Dream Turns Nightmare: Milwaukee Police Officer to Be Deported

[mustang-sally 8]

as an add on

How many cops are 100% law abiding?

I have known a few police in my time and not all are.

Also, reading up on some of the inmates on death row, a personal thing since reading John Grishams latest book (An Innocent Man) I realise how willing some police are on bending the truth in order to appease the public.

Just a thought!!!

[Fandango 1,439]

My thoughts are how many illegals are in this position? I know a lot of illegals take menial jobs (their choice or not, I'm not arguing with).

I have also read recently that a lot of security jobs in the USA are being taken by illegals (again this might be speculation, I can't find proof one way or the other).

I read the thread about the 9 year old but when it comes to 'life' decisions can anyone under 16 really do that and if they try and parents influence them would the say "Hey, I'm illegal. Mum, Dad I can't do that. I must go back to my home country and try even if it takes 10 years"

I know that at 16 even though I was a bit of a rebel, I still listened to my parents. If they offered a solution, illegal or not, to my career choice , then I would of followed it. Maybe years later I might of questioned it but whether I would do anything about it would depend on how deep I was in it.

He may have taken the name and identity at 16, but he was sworn into the force at the age of (at least) 23 years old (depending on when his birthday is). That's no child. He was an adult male capable of being sworn in to defend his city. He devoted his career towards catching lawbreakers, all the while being one himself. It's so ironic, I can barely stand it.

I do see the angle that you're approaching this from, and I can understand your viewpoint. But we cannot accept or justify ourselves becoming a society of people who are selectively law abiding. Yes, the parents made a grievous error that started this man off on the wrong path. But he continued it. Maybe this will begin to serve as a cautionary tale to those thinking about doing the same. If there is no way around the procuring event of living as and raising illegals, the problem of illegals will begin to sort itself.

Let me not even get into this man's brother, another 'fine' officer, lying to police about his brother's whereabouts!

[NavarreMan 10]

I see two issues at work here:

1. What Steve said about picking and choosing what laws we enforce and to what degree is basically correct. But this leans toward being a "NIMBY" type issue. Would you still feel the same way if this man was an officer in your town? What if you were on trial and he was giving testimony against you? How would you feel about his honesty and integrity then? Could this officer be expected/trusted to uphold the law if he were in a position to enforce immigration law? The thought that it is OK to steal an identity as long as it does not directly affect your life is a bit OTT. You have to look at the big picture and see what this case means to the average Joe, not just how it affects your everyday life. Personally it is important to me to see that the law is upheld in this and in all cases, but it is easy to say that it makes less difference to me what this guy does as long as it he does it somewhere else. The precedent being set by this case will have a large and lasting effects on the American population as a whole and therefore what I may feel about it personally is outweighed by what it means in regards to American jurisprudence.

2. Again I agree that this man did not have a choice, as a child, on where his parents forced him to go. The law does not see this as a gray area. It spells it out quite clearly that his actions in his adult life are clearly illegal and fraudulent. But perhaps in a way, his actions may be justified. Not for me to decide. If I feel that there should be more leeway in the law then I should do my part to get the law changed. But at the time he made these adult, life changing decisions, he was obligated by law to be forthright and honest and he was not. He gambled and he lost. Just like Mr. Zapeta. Personally I feel bad for both men but the law is the law until it is changed, and that is up to us as a society to do. Don't cry about it here, go do something about it. Write your lawmakers, start a petition to save this guys butt if you feel the need, don't just complain about it or you become/remain part of the problem.

I am in no way defending the fact that there are many American citizens who are less than honest LEO's (or other government servants). But this man, by his own confession, does not possess the qualities that are required of the position. The fact that he got caught and others did not does not deminish the wrongness of his actions. I'm honest but I lied just doesn't cut it.

And it should be of note to all American's that the issue of falsifying one's identity should be of tremendous importance to all of us with respect to the events of 9/11. People who pretend to be someone else probably have less than honorable motives in mind when they lie to you. Ask a cop how true this is. This is not hysteria; it is common sense and fact.

[PlatyPius 5]

Application of law requires a justice system ....because you can't take laws for face value and apply them to all circumstances and still achieve justice. Fascism is when one adheres to laws as supreme and any deviation from those laws as intolerable.

"A free and open society is an ongoing conflict, interrupted periodically by compromises." ~ Saul Alinsky

"Communism and fascism or nazism, although poles apart in their intellectual content, are similar in this, that both have emotional appeal to the type of personality that takes pleasure in being submerged in a mass movement and submitting to superior authority." ~ James A. C. Brown

"Nobody these days holds the written word in such high esteem as police states do..." ~ Italo Calvino

"When fascism comes to this country, it will be wrapped in the flag, carrying a cross." -Sinclair Lewis

Edited December 23, 2007 by PlatyPius

[one...two...tree 2,762]

"All propaganda must be so popular and on such an intellectual level, that even the most stupid of those toward whom it is directed will understand it... Through clever and constant application of propaganda, people can be made to see paradise as hell, and also the other way around, to consider the most wretched sort of life as paradise."

- Adolf Hitler

[Nagishkaw 510]

What does quoting from Mein Kampf have to do with this topic?

[natty bumppo 297]

Starting to look like a hijack ... or maybe something else ...

