Will 29 yrs age difference be a problem during the interview for CR1 or K-3

[unique love 0]

Will 29 yrs age difference be a problem during the interview for the CR1 or K-3 in US embassy in Jordan??

me :i am 29 yrs

my wife is 58 yrs

[payxibka 10,045]

Anecdotal evidence would indicate that it would be in your best interst to be adequately prepared to address this issue

[unique love 0]

Anecdotal evidence would indicate that it would be in your best interst to be adequately prepared to address this issue

like what, we have wedding pictures ,living togethor pictures, marriage certification??

[Mononoke28 134]

COs have been known for being a little tough on cases like this, where the USC is a woman and happens to be older. Just try to have as much evidence as possible and be prepared to answer any questions just in case.

[payxibka 10,045]

Anecdotal evidence would indicate that it would be in your best interst to be adequately prepared to address this issue

like what, we have wedding pictures ,living togethor pictures, marriage certification??

You might find better assistance in the regional forums area as there are members very experienced with your consulate

[pushbrk 12,606]

Anecdotal evidence would indicate that it would be in your best interst to be adequately prepared to address this issue

like what, we have wedding pictures ,living togethor pictures, marriage certification??

You might find better assistance in the regional forums area as there are members very experienced with your consulate

I second that recommendation but please be aware you'll be needing to convince a Consular officer in a personal interview that your relationship is bona fide and ongoing. Wedding pictures and a marriage certificate would be presented by anybody with a sham marriage. Your evidence of having actually lived together will go a long ways toward showing bona fides. You'll want to include evidence of multiple visits if you have them, pictures taken in multiple locations, on multiple dates and with differrent family members as well as evidence of ongoing communication via email, letters, cards, chat sessions, and phone bills.

Further, you, the visa applicant will need to be prepared to answer questions about why you love your wife, and details about her family and life history. You'll need to show a preponderance of evidence that your relationship is bona fide to overcome the presumption that it is for immigration purposes only.

[blueblue 0]

It all depends on the CO who does your interview. If you get a good one, your ages may not even be an issue at all. If you get a bad one, as many have in this and similar circumstances, it can be a very uphill battle just to get them to even look at your evidence.

Since you don't know which you will get until you get to the interview, the best you can do is what you are doing. Prepare yourself for the worst case scenario and educate yourself on what that could be. I wish we had known it was possible for the CO to deny your case without giving a chance to address their concerns or even know they had concerns before they just threw the case away.

First, I would recommend that you both go to the interview.

Second, I would gather every bit of evidence of your relationship you can (as applicable - this is a list, just to give you an idea of what may be useful), pictures, hotel records, copies of visa stamps, plane tickets, wedding pictures, receipts for wedding related items, rings, etc., pictures of you with each other's families, letters of support from each of your families, phone records, copies of emails, copies of letters to each other, evidence of instant message conversations, log of dates of conversations, birth cert of any children, joint bank accounts, life insurance with spouse as beneficiary, retirement plan with spouse as beneficiary, etc. Bring all this and anything else you have with you to the interview.

BTW, the poster that stated your obligation is to overcome the presumption that your marriage is fraud, according to the law, is not correct. If you have an approved I-130 that establishes your right to a spouse visa benefit and the CO is not supposed to readjudicate that petition and in fact the approved I-130 or I-129F is 'prima facie evidence of the relationship between the petitioner and the beneficiary." 9FAM 42.43 However, in practice COs have freely ignored this fact and accused many valid relationships of fraud. On this forum alone there have been many couples whose only problem was that the wife was older than the husband, just the existance of a red flag without any other evidence and in fact with overwhelming evidence to the contrary, still resulted in a denied visa. The result is ugly, extremely long and painful to try to recover from and correct the situation because there is no accountability in the system.

So, gather all that you can, go to the interview together. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

Good luck and hopefully you will get a good one.

[pushbrk 12,606]

It all depends on the CO who does your interview. If you get a good one, your ages may not even be an issue at all. If you get a bad one, as many have in this and similar circumstances, it can be a very uphill battle just to get them to even look at your evidence.

Good or bad in this context is relative and circumstancial. If the marriage is a fraud, it is good to question it. If it looks like it could be fraud, it is good to question it. That we don't like it happening to our loved ones is a given.

BTW, the poster that stated your obligation is to overcome the presumption that your marriage is fraud, according to the law, is not correct.

Not correct and not stated. This is what I wrote, "You'll need to show a preponderance of evidence that your relationship is bona fide to overcome the presumption that it is for immigration purposes only." The presumption isn't "under the law" it is, as you indicate below, what one can expect.

