What Are Your Experiences With Language Issues

[CityCat 0]

Good point, I've noticed that too. I ask this question all the time time, because even though my wife and I are both Russian native speakers, we still have difficulty in communicating some times. Some of it is just based on our personalities and another part is that some of my "Thinking in English" said in fluent in Russian doesn't always come across with the same meaning in Russian. Keep in mind I came here when I was six and she came just three years ago.

But I think this fellow was referring to his ex-wife. According to his timeline he has just started the process with I guess a new fiancée.

Exactly! Even speaking the same language you may never understand each other! Thinking in English will come around for her too, don't worry. The only thing it takes is time. Oh, maybe also practice.

One more thing I don't understand is about these second or third time arounders. If it didn't work once, for exactly the reasons of nationality (lack of language skills, misunderstanding, different temper) why bother try again with the same type? Too irresistible?

[CityCat 0]

You are right, communication, or lack thereof was a big problem in our marriage. We are divorced now and she is still working her dead end, minimum wage job supplemented with a part time job as a sort of nanny to Russian speaking invalids.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's the old one... She would be so much better off with you, right? Come on, maybe she is happy out of her mind doing all that!!!

In the beginning, we had difficulties communicating. It just takes longer to get your point across but, it can be done. After some time goes by, it gets easier and easier. We did have to use a friend to translate some complex issues from time to time.

Wait a minute! Two folks, in bed, in the middle of the night. He goes: "Honey, a little slower!" And she goes: "Chevo?" and reaches for the phone to call the friend to translate... Couldn't it be a perfect episode of some sit-com? Maybe it sounds a little cruel (my apology, no offense meant) but gee, I can't imagine life like that!

[Fettman 0]

Sometimes I feel guilty that I do not know Russian, at least beyond words of love, but I am just thankful that Liliana knows English fluently. When we met she knew English and I cannot imagine trying to start a relationship with a communication barrier of two different languages. I am sure in many ways she would have been the same woman when I met her if she did not know English, but we would have hardly started any relationship. Of course I would have been attracted to her, but I want more than just looks. She has worked for American and British businesses and now is at a school in Germany that is taught in English. Sometimes she even corrects my English, but I throughly enjoy her "Russianness".

Sometimes a little Russian in bed is quite sexy

[slim 1,514]

Sunshine and puppy dogs..... love will conquer all!!!

I'm not sure how you say that in Russian. Oh well, doesn't matter because my fiancee loves me and we'll figure out a way to communicate because we both love each other. It doesn't matter if we need a translator to express our ideas and emotions to each other because we really love each other.

The glass is half full.

Full of bull$#!T.

[Waitlisted 0]

Wow! Ok. First of all, she may be happy working her dead end job but, being happy doesn't pay the bills in the San Francisco bay area where the median home price is in the range of $700 to $800,000. Also, you are assuming that she speaks no English and I speak no Russian. Ne pravda! I know what "chevo" means. In the beginning I had problems with her because I would try to talk to her and I would try to help her with her English lessons but, she would refuse my help and she would not talk with me. I finally had to get a friend to translate so that I could understand what the problem was. She was just ashamed to make any mistakes. We got over that and things were better.

Why would I do it again, if it didn't work out with the first one? There are many reasons. One is that now, most of my friends are married to Russian women. Finding another Russian woman would be a good fit with my friends. Also, I have more or less assimilated into the Russian culture, I love travelling to Russia, I enjoy the people, the culture, the history, even the food. And of course, Russian women are younger and prettier than any woman I have met or I am likely to meet here. Why not marry another Russian?

[Satellite 1]

Russian women are younger and prettier than any woman I have met or I am likely to meet here. Why not marry another Russian?

Those same pretty Russian women are right in front of you in the San Francisco Bay Area. Have a look around. Most are bilingual and completely assimilated into American culture. The BIG problem here of course is that those ladies don’t need a green card And will have no interest in anyone who is also not young, handsome, etc...

[groovlstk 0]

Sunshine and puppy dogs..... love will conquer all!!!

I'm not sure how you say that in Russian. Oh well, doesn't matter because my fiancee loves me and we'll figure out a way to communicate because we both love each other. It doesn't matter if we need a translator to express our ideas and emotions to each other because we really love each other.

The glass is half full.

Full of bull$#!T.

I'd have to agree. Every time I see some lovestruck guy here saying it doesn't matter that he can't have a conversation with his fiancee because they're head-over-heels in love, I get a sinking feeling that there will be yet another trainwreck.