[one...two...tree 2,762]

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Terrible.

Yeah, let's celebrate the injustice of our immigration laws as they are applied in this case as if they rule supreme law. In fact, let's celebrate all laws, no matter how small or strange because laws are laws and we should bow down before them since whoever makes such laws are above making a law that could be applied unjustly.

Give up now. That argument is beyond too many people. In fact, if anything, these people prove why we need laws: some people can't find north on their moral compass without a little help from an authority.

It's like Gupt said the other day, elements of fascism are brewing in this country. Just the idea that all our laws reign supreme and are above reproach is one of core traits of fascism...dogma.

When law is made thru the elected legislature, and ruled upon by independent courts, and obeyed and enforced by the executive dept....is called DEMOCRACY and not fascism. When laws can be bent, changed at the will of some official...is called CORRUPTION. Dictators like Hitler and Mussolini bent the laws at will to satisfy their own sick agendas....this is called FASCISM.

Application of law requires a justice system ....because you can't take laws for face value and apply them to all circumstances and still achieve justice. Fascism is when one adheres to laws as supreme and any deviation from those laws as intolerable.

"A free and open society is an ongoing conflict, interrupted periodically by compromises." ~ Saul Alinsky

"Communism and fascism or nazism, although poles apart in their intellectual content, are similar in this, that both have emotional appeal to the type of personality that takes pleasure in being submerged in a mass movement and submitting to superior authority." ~ James A. C. Brown

"Nobody these days holds the written word in such high esteem as police states do..." ~ Italo Calvino

Quotes by like minded people does not make an argument. But if that is what you want to do I have another quote for you. Try this one:

Let me not be understood as saying that there are no bad laws, nor that grievances may not arise for the redress of which no legal provisions have been made. I mean to say no such thing. But I do mean to say that although bad laws, if they exist, should be repealed as soon as possible, still, while they continue in force, for the sake of example they should be religiously observed.

Abraham Lincoln

16th president of US (1809 - 1865)

C'mon Steven, say it. I dare you to call ole' Abe a fascist.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

C'mon Steven, say it. I dare you to call ole' Abe a fascist.

First of all, we're talking about how people feel about laws as they are applied, which is something different from following law. I'm not about to go out and grow marijuana in my house even though I think the law against doing so is ridiculous. That said, if my neighbor is caught growing marijuana in his house and is sentenced to 10 years in prison, I'd say that anyone of my neighbors who rejoices in that sentence is being a legal zealot, particularly if that neighbor was a good person who was an upstanding citizen.

I don't understand why people take comfort or pleasure when someone is unjustly punished. Of course you argue that justice was served but each time you try to articulate why justice was served you fall back on the, 'because they broke the law' argument. When your argument is based purely on the legality of the situation and then equate that to justice, then yes, that is having a fascist view of law. I'm sorry if some people take that as a derogatory term, but it is as correct a term as possible.

Edited December 23, 2007 by Mister Fancypants

[mawilson 2,133]

C'mon Steven, say it. I dare you to call ole' Abe a fascist.

First of all, we're talking about how people feel about laws as they are applied, which is something different from following law. I'm not about to go out and grow marijuana in my house even though I think the law against doing so is ridiculous. That said, if my neighbor is caught growing marijuana in his house and is sentenced to 10 years in prison, I'd say that anyone of my neighbors who rejoices in that sentence is being a legal zealot, particularly if that neighbor was a good person who was an upstanding citizen.

I don't understand why people take comfort or pleasure when someone is unjustly punished. Of course you argue that justice was served but each time you try to articulate why justice was served you fall back on the, 'because they broke the law' argument. When your argument is based purely on the legality of the situation and then equate that to justice, then yes, that is having a fascist view of law. I'm sorry if some people take that as a derogatory term, but it is as correct a term as possible.

I'm going to agree with Steven on this one.

[Craneman 2]

As the old proverb says;

The next best thing to something good happening to you

Is something bad happening to your neighbor

C'mon Steven, say it. I dare you to call ole' Abe a fascist.

First of all, we're talking about how people feel about laws as they are applied, which is something different from following law. I'm not about to go out and grow marijuana in my house even though I think the law against doing so is ridiculous. That said, if my neighbor is caught growing marijuana in his house and is sentenced to 10 years in prison, I'd say that anyone of my neighbors who rejoices in that sentence is being a legal zealot, particularly if that neighbor was a good person who was an upstanding citizen.

I don't understand why people take comfort or pleasure when someone is unjustly punished. Of course you argue that justice was served but each time you try to articulate why justice was served you fall back on the, 'because they broke the law' argument. When your argument is based purely on the legality of the situation and then equate that to justice, then yes, that is having a fascist view of law. I'm sorry if some people take that as a derogatory term, but it is as correct a term as possible.

I'm going to agree with Steven on this one.

[mawilson 2,133]

As the old proverb says;

The next best thing to something good happening to you

Is something bad happening to your neighborGRANDE CACHORRO

Fixed.

[Craneman 2]

you are such a nice quy

As the old proverb says;

The next best thing to something good happening to you

Is something bad happening to your neighborGRANDE CACHORRO

Fixed.

[mawilson 2,133]

you are such a nice quy

So are you.