Does this buh anyone else?

[sarah and hicham 3]

I meant to write "Does this bug anyone else", not "buh". Everyone makes mistakes sometimes.

Whenever I go to Morocco to Hicham's family's house, I usually end up getting upset and frustrated with how things go. His family is very nice- they like me and I like them. I speak French fluently, and they are very aware of that, and they all speak French fluently as well. However, whenever I am there, they always speak Arabic to eachother the whole time as long as they are not addressing me. While we're eating lunch, in the car, watching TV, having tea, or whatever- they speak Arabic and I have no idea what they're saying and I just sit there and stare off into space and start to think about all of the mean things they are saying about me (which I know is not true but it makes me feel better to think about it). I think it's kind of rude because we all speak French, and I know that I would never do that to someone visiting me. I don't get mad about it or get mad at Hicham about it... but I just think it's not very polite. I guess it could just be another cultural difference. Does this happen to anyone else and does anyone else get annoyed by it?

A buh bye.

Sarah

Edited April 20, 2006 by sarah and hicham

[jordanianprincess 0]

Sarah - please let me assure you this is a cultural differnce and nothing more.

My sister in law is american and has been annoyed by this since the day she married my brother 10 years ago.

We do speak arabic when she is around and I know she doesn't understand but we never talk about her. Arabic is their first language and they are accustomed to speaking it. This is a part of who they are and you have to accept it and not let it bother you. You should also try to learn it, that will help. Embrace it and don't make it an issue.

From my families point of view, we don't see my sister in law as a visitor and never have. She is a part of the family. We don't feel we should have to stop speaking arabic because she does not understand. We don't mean to be harsh, but she has been in our family for 10 years and has never made one attempt to learn one word and sadly enough my niece and nephew know nothing arabic, not even food.

By the way...music is a great way to start learning arabic. and NO you are not being a brat, I know it's frustrating. My ex's familiy did it to me too, but I learned Spanish and after that it was not a problem.

[snz1802 0]

I know how that feels also, my fiance speaks Urdu, although I know none of his family, but when he is speaking it to someone, like his cousin or someone on the phone and I am with him, it does make you feel kind of weird. So, I am trying to learn some of it myself. It may be a little tough, but nothing in life worth having is easy......

[Veiled Princess 1]

That would bug the ####### out of me! I experienced this for 10 LONG years with my ex. He and his family and friends would always speak Vietnamese no matter where they were or who was around. They would lay up at my house all night drinking and blabbing away in Vietnamese and laughing non stop. I knew there were times when they were talking about me because they weren't even smart enough not to look me dead in the face while they were talking about me in their language. It really ticked him off when I started picking up on the language and caught him talking about other women with his friends! And the thing that really peeved me about it was every one of them spoke English fluently!! IF they wanted to talk to me they would speak English to me as good as (if not better than) me. It didn't bother me when his grandmother did it because she honestly didn't speak English and she was like 90 years old so she wasn't gonna learn. She would talk TO me in Vietnamese and then stare at me like "why are you not answering me?"

Anyway, I know this will happen when I meet Yousuf's family because none of them speak English but it won't bother me for that reason and I am sure Yousuf will translate anything for me that I don't understand. I have talked to one of his sisters on yahoo before and he helped me; he was on one screen and she was on another... when she'd type something in Arabic that I didn't understand I would copy and paste it to his screen and he would translate it for me... then I'd tell him what I wanted to say back to her if I didn't know how to type it and he would type it in Arabic so I could copy and paste it back into her screen I also met one of his friends in Egypt and they were both very polite any time I was in the room with them they would speak English out of courtesy for me because our religion forbids speaking in a different language when someone who doesn't speak that language is in the same room (if they speak that persons language).

If I were you I would tell him that it bothers you and maybe he can ask them not to speak Arabic while you're around since they do have the option to speak French.

[Together4ever 1]

I spent almost a year living in a flat with my husband's family and aside from him, the rest spoke very fractured english at best. They worked hard to teach me Arabic but I just didn't pick it up as fast as I hoped. However, I expected this to be the case. Sometimes I would get bored, but I am the type of person who is happy to sit with herself so it wasn't much of a problem. My husband is an incessant talker and filled most of my hours with plenty of English words so I was fairly content. English was almost like our secret language. We could talk about anything in front of the family and no one knew what we were saying. I tease him and remind him it won't be the case when he comes here. We could have some embarassing moments!!! Anyway, I used to entertain myself with refining the ability to talk with eyes, gestures and smiles (but not on the street!). His mother spoke the least English saying only "I love you" in English to me the whole time I was there, but we adored each other. Spoken language isn't the only language between people. It might be kind of fun to work on a new lingo that special just to you and the family.