Can some pull it off? Undoubtedly; but based on my experience w/other couples and dating Russian women in the US before I met my wife, I'd say they are a very very tiny minority.

My wife and I have been living together for 10 months and I'd never be so naive to call us a success at such an early stage, but I don't know how we'd have ever weathered our first few months together in the US if I hadn't been able to explain to her extensively about finances, bills, discretionary income, transit, projects to keep her busy until she had her EAD, family, friends, food, customs, traditions, etc., etc.

The stresses and intense isolation that our spouses endure upon arrival are extraordinary, and add to that their total dependence upon us for the first year or so and you have a ticking timebomb. A single argument over some silly misunderstanding can have her reaching for her suitcase (and that's if she's a decent person, lesser women will use the opportunity to file DV charges and fast-track their Green Card with you on the sidelines). I can't imagine resolving serious issues without a common language.

[Buck and Natalia 0]

I've been poking around on this forum looking for posts related to personal experiences couples have had when neither is fluent in the native language of the other. I have found some posts, but decided to start a new thread anyway. I'm particularly interested in experiences anyone would like to share about after their fiance/fiancee arrives.

First, my own (limited) experiences so far:

When Natasha and I met online, I spoke no Russian at all and she spoke English at a very basic level. Understanding spoken English is a challenge for her though. She used a program called Magic Goody to translate my English chat text to Russian, and her Russian chat text to English. We talked several times this way before I knew she was using a software translator. Being a very quick typist, I quickly purchased and installed PROMT and we began chatting exclusively in Russian simply because there was less 'lag' in the conversation. This had a very pleasant side-effect I'll discuss later.

Software translation can be very frustrating initially, and Natasha and I had our fair share of misunderstandings, but we have learned how to choose our words and phrasing to maximize the likelihood that the intended meaning of our words survives translation by the software. It's not perfect, by any means, but it is a reasonable substitute (for now) to being able to speak directly in the language of the other. Web cameras are also a great help because so much can be communicated through expressions and body language to accentuate the words we type.

Before I traveled to Russia to meet Natasha in person, I began studying Russian using Pimsleur Conversational Russian audio CDs. I found this very frustrating, although I did learn some basics - yes, no, hello, goodbye, please, thank you, understand, I, you, not, etc. I apparently don't learn well using purely audio based methods. In total, I studied this way for about 4 weeks, maybe 4 times a week, then I went to Russia.

In Russia, Natasha taught me more words (man, woman, boy, girl, market, bus, etc) but we relied upon her basic English to communicate. It was very frustrating sometimes, and if our day was going to be complex, we would use the software translator before we headed out to discuss our plans in detail for the day. My Russian responses were usually limited to yes, no, I understand, I don't understand, but we managed to spend a truly glorious 3 and a half weeks together there. Much loved by her non-English speaking family was the game "Let's have the American try and pronounce Russian words". We played this game during many meal times spent around the dining table. Someone would point to something in the kitchen and then say the Russian word for it, which I would then attempt to mimic. It was hilarious!

Since I have returned, I have decided to go as full-tilt into Russian language study as I can manage. I purchased Level 1 and 2 from Rosetta Stone and I study 3 or 4 times each week, with a goal of completing one lesson per week. Often, I will study while chatting with Natasha, and we will turn on the microphones so that she can listen and correct my pronunciation. Anyone interested (in Rosetta Stone particularly) can check my progress on my website (it's linked from my profile here on VJ). I post blog reports after each lesson and I have my grades posted in a separate section as well. I study from the 'home school' edition of the software, where the program directs my study and my progress is based on my performance, and each lesson must be passed three times where different things are emphasized (Rosetta Stone calls this the comprehensive mode). Chatting in Russian using a software translator made me at least familiar with the Cyrillic alphabet and taught me to recognize a lot of words by sight. Now that I'm learning to speak Russian with Rosetta Stone, I am finding it relatively 'easy' to pick up how the letters are pronounced. This is the pleasant side-effect of chatting in written Russian I alluded to earlier.

Learning Russian is important to me, because Natasha's Russian heritage is important to me. Eventually I wish to be able to speak directly with her parents and her family in their native language. When I was there and I asked her parents for permission to marry Natasha, we relied upon the software translator as we sat at the computer, with Natasha occasionally adding something to the conversation if she thought something was unclear. This worked at the time, but it is not what I desire with regard to speaking with her family.

