Ann Coulter on the Duke Rape Case and Natalee Holloway

[pax 0]

I bet there are more date-rapes daily than stripper-rapes. Would you say it's unwise to continue dating? Without the thought-police (yet) there's not too much to do about either other than educate and enforce the law.

That's my whole point--it doesn't seem like there's much educating going on with some of these kids.

[Mand 1]

I mean, let's be real--I went to college, I went to parties, I went to bars, I drank. So do most college kids in the States or anywhere. But I went with friends, and we walked each other home or had designated drivers. It's not all that hard. Who really goes out and gets hammered and lets total strangers drive him/her home? Are kids really that irresponsible--with their drinking or in general?

I agree, having a bunch of good friends makes a world of difference.

[Jenn! 918]

I mean, let's be real--I went to college, I went to parties, I went to bars, I drank. So do most college kids in the States or anywhere. But I went with friends, and we walked each other home or had designated drivers. It's not all that hard. Who really goes out and gets hammered and lets total strangers drive him/her home? Are kids really that irresponsible--with their drinking or in general?

I just hate how the victim ends up being less of a victim because of people's judgements. Take Emmet St. Guillen (sp.?), the girl raped and murdered in NYC. Everyone's knee-jerk Puritan reaction was "Well, what was a young woman doing out by herself drinking at 3 a.m.?" As if she got what was coming to her.

Turning the spotlight on the victims takes some of the heat off the criminals.

Edited April 21, 2006 by jenn3539

[pax 0]

I just hate how the victim ends up being less of a victim because of people's judgements. Take Emmet St. Guillen (sp.?), the girl raped and murdered in NYC. Everyone's knee-jerk Puritan reaction was "Well, what was a young woman doing out by herself drinking at 3 a.m.?" As if she got what was coming to her.

Turning the spotlight on the victims takes some of the heat off the criminals.

That's what I'm concerned about, too. How do we talk about teaching kids to act responsibly and with common sense and self-respect without sliding into blaming the victim?

I don't want to sound like I'm doing that. Responsibility in these cases obviously has to begin and end with the people who committed these crimes. And yet I can't help but wonder what I would tell my own daughter--if I would tell her to go out and do as she likes, even if it might be very dangerous, or if I would teach her to stick with people she can trust and not get wasted out of her mind.

[UmmSqueakster 54]

FWIW, I think Ann Coulter's very existence makes a good case for free speech being a bad idea, sometimes. And yet when I saw her commentary on the Duke rape case and on Natalee Holloway's disappearance, I found that I actually kind of agreed with her.

I'm very scared. I hate Ann Coulter with a passion. And yet, she makes sense. My entire paradigm has been shattered and the world is coming to an end!

[Jaylen Brit 0]

I'm telling mine to stick with people SHE trusts - not who someone ELSE says is trustworthy. And TRY not to get wasted - although thats probably unrealistic - but if she sticks to the people she trusts thing then it should be better.

Also I'm going to teach her how to be street smart - atm she's just way too trusting and i hate to have to ruin that but Id rather she was suspicious than dead.

When she's at college I know she will her life differently but I hope that if she trusts ME enough to give her sound advice, and takes it on board, she might be safer than if not.

And if the worst SHOULD happen I will likely be doing hard time for finding and dealing with the perpatrator.

[Jenn! 918]

I just hate how the victim ends up being less of a victim because of people's judgements. Take Emmet St. Guillen (sp.?), the girl raped and murdered in NYC. Everyone's knee-jerk Puritan reaction was "Well, what was a young woman doing out by herself drinking at 3 a.m.?" As if she got what was coming to her.

Turning the spotlight on the victims takes some of the heat off the criminals.

That's what I'm concerned about, too. How do we talk about teaching kids to act responsibly and with common sense and self-respect without sliding into blaming the victim?

I don't want to sound like I'm doing that. Responsibility in these cases obviously has to begin and end with the people who committed these crimes. And yet I can't help but wonder what I would tell my own daughter--if I would tell her to go out and do as she likes, even if it might be very dangerous, or if I would teach her to stick with people she can trust and not get wasted out of her mind.

