoiled and way more bratty these days, but going back to 1967 will not solve it. (I am not against parents spanking their kids btw. "Whipping" their butts I am against, I don't think spanking is supposed to be very painful, just a little sting)

Yeah, big diff between a little slap on the behind and getting out the belt.

I went to Catholic elementary school and misbehavior sometimes got you a ruler across the knuckles (only for boys, not girls), and IIRC the same kids kept doing the same naughty things over and over. The well-behaved kids were never hit (they didn't need to be). I fail to see the correlation between corporal punishment in school and well-behaved children.

[Alhamdulillah 0]

It always comes down to corporal punishment doesn't it.... Sheesh.

Solving all your problems with your fists. Priceless.

A common spanking, usually, does not involve your fists

[Alex+R 0]

Could You Have Passed the 8th Grade in 1895?

Probably Not...Take a Look: This is the eighth-grade final exam from 1895 from Salina, Kansas. It was taken from the original document on file at the Smoky Valley Genealogical Society and Library in Salina, Kansas and reprinted by the Salina Journal.

8th Grade Final Exam: Salina, Kansas - 1895 Examination Graduation Questions of Saline County, Kansas

April 13, 1895

J.W. Armstrong, County Superintendent.

Examinations at Salina, New Cambria, Gypsum City, Assaria, Falun, Bavaria and District No. 74 (in Glendale Twp.)

Reading and Penmanship - The Examination will be oral and the Penmanship of Applicants will be graded from the manuscripts.

GRAMMAR (Time, one hour)

1. Give nine rules for the use of Capital Letters.

2. Name the Parts of Speech and define those that have no modifications.

3. Define, Verse, Stanza and Paragraph.

4. What are the Principal Parts of a verb? Give Principal Parts of do, lie, lay and run.

5. Define Case. Illustrate each Case.

6. What is Punctuation? Give rules for principal marks of Punctuation.

7-10. Write a composition of about 150 words and show therein that you understand the practical use of the rules of grammar.

ARITHMETIC (Time 1 1/2 hours)

1. Name and define the Fundamental Rules of Arithmetic.

2. A wagon box is 2 ft. deep, 10 feet long, and 3 ft. wide. How many bushels of wheat will it hold?

3. If a load of wheat weighs 3,942 lbs., what is it worth at 50 cents per bushel, deducting 1,050 lbs. for tare?

4. District No. 33 has a valuation of $35,000. What is the necessary levy to carry on a school seven months at $50 per month, and have $104 for incidentals?

5. Find cost of 6,720 lbs. coal at $6.00 per ton.

6. Find the interest of $512.60 for 8 months and 18 days at 7 percent.

7. What is the cost of 40 boards 12 inches wide and 16 ft. long at $20 per in.?

8. Find bank discount on $300 for 90 days (go grace) at 10 percent.

9. What is the cost of a square farm at $15 per acre, the distance around which is 640 rods?

10. Write a Bank Check, a Promissory Note, and a Receipt.

U.S. HISTORY (Time, 45 minutes)

1. Give the epochs into which U.S. History is divided.

2. Give an account of the discovery of America by Columbus.

3. Relate the causes and results of the Revolutionary War.

4. Show the territorial growth of the United States.

5. Tell what you can of the history of Kansas.

6. Describe three of the most prominent battles of the Rebellion.

7. Who were the following: Morse, Whitney, Fulton, Bell, Lincoln, Penn and Howe?

8. Name events connected with the following dates: 1607, 1620, 1800, 1849 and 1865.

ORTHOGRAPHY (time, one hour)

1. What is meant by the following: Alphabet, phonetic, orthography, etymology, syllabication?

2. What are elementary sounds? How classified?

3. What are the following, and give examples of each: Trigraph, subvocals, diphthong, cognate letters, linguals?

4. Give four substitutes for caret "u".

5. Give two rules for spelling words with final "e". Name two exceptions under each rule.

6. Give two uses of silent letters in spelling. Illustrate each.

7. Define the following prefixes and use in connection with a word: Bi, dis, mis, pre, semi, post, non, inter, mono, super.

8. Mark diacritically and divide into syllables the following, and name the sign that indicates the sound: Card, ball mercy, sir, odd, cell, rise, blood, fare, last.

9. Use the following correctly in sentences: Cite, site, sight, fane, fain, feign, vane, vain, vein, raze, raise, rays.

10. Write 10 words frequently mispronounced and indicate pronunciation by use of diacritical marks and by syllabication.

GEOGRAPHY (time, one hour)

1. What is climate? Upon what does climate depend?

2. How do you account for the extremes of climate in Kansas?

3. Of what use are rivers? Of what use is the ocean?

4. Describe the mountains of N.A.

5. Name and describe the following: Monrovia, Odessa, Denver, Manitoba, Heela, Yukon, St. Helena, Juan Fermandez, Aspinwall, and Orinoco.

6. Name and locate the principal trade centers of the U.S.

7. Name all the republics of Europe and give capital of each.

8. Why is the Atlantic Coast colder than the Pacific in the same latitude?

9. Describe the process by which the water of the ocean returns to the sources of rivers.

10. Describe the movements of the earth. Give inclination of the earth.

PHYSIOLOGY (Time, 45 minutes)

1. Where are the saliva, gastric juice, and bile secreted? What is the use of each in digestion?

2. How does nutrition reach the circulation?

3. What is the function of the liver? Of the kidneys?

4. How would you stop the flow of blood from an artery in case of laceration?

5. Give some general directions that you think would be beneficial to preserve the human body in a state of health.

--- Imagine a college student who went to public school trying to pass this test, even if the few outdated questions were modernized. Imagine their professors even being able to pass the 8th Grade. Can Americans, student and professor alike, get back up to the 8th Grade level of 1895?

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3a2e3e636e6d.htm

My grandma e-mailed me this. The questions really aren't that hard; it just shows we need different information these days than we needed 100 years ago. But this e-mail forward is nice cheap sentimentality and faux-nostalgia for the "good old days" when everything was supposedly so much better. (Sorry DJP, I'm not saying that's what you were saying by posting this.)

[chri'stina 190]

I didn't know until recently that neither of my grandparents on my dad's side graduated high school(my grandma stopped at 8th grade). My grandfather got his GED in the 80's eventually, when he was in his 50's. My dad was the first person in his family to graduate high school. I am the first person in my family to graduate college. (My parents both went to some college but didn't finish, dad has a good trade career though). I definitely think education is more important now, which I guess is obvious in our society.