[MaryandMian 1]

I know it is frustrating too. When I was in Pakistan most everyone spoke Urdu and I would sit and feel somewhat out of place. They would realize it and my husband would translate some of it for me. Alot of times it was so fast paced the conversations it was not about me but events, things or persons everyone knew but me. My husband told me the family loves you and you are not the topic of discussion it is other events and we do not mean for you to feel slighted. So with my southern accent I attempted to learn Urdu and the family thought it was so cute but I was butchering the language. I defiintely think it is cultural thing and when my husband and I spoke in English they were in the dark as well so he had to translate to them our conversations.

Mary

PS I had bought an Urdu book for travels and it was of no help. It was only few sentences and in general conversations it was useless. I had thought of this issue of the languages before I had traveled.

[MrsAmera 41]

Whew! Thank god this happens to other people. When I am in Morocco I accept that my Arabic is limited, my French is limited and their English is non-existant. We do what we can to communicate and his sisters are really patient with teaching me Arabic. One of Youssef's niece and nephews go to a really really nice private school in Marrakech and they are learning English. So Shayma (niece) stays with me and practices all the English she knows and helps her mom or aunts by translating some things for me. When she runs out of words she speaks French and it's a little easier understanding it from an 8 year old! I did have a really bad experience when we went to New York to visit his familiy. His sister in law has been here for 20+ years and his brother for 9. All of their friends are Moroccan (which I found a bit odd) and where they live in New York has a huge Arab population. No matter if we were home or out somewhere in the neighborhood everything was in Arabic - I swear I didn't even feel like I was in the United States. I know it's their first language but they all speak Arabic fluently. And everything we watched on TV was Arabic. It was really frustrating for me, even though I can understand some Arabic, to have the entire conversation time in Arabic. I hated when they would talk talk talk talk and then translate because it made me feel like I was not good enough to be included in their conversation. Most aspects of culture I wholly respect but this just strikes me as extremely rude, especially when they are in the United States. Would it kill them to have a conversation in English for just one night?!??! *sigh* There's my rant

[LebaneseMama 1]

Well I'm guilty of doing the same thing

If we have visitors and they are all arabic and one American we continue to speak in Arabic. The only time we speak in english is when we are addressing that person or translating. My family speaks English 100% but at home we are more comfortable with arabic. Does your SO translate for you ? Oh and I doubt they are talking about you right in front of you. Trust me I don't care what language it is you can tell when someone is talking about you.

I know I havent been much of a help but I just want you to know it's cuz they dont like you ... it's just how we are.

[Bosco 1]

It really doesn't bother me.

As far as Arabic conversations as here in the US, I am happy when he has the opportunity to speak in Arabic. I tell him not to bother to translate and to just enjoy his conversation. I don't think I am going to miss anything important and I can keep myself occupied.

If anything, I use it as my motivation to improve my Arabic.

Rebecca

[PalestineMyHeart 1,897]

I guess I see it the same way as snz1802, Mary, and Rebecca... it doesn't bother me at all to be surrounded by Arabic. I can speak some -- not nearly as much as I'd like but enough for some basic needs -- so I don't feel totally lost all the time. I like the opportunity to learn new words by immersion. Arabic is a really beautiful language, and the Palestinian dialect is very sweet-sounding and easy on the ears. And since it's my husband's native language, it's very important to me to be able to speak it, just as it's important for him to speak mine.

Arabic TV is more difficult for me to follow, especially the news, as they are speaking the standard Arabic and I am rarely exposed to that. Reporters on al Jazeera use a lot of words I don't know ! I usually have to look at the graphics and video to help me understand what's going on.

My husband's family is mostly speaking only Arabic. One of his sisters is quite fluent in English, and one of his brothers knows a little, but they are not around all the time. Of course Mahmoud will translate whenever required, but it's natural for him to speak Arabic at home with his family. His mother and most of his brothers and sisters and their husbands/wives/children speak only Arabic, so it forces me to give my limited skills a workout.

The amazing thing is my husband's father. He learned a little English as a teen/young man, but hadn't used it for more than 50 years. When I first spoke with him, he spoke only Arabic to me. (He's so cute -- he will keep just repeating the words until I figure out what he means.) But after a few days, he started coming out with English words here and there. And after a few weeks, he was speaking entire sentences in English ! I was so surprised. But mostly he is speaking Arabic to me, which helps me learn a lot of new words. He loves it when I speak to him in Arabic at home or in the market, etc. -- he will smile and do that little head shake of pride.

Anyways. It's certainly an adjustment, and not always easy. But the fact is -- you are marrying native Arabic- (or Urdu- !) speaking men who will have to do their best to speak English in the U.S., so the most positive thing you can do to get along in their countries and with their families is to just keep trying to learn more of their language.

Good luck to all in dealing with this !

-MK

[Jenn! 918]

When I spent time with Wadi's family in Morocco it was difficult, and I was often bored. But he goes through the same thing here, since his Enlgish is still very basic.