If you have an approved I-130 that establishes your right to a spouse visa benefit and the CO is not supposed to readjudicate that petition and in fact the approved I-130 or I-129F is 'prima facie evidence of the relationship between the petitioner and the beneficiary."

It is prima facia enough to allow the beneficiary to apply for a visa but not prima facia enough to overcome any information gathered or observed after the petition is approved.

9FAM 42.43 However, in practice COs have freely ignored this fact and accused many valid relationships of fraud. On this forum alone there have been many couples whose only problem was that the wife was older than the husband, just the existance of a red flag without any other evidence and in fact with overwhelming evidence to the contrary, still resulted in a denied visa. The result is ugly, extremely long and painful to try to recover from and correct the situation because there is no accountability in the system.

Fortunately, some of the result is that many fraudulent relationships don't get visas. It works both ways. These people have a difficult job to do but the do have a job that needs doing.

So, gather all that you can, go to the interview together. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

Good luck and hopefully you will get a good one.

Yes, good luck.

[blueblue 0]

We'll agree to disagree on a number of points. Since you don't have firsthand experience I understand it is difficult to see another side. However, there are a couple things I'd like to point out.

There is a big difference between questioning a relationship that 'looks like it may be suspicious' and declaring a suspicion (which is not investigated or ignoring extensive evidence presented) as being fraud. The former is certainly a valid part of their job. The later is patently unfair and according to the law and DOS policy, it is not their job to jump to random conclusions with out proof.

As to information gathered or observed after the petition is approved, the ages of the petitioner and beneficiary are included in the original petition that was approved. This is not new information observed or discovered at the interview which should be used to deny a visa. However, as we said, they do it anyway all the time. The fact that DOS has found the need to send TWO cables on the matter within the last couple years to address these kinds of issues speaks to the extent of the problem of COs wrongfully accusing couples of fraud.

As to it working both ways, I would submit it is better to give a fraudulent visa than it is to deny a valid couple. Following is just a rhetorical discussion at this point as it has no bearing on what will happen but just throwing it out there. This is a legal discussion of due process and fairness which I think is relevant to this point:

Fairness is the idea of doing what's best. It may not be perfect, but it's the good and decent thing to do. It requires being level-headed, uniform and regular, when all around you is prejudice, corruption, or the desire of an angry mob to see justice done. Fairness requires breadth and depth. Not only does the outcome have to be fair, but so does everything along the line such as evidence gathering and presentation. Fairness is difficult to put in the form of strict legal rules and principles that cover every situation. Which is fairer?

*A system of rules so strict that even a few innocent people get unfairly punished

* A system not so strict that even a few guilty people go unfairly unpunished

Due process of law holds that the second answer is more correct, for many reasons. On a practical level, there's less of a danger to the whole legal system. If your system is convicting a few innocent, chances are it's railroading many of the guilty, so you've got two problems on your hands -- those who are falsely imprisoned and those who have a stronger habeas corpus claim. If your system is letting a few guilty slip through, chances are that those lucky evil-doers might change their ways, or in any case, law enforcement or informal methods of social control can pick up the slack. However, on the more important theoretical level, it depends on what kind of system you want to have -- one that just rolls over people indiscriminately -- or one that is individualized and takes into account the need for your society to expand freedom. The U.S. Constitution guarantees due process because it's designed to be a "living document" that expands freedom.

Enjoy! and God bless everyone.

[pushbrk 12,606]

We'll agree to disagree on a number of points. Since you don't have firsthand experience I understand it is difficult to see another side. However, there are a couple things I'd like to point out.

There is a big difference between questioning a relationship that 'looks like it may be suspicious' and declaring a suspicion (which is not investigated or ignoring extensive evidence presented) as being fraud. The former is certainly a valid part of their job. The later is patently unfair and according to the law and DOS policy, it is not their job to jump to random conclusions with out proof.

As to information gathered or observed after the petition is approved, the ages of the petitioner and beneficiary are included in the original petition that was approved. This is not new information observed or discovered at the interview which should be used to deny a visa. However, as we said, they do it anyway all the time. The fact that DOS has found the need to send TWO cables on the matter within the last couple years to address these kinds of issues speaks to the extent of the problem of COs wrongfully accusing couples of fraud.

As to it working both ways, I would submit it is better to give a fraudulent visa than it is to deny a valid couple. Following is just a rhetorical discussion at this point as it has no bearing on what will happen but just throwing it out there. This is a legal discussion of due process and fairness which I think is relevant to this point:

Fairness is the idea of doing what's best. It may not be perfect, but it's the good and decent thing to do. It requires being level-headed, uniform and regular, when all around you is prejudice, corruption, or the desire of an angry mob to see justice done. Fairness requires breadth and depth. Not only does the outcome have to be fair, but so does everything along the line such as evidence gathering and presentation. Fairness is difficult to put in the form of strict legal rules and principles that cover every situation. Which is fairer?