To be honest, I'm pretty lucky that I was never victimized during those crazy college years. I did some pretty stupid things. I knew they were stupid, but I did them anyway.

You can lead a horse to water...

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I would applaud, but she's hardly making a profound statement.

[Mand 1]

Kids can't drink here till they're 21 and I think for that reason, drinking still has some kind of a "crazy, dangerous, forbidden" tag. These young people just go buck-ape when they even smell alcohol. I've seen OSU students here and they seriously cannot handle their liquor. It's ridiculous how idiotic they carry on. If you can't handle drink...drink water!

In Europe, parents drink wine/beer at the dinner table, it's more open and less of a "forbidden fruit". I had my first beer with my parents at age 17 and it's never been a mystery to me. Sure, I've been out with friends and gotten drunk, but as drunk as I got, I could always hear my mother saying..."Drunk lads look like they're having a great laugh, drunk girls look cheap". Double standards...definately, but let's be honest and admit that they still exist today. I just wish there was an easy way to educate today's kids in street smarts.

I dread raising teenagers and young adults

[pax 0]

Me too, Mand. *sigh*

I agree with you, too, that because of our weirdly duplicitous relationship with alcohol (and sex, and drugs, and...) in our society, kids don't usually get a picture of what responsible, moderate alcohol consumption looks like.

[Widge 0]

IMHO it's a case of common sense or the lack of it.

You don't leave your purse/wallet/ computer in full view in an unlocked car and not expect something bad to happen!

Part of the problem is accepting responsiblity for one's actions (and I expect to be flamed for this but it's Friday so publish and be damned ). If you dress provocatively don't try to tell me you don't want to be looked at and admired, if you dress like a hooker then I am afraid some will treat you as such - It's my age I know but I look at some young girls today and there dress sense is verging on obscene and believe me I am no prude.

But one thing that has always troubled ME is the way we dress our young children - can someone tell me why you put a 4 - 13 yr old in a bikini. To me this article of clothing is always a means of "flaunting" the body and thereby not something a child should ever be dressed in. I could go on (it's a pet peeve) I won't.

I did many things in my youth that I am thankful to say I was lucky didnt get me in serious hot water, but I look back and know I was out of order as much as anyone. Todays youth in many instances have no respect for themselves, others or property it is the "I want it and I want it now and I have a right to it" generation. I listen at work to how a vast majority of young children/teens speak to and are spoken to by their parents and I cringe .

And as i realise I sound like my mother I will crawl back under my rock

[Jaylen Brit 0]

Being honest with kids is a start tho - and being able to talk about these things openly too.

Too many times i hear in the UK parents saying 'oh the school will take of that issue' except they don't or they do it too late or they talk down to the kids or they preach. Or the kids get their 'facts' off each other.

I already talk to my 10 year old about drugs - it comes up when we watch COPS (lol) and I tell her drugs sometimes make you feel good - but its an illusion, look at these idiots - they probably started out as decent enough people but drugs have ruined their lives and the lives of other people.

Sex she knows about - and thinks its YUK right now, lol but she has FACTS not playground tales.

She also knows that any adult asking to see her undressed, when she is alone, or touching her in places she feels bad/uncomfortable about (and she knows which ones they might be) are to be run away from - and that any adult telling her to keep something secret to do with that is not to be trusted and she should tell me immediately. She also knows that anyone saying I might die if she tells is lying.

As she gets older I'll be available for any questions on any subject which she knows - I really think its up to us as parents to tackle this stuff and not be sqeamish about it.

[Jasman0717 9]

[Jaylen Brit 0]

.

But one thing that has always troubled ME is the way we dress our young children - can someone tell me why you put a 4 - 13 yr old in a bikini. To me this article of clothing is always a means of "flaunting" the body and thereby not something a child should ever be dressed in. I could go on (it's a pet peeve) I won't.

Widge don't even get me started on the fact there are THONGS available for kids (ages 7 - 12) and that some parents think its 'ok' to let them a. wear them and b. wear them to SCHOOL!

[Jenn! 918]

I completely disagree!