When his family addressed me they spoke in French, and I would respond in Italian. Not the easiest communication.

Obviously, this is different from what Sarah is talking about. I do believe that if everyone present is capable of speaking and understanding a language that you understand, then they should. But there comes a point when, if you're living immersed for a good deal of time, then you should expect people to revert back to their normal habits.

[portsaid 0]

I was uncomfortable around family and friends when they spoke Arabic and I didn't understand. I don't think they did it to be rude. We tired to communicate, but they spoke little English and I spoke no Arabic. I had my ex teach me some words before I went to Egypt, but simple things like hello and thank you.

One of the sweetest things that happened to me when I was in Egypt was my ex-husband's 6-year old nephew tried to teach me to count. He sat in front of me, would hold up his finger(s) say one in English and then Arabic. He would clap when I got it right and shake his head when it was wrong. He was a great teacher.

I think you should let them know it bothers you, but don't make a big deal. When you are there, just start a conversation in French or inquire what they are saying in French.

[sarah and hicham 3]

Thanks for your replies, I enjoyed reading them.

I ALWAYS tell Hicham how much it bothers me because normally it's just me, him, his Dad, and his little sister who doesn't speak... and they still speak Arabic. I never imagined that they would still speak Arabic around me since I speak French and so do they. I still think it's rude. Hicham just says that they just forget and start speaking in Arabic so I asked him not to ''forget", and even though I may have no idea what they are talking about and that it may not concern me at all that i would really appreciate his efforts to speak French. I can understand when i am at his Aunt's house and there are tons of people and not everyone speaks French very well that they speak Arabic. I have no problem with that and can always keep myself occupied playing with the dog or pretending like I understand what is on TV but geeez I get so bored and angry when Hicham and his Dad and older sister speak Arabic and laugh the night away and I'm sitting there staring at the floor.

Oh and when I was there in March it was really bad one day. Hicham's uncle and two cousins who have lived in Canada for the past 5 years and clearly speak French fluently were over and low and behold everyone spoke Arabic and only Arabic. BUT, the thing that I was basically just disgusted by is that his Uncle came over, no one introduces me to him, and his Uncle didn't even say hello! I tried to talk to him a little but he didn't even really respond. So I sat there and read a real estate magazine about 50 times. Then later on his Uncle starts talking to Hicham in Arabic, and I can easily pick up words like "Santa Barbara", "California" , "Cal Poly".... soooo basically they WERE talking about me yet his Uncle failed to even say one word to me. I got so mad I just went into Hicham's room and turned on the computer. his Uncle knew that I was fully capable of speaking French yet he chose not to include me in any conversation, even when it was about myself.

I personally just find it rude, and I would never do that to anyone without feeling terrible about it. It makes me mad just thinking about it.

I'm glad to hear that this does bother some of you.

The reason that it bothers me so much is that they are fluent in French and so am I so why can't we just speak French?

Sarah

[Jenn! 918]

BUT, the thing that I was basically just disgusted by is that his Uncle came over, no one introduces me to him, and his Uncle didn't even say hello! I tried to talk to him a little but he didn't even really respond. So I sat there and read a real estate magazine about 50 times. Then later on his Uncle starts talking to Hicham in Arabic, and I can easily pick up words like "Santa Barbara", "California" , "Cal Poly".... soooo basically they WERE talking about me yet his Uncle failed to even say one word to me. I got so mad I just went into Hicham's room and turned on the computer. his Uncle knew that I was fully capable of speaking French yet he chose not to include me in any conversation, even when it was about myself.

This sounds like a separate issue, masked by the language difference. I often got this impression from some of the older men in Wadi's family while I was there. I think many still think that women are inferior and are not very interested in their opinion. I bet it was that your participation in the conversation was probably seen as unnecessary, rather than a deliberate attempt to speak so that you didn't understand.

I hope I haven't offended anyone, but I also had similar experiences. I just chalked it up to cultural differences and let it go. Of course, that was eventually. I can't say it didn't bother me and hurt my feelings at the time.

[joyeann 0]

Hi Sarah,

When I met my husband and he was around his family and friends, he would constantly speak Persian. I understand only Hello and Goodbye lol However, after a time I explained to my husband that I had no idea what they were discussing and would they speak in English. So then anytime his friends came over he would try to speak in only English, yet, he would then apologize and ask if they could speak in Persian, because alot of the words and descriptions they were trying to convey, they couldn't translate in English(Even though they all spoke English fluently). So, maybe that is some of the issue. It always seemed that it would take 2 times as long for them to discuss something in English rather than Persian. I always said it required to much of a thought process for them ha ha ha But he has always been good about it and tried to translate. Usually when they say they are going to speak Persian, I just watch them speak like I understand it all ha ha ha

Have you tried speaking with the Uncle and ask that he speak in French? Or maybe that is not an option?