I know I have, most probably, 5 to 7 months before Natasha receives her visa and I travel to Russia to bring her and her daughter to this country. I will use that time to continue my studies of the Russian language and I hope to have completed the bulk of the Level 1 material by that time. I know this will put me at no more than the advanced beginner level, and even after Natasha arrives it is my plan to continue my studies and finish Level 1 and 2 during the first 18 months or so of our being together. This will, I hope, take me to an intermediate level of Russian, and Natasha will take me to whatever level of fluency I am capable of.

Natasha may take English classes (something like ESL) and she may not - she has taken classes before and she believes that simply being here and immersed in English (and with me as her guide) will be all she requires. We will play this by ear and see how it goes. She also believes that her daughter will best learn by just being here, but I'm not as convinced of this. I know that Vika (Natasha's daughter) studies some English at her school now, so perhaps Natasha will be proven right. She usually is!

Here are two comments from other posts on this forum, which I liked and which I think are relevant:

From Jewel12:

"I have a hard time understanding how you can fall in love with a person if you don't speak a common language fluently, but there's lots of things I don't understand, so I better shut up smile.gif"

From bready99:

"This question is pretty simple to answer for me. There is more to loving each other than speaking a common language fluently. If it was that simple (just language) then there would not be so many divorces or break-ups in this country (U.S.A.) or even in the world.

To answer the question for us, it is the way we look at each other, the way we treat each other, the way she laughs or smiles at the things I do. It is how we are able to hug each other after being so frustrated with some of the things we do or say or can't say to each other. We communicate in many ways with each other and, for the most part, it is all enjoyable. We do talk to each other and we do help each other in many ways. I think being in love is all about how each person "completes" the other person. It's not just about talking and it's not all about sex, it's all about how well two people are able to relate to each other and feel good in that relationship. Love is all about feelings and emotions and how two people are able to share and communicate those feelings. Speaking a similar language is just one way of communicating those emotions. I think those of you who have difficulty understanding how two people can be in love without speaking a common language fluently will also have difficulty in understanding those people who can fall in love at first sight, but that's another topic."

Bready99, thank you. You said that so much better than I could ever hope to. Love is very much a (and I hate to use a much-overused term) synergistic thing. When everything is right, it is much more something you feel than something you say. Words are very poor instruments for communicating what we have inside of us, in our hearts. Communication is important, and those of us who have chosen a mate where a language is not shared have a tough road ahead, there is no denying that. But if our hearts are in the right place, if we are truly committed and dedicated to one another, then language shouldn't be an issue. Language is a learned thing, not an innate thing like love is (for me, anyway).

Ok, I guess I'll wrap up my first real post here on VJ. I've lurked for some time now and added a short reply here or there, but I've never delved into anything so verbosely before. Agree with me, disagree with me, even flame me, but if you have something relevant on this subject to share I'd very much welcome your words.

Kevin

Just my opinion: Anything that increases understanding and improves the relationship is helpful. Before she arrives in the USA, any russian you learn is an absolute bonus. Learn as much as you want. It can only help. It can never hurt. Indeed, your knowledge of russian can assist her as she learns english. After she arrives in the USA, you will need to excercise some time management discretion. She will need to learn english quickly in order to work and to function day-to-day. Speaking russian at home in USA should not be used to the point that it detracts from her learning of english. That being said, a person can only learn so much english during the course of a day. At first, you will probably find that she reaches her english saturation point pretty quickly during the course of a day. Once the saturation point is reached, speaking russian can be a nice break. As time passes and she learns more english, it will take her longer to reach her saturation point on a daily basis. She will toleratate english better and can absorb more during the course of a day. However, before she arrives, any russian you learn now is a bonus.

[Nancy2015 2]

Being with someone who speaks a language you can't understand is frustrating and boring. It applies to all relationships - not just romantic. And it's also my personal opinion - I can understand there may be people who feel differently about it, and I don't expect these people to agree with me.

I can't imagine myself falling in love with a Spanish-speaking person, no matter how "hot" he is. I don't speak a word of Spanish, how will I ever figure out what this guy's ideas, beliefs and goals are? And to me, ideas, beliefs and goals constitute a personality, and it's the personality I care about, not the looks. I don't think you can learn these things about the other person without sharing a common language.

