Stirring the pot - Nigeria

[Enlighten one :) 5]

I am sorry if this post has caused problems.

I found the topic very interesting. Our marriage will be guided by the bible and God. Cultural difference will be accepted, tolerated, and appreciated with patience and love.

My next question was going to be are you going to allow your spouse to teach your children the language?

I would love his language (Yoruba) to be taught to our children and me.

Finally, Happy New Year to all and I hope everyone meets the person of their dreams, gets approved and has them in their arms by the end of 2008.

Happy New Year to you and your family. Your new year will bring an abundance of love, laughter, and joy.

Edited December 31, 2007 by MrsJibowu

[Ta Ta 1]

Dunno but we won the nigerian lottery 11 times last year. Waiting on those "bank transfers" to come through

And you would be surprised to learn how many of these emails come from any country in the world.

Your comment was not funny and contentious and has nothing to do with what is being discussed here.

[Ta Ta 1]

I am sorry if this post has caused problems. I was not my intention. I am a sociologist by training and I just thought most would be Igbos coming to America. The second follow up question was going to be about language. Now, I will generalize on this point. Many Igbos in America are lamenting because by the 2nd or 3rd generation, the kids do not speak the language. My next question was going to be are you going to allow your spouse to teach your children the language?

This is not a problem of just Igbos but all ethnicities in America. I have heard it from the Spanish-speaking population and everyone in between but every group thinks their language is in the most dire shape. The US Census did a study and by 3rd generation, only English is spoken in the house and many don't know the native language. But if you hear Igbos in America talk about it, they say Yorubas are better than Igbos in that more Yoruba-Americans know Yoruba than Igbo-Americans know Igbo. I am one of those that hears Igbo but does not speak. I hope, if we have kids, for them to speak Igbo but it seems school and grades get emphasized and the lessons stop.

Again, every group in the US goes thru the language debate.

As for the original question, every group brings to the table different customs and traditions. One of the great things about America is that for the most part, it is not as divisive as in other countries. Growing up in university town, I met so many cultures, it does not faze me at all. You realize good and bad come with every group.

But it is dumb to not acknowledge that there are differences. I use the Iraq War as a prime example. How can you go in not knowing the difference between a Sunni, Shiite and Kurd? You can treat everyone with respect but at least have some knowledge going in. Same applies here. If you have an international spouse and you don't know anything about their culture, you are going to have a steep learning curve.

Even though both me and my wife are Igbo, me being born and raised in US and her in Nigeria, has led to some very awkward and funny times, especially regarding gender roles and customs (and I go back often - i.e. drinking everything with a straw, no bag ticket checker at airport when retrieving bags, ID for everything, no bargaining over prices at store - very funny 1st time this happened).

Finally, Happy New Year to all and I hope everyone meets the person of their dreams, gets approved and has them in their arms by the end of 2008.

I am a naturalized USC , born and raised in Germany. I attempted to teach my children my language but got busy and sidetracked raising

my three children and gave up investing that extra time. How immensely I regret it.

By all means teach your children your language, history and culture and incorporate it in every day life in practical ways and not just

as a 15 min daily lesson. Speak it , live it.

I don't see that your topic has caused problems. Nothing wrong in discussing diversity to bring people together in awareness and understanding.

Diversity is a precious gift and knowing how and when to apply it in discussions is wisdom.

Respect and consideration are taught by all tribes and may we continue in tolerance with those virtues here on this forum.

Edited December 31, 2007 by Omoba

[Ta Ta 1]

Ogele

about your post about Boshorun's verbage of " this is the stiring our parents have raised us with......." I believe his word stiring here is meant to repesent a meaning such as " tradition " and I don't believe it was meant to mean "we were raised to be prejudice against another tribe."

I believe he meant to say our parents have raised us with tradition that are different from others and it influences our lives today.

I can not speak for him but only tell how I understand it.

[xoxo 0]

My so is igbo imo state, they seem to be very reserved though ...

[ogele 0]

Ogele

about your post about Boshorun's verbage of " this is the stiring our parents have raised us with......." I believe his word stiring here is meant to repesent a meaning such as " tradition " and I don't believe it was meant to mean "we were raised to be prejudice against another tribe."

I believe he meant to say our parents have raised us with tradition that are different from others and it influences our lives today.

I can not speak for him but only tell how I understand it.

Omoba:

You may be right in your interpretation of Bashorun’s post,if so,I stand corrected.However,Nigerians with an intimate understanding of the country’s negative ethnic dynamics may read certain parts of the post the way I did.I certainly agreed with some aspects of the post,but I have enough Nigerian in me to recognize when a post incorporates subtle claims to a better tradition.In terms of greeting,certain parts of the country prostrate to elders,while other parts simply shake their elders with two hands.I have heard many times the claim that prostrating generally translates to a better upbringing.That,of course,is a farce.

I think that it is a no brainer that each country in Africa is comprised of different ethnic and cultural traditions.I also think it would be beneficial to the foreign spouses if the various values of their SOs ethnic groups are highlighted,instead of reducing the discourse to what one ethnic group does better than another.Trust me,if not nipped in the bud,it quickly degenerates to that with one post.I have seen too much of the calamity wrought by ethnicity that I have developed a zero tolerance for it.

I started posting on this forum just a week ago even though I have been a regular reader for the past couple of years.Based on one of the recent posts and responses to it,I was alarmed that many of the U.S.citizen petitioners have limited knowledge of the cultures of their loved ones.This is where the African members can play an objective and beneficial part in providing expert knowledge of their individual ethnic groups.It is also why I think this discourse to highlight the ethnicities of the various African SOs can be valuable because the U.S. citizens can PM members of such ethnic groups for more detailed knowledge,if they so choose.And regarding my response to Bashorun,there is nothing personal.My writing style tries to incorporate humor often in the form of a conversation with a friend.