*A system of rules so strict that even a few innocent people get unfairly punished

* A system not so strict that even a few guilty people go unfairly unpunished

Due process of law holds that the second answer is more correct, for many reasons. On a practical level, there's less of a danger to the whole legal system. If your system is convicting a few innocent, chances are it's railroading many of the guilty, so you've got two problems on your hands -- those who are falsely imprisoned and those who have a stronger habeas corpus claim. If your system is letting a few guilty slip through, chances are that those lucky evil-doers might change their ways, or in any case, law enforcement or informal methods of social control can pick up the slack. However, on the more important theoretical level, it depends on what kind of system you want to have -- one that just rolls over people indiscriminately -- or one that is individualized and takes into account the need for your society to expand freedom. The U.S. Constitution guarantees due process because it's designed to be a "living document" that expands freedom.

Enjoy! and God bless everyone.

We disagree about very little but I'm not addressing your situation. I'm advising the OP to be prepared, not justifying anybody's misbehavior, not debating what is right or wrong about how a CO does their job.

There is absolutely no reason for USCIS to consider age. Their job is to determine that a marriage took place, that the petitioner is a USC and that appropriate evidence was presented that any former marriages have been terminated. Determining the validity, the bona fides of the relationship between the two people and/or whether the marriage was entered into for nothing more than an immigration benefit, is definitely the job of the Consulate.

I agree that a Consular officer would be out of line to deny a visa because of an age difference but I have no evidence that has happened. What I see happening is that more scrutiny is given to relationships that fit a profile of other fraudulent applications. Sometimes they get it wrong. Sometimes only one party to the marriage is being deceived and sometimes it is both. No amount of us arguing will help the OP in this case. This couple had better be ready to show convincing evidence their relationship is bona fide. Like it or not, those are the facts. I don't like it any more than you do.

I responded to you because you mischaracterized my statement.

[kitkat1 5]

hmmm - interesting that "unique love" aka tikbj aka tess aka lasso was previously posting her sad stories about her relationships saying " I also was with a man from jordan I am muslim smart attractive funny. I loved him and thought he loved me -- http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...92&hl=tikbj,

and now "she's" the husband . . . umm TROLL ALERT anyone?

[Lance27 19]

she had a sex change? Edited July 26, 2007 by Lance27

[blueblue 0]

I noticed that too, after responding to the post. You're probably right, but it is an interesting discussion anyway.

hmmm - interesting that "unique love" aka tikbj aka tess aka lasso was previously posting her sad stories about her relationships saying " I also was with a man from jordan I am muslim smart attractive funny. I loved him and thought he loved me -- http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...92&hl=tikbj,

and now "she's" the husband . . . umm TROLL ALERT anyone?

I responded to you because you mischaracterized my statement.

Thanks for clarifying. Certainly wasn't my intent to mischaracterize your post!

[ding 1]

Anecdotal evidence would indicate that it would be in your best interst to be adequately prepared to address this issue

like what, we have wedding pictures ,living togethor pictures, marriage certification??

You might find better assistance in the regional forums area as there are members very experienced with your consulate

I second that recommendation but please be aware you'll be needing to convince a Consular officer in a personal interview that your relationship is bona fide and ongoing. Wedding pictures and a marriage certificate would be presented by anybody with a sham marriage. Your evidence of having actually lived together will go a long ways toward showing bona fides. You'll want to include evidence of multiple visits if you have them, pictures taken in multiple locations, on multiple dates and with differrent family members as well as evidence of ongoing communication via email, letters, cards, chat sessions, and phone bills.

Further, you, the visa applicant will need to be prepared to answer questions about why you love your wife, and details about her family and life history. You'll need to show a preponderance of evidence that your relationship is bona fide to overcome the presumption that it is for immigration purposes only.

pushbrk,

I have many phone card invoices from onlne services. But they don't state the phone numbers I call - my beneficiary/wife-to-be. Will we fall through a crack there, do you think?

[pushbrk 12,606]

Anecdotal evidence would indicate that it would be in your best interst to be adequately prepared to address this issue

like what, we have wedding pictures ,living togethor pictures, marriage certification??

You might find better assistance in the regional forums area as there are members very experienced with your consulate

I second that recommendation but please be aware you'll be needing to convince a Consular officer in a personal interview that your relationship is bona fide and ongoing. Wedding pictures and a marriage certificate would be presented by anybody with a sham marriage. Your evidence of having actually lived together will go a long ways toward showing bona fides. You'll want to include evidence of multiple visits if you have them, pictures taken