I don't think I can even like somebody who speaks a language I don't know. If someone's speech sounds like meaningless noise to me, I may feel intimidation, isolation, frustarion and even fear. Certainly not affection.

Edited September 5, 2007 by Sid and Nancy

[CityCat 0]

Wow! Ok. First of all, she may be happy working her dead end job but, being happy doesn't pay the bills in the San Francisco bay area where the median home price is in the range of $700 to $800,000.

You can't put a price tag on freedom. To choose whom to be with, where to go, whom to sleep with, whom to have kids with!

Why would I do it again, if it didn't work out with the first one? There are many reasons. One is that now, most of my friends are married to Russian women. Finding another Russian woman would be a good fit with my friends. Also, I have more or less assimilated into the Russian culture, I love travelling to Russia, I enjoy the people, the culture, the history, even the food. And of course, Russian women are younger and prettier than any woman I have met or I am likely to meet here. Why not marry another Russian?

So you are saying that you'd decide to be with somebody 'cause it would be a good fit with your friends? Nice...

Other than that, I am with Sat on that one. I am wondering if Russia had closed borders now, how such men would procreate (or get laid for that matter)?..

Russian women are younger and prettier than any woman I have met or I am likely to meet here. Why not marry another Russian?

Those same pretty Russian women are right in front of you in the San Francisco Bay Area. Have a look around. Most are bilingual and completely assimilated into American culture. The BIG problem here of course is that those ladies don’t need a green card And will have no interest in anyone who is also not young, handsome, etc...

Thank you! You nailed it, as usual!!!

[Nancy2015 2]

And of course, Russian women are younger and prettier than any woman I have met or I am likely to meet here. Why not marry another Russian?

There are older Russian women too; I take it, you're not interested in them?

[Waitlisted 0]

I am wondering if Russia had closed borders now, how such men would procreate (or get laid for that matter)?..

Wow! You're talking about me, right? I know that you need to have thick skin to venture out onto these forums but, I don't really need this abuse! I just gave a few examples, I am not going to write a dissertation here. You are right, there are a lot of Russian women here and I have dated some, I just wasn't lucky enough to find the right one.

Now, if you will excuse me, I will go back under the rock I crawled out of and you boys and girls can have this playground all to yourself.

[Turboguy 6]

Forums can be brutal sometimes Waitlisted but to be honest if you can't take the heat in a forum you probably can't take the heat that goes along with having a RW for a wife. Chill out and share your views.

As far as the statement about younger woman there seems to be little doubt in my mind that when they are there "some" who are much more accepting of age differences than "most" American women" Once they get here since they are often slender, feminine and attractive the pickings are much better and they get more selective. There are a lot of the women who have a lot of loyalty and love for their man and if they find themselves in a good marriage with a good man they won't dump him just becuase ther are better choices available. There was something in the news yesterday about a study of speed dating. What it said was that guys would arrive listing that they were looking for a woman with certain qualities. Once they got into it all that went out the window and they were attracted to the smoking hot ones who met none of thier criteria.

The other factor that comes into play is that when romancing a woman from Russia many can not afford or get the vacation time to get to know each other the way we really should. It does raise the chance of failure. Lack of common language can also add a lot of challenges and a lot of risk.

[russ 1]

There was something in the news yesterday about a study of speed dating. What it said was that guys would arrive listing that they were looking for a woman with certain qualities. Once they got into it all that went out the window and they were attracted to the smoking hot ones who met none of thier criteria.

Being young and attractive is an advantage in life for men as well. Especially in business - I think by being tall, well groomed, and handsome probably doubles your salary at a lot of jobs (where how you look should otherwise not matter).

Men who are outgoing and funny have a huge advantage in attracting women, more important than how they look.

[Satellite 1]

You are right, there are a lot of Russian women here and I have dated some, I just wasn't lucky enough to find the right one.

younger woman there seems to be little doubt in my mind that when they are there "some" who are much more accepting of age differences than "most" American women"

There are a lot of the women who have a lot of loyalty and love for their man and if they find themselves in a good marriage with a good man they won't dump him just because there are better choices available.

The BIG problem here of course is that those ladies don’t need a green card

Do I need to say more? I am standing with my position that (1) the desire for a green card will allow a woman to be "less" selective and overlook a bunch bad attributes that a Russian woman already here or any woman without immigration issues would not and (2) Of course they will not leave and be loyal because that hinders the goal and reason of coming to the states (green card and all the benefits associated with that).