Finally,per the need to teach children the cultures of their diaspora parents,it is indispensable!A very easy approach is for that parent who is African to not speak a word of English to the child,period.Also,teach the child African folktales and traditions at bedtime.Problem is that many Africans get here and for whatever reasons,develop an inferiority complex.But,ever the incorrigible optimist,I have enclosed a link I found on Nigerians who are trying to teach their kids Nigerian culture,in faraway Finland.Enjoy!

[Bashorun 1]

Bashorun says:

Nigeria is a well diverse country with about or over 200 ethnic groups, correct me if am wrong. This doesn't mean someone is trying to generalize or stereotype in any way. It is just the fact, we have a rich culture attached to each every tribe and which really makes it impossible to actually know someone in the real sense if U ignore learning as much as U can about the culture and tribe that person represent.

Ogele says:

Your words speak truth.

Bashorun says: why?

becos this is the stiring(strng?) in which our parents raised us with.

Ogele says:

Huh? What are you talking about here?Your parents raised you an ethnic irredentist?An ethnic xenophobist?Or in international parlance,a racist?Mine did not raise me that way,and many of my ethnic stock do not think of the rest of our country’s ethnic groups that way.

Bashorun says:

This goes both ways between the husband and wife but becos we actually living here in america, africans has a bigger share of the adjusting of american culture to learn.

Ogele says:

Okay?

Bashorun says:

For an example, it is generally known that a yoruba boy is raised with so much respect for the elders that it tells with the way he greets and address someone that is more older than him. So with this U can easily pick a yoruba boy within a group of boys.

Ogele says:

Baloney!Ever heard of the saying, “salutation is not respect”?I am Igbo,and we are taught never to bow or kneel to another man because such reverence is reserved for God only.If a person does not assist you in giving your woman orgasms,why in tarnation would you be bowing to him.The Igbo simply shake elders with two hands and averted eyes as a sincere sign of respect.If you prostrate in Igboland,you will receive a smack and a humiliating sneer such as, “how about I come by tonight and help you warm your wife’s rump?”Even then,I was always taught to respect other people’s cultures as sacred,and equal in weight in terms of the significance of what is being conveyed,as mine.

Bashorun says:

I am not trying to say a tribe is better than the other but there are ways our culture impart our way of life and this doesn't mean anything negative, actually am looking at the positive aspect of culture in which i gave an example of.

Ogele says:

Let me help you out of the ambiguity.Nigeria,nay Africa is comprised of many cultures,but it is a safe assumption that there exists an overwhelming mutuality in their philosophy of life.From their idea of marriage,family,hospitality,kindness,brotherhood,humanity and fairness,African cultures are the same.Variations might exist in the actual process say,the amount of dowry,but that is just about it.

Bashorun says:

If a marriage fails, it doesn't solely fail becos of culturer differences, it mostly fails becos either or both couple are ignorant and selfish to understanding the impact culture has in a marriage. Remember it doesn't have to be an international marriage before culture becomes a big part of it, even in nigeria marrying someone from another tribe, like a yoruba man married an igbo woman. From an american view, this is a marriage between africans but as a Nigerian we know there are culturer difference between the couple they have to overcome.

Ogele says:

Very well said!

Bashorun says:

why? becos like I said this is the stiring(string?)in which their parents has raised them with.

Ogele says:

Again,did they raise you,racist?

Bashorun says:

Again, nothing negative with what I said here.

Ogele says:

There is everything negative with your analysis.If not,why keep inserting the caveat?

Bashorun says:

We learning the american culture so wouldn't it be wise for an american spouse to learn the foreign spouse culture which actually U can achieve only when U understand the tribe where the spouse is from. This would help the marriage during the process of adjusting to american life by the foreign spouse. U would be making a big mistake saying U are learning african culture, like i said Nigeria has a diverse culture. So to close this, learn the culture of the tribe ur SO represent to better understand him or her. Just another successful marriage tips.

Ogele:

Nothing successful about the tips.

Ogele or whatever U call urself. I know U very well understand my post if really U are a Nigerian and ur reply was actually not to correct me if am wrong but just becos U want to oppose whatever I said at all cost and if U would do this by going thru a way to even make urself look even more stupid than U intend to make me look on this board. Let me tell U, that is all U have succeeded in doing, making urself look stupid.

This is my reply to U and it is from a post from another Nigerian:

But it is dumb to not acknowledge that there are differences. I use the Iraq War as a prime example. How can you go in not knowing the difference between a Sunni, Shiite and Kurd? You can treat everyone with respect but at least have some knowledge going in. Same applies here. If you have an international spouse and you don't know anything about their culture, you are going to have a steep learning curve.

Even though both me and my wife are Igbo, me being born and raised in US and her in Nigeria, has led to some very awkward and funny times, especially regarding gender roles and customs (and I go back often - i.e. drinking everything with a straw, no bag ticket checker at airport when retrieving bags, ID for everything, no bargaining over prices at store - very funny 1st time this happened).

I'm not going to even try to waste my time explaining my post to U cos I know U understand everything I said in that post and as I said it the way it is but becos U so eager to make urself look stupid (not me) This is why I kept saying not anything negative becos I know someone like U is going try try twist it all around. U just can't wait and think before U post back at me. Where the hell does race come in with what we talking about here? we talking about tribe and U talking about race. I hope U didn't drink to much in anticipation of celebrating the new year and if U did please don't drive, becos if U drive then ur ### is gonna end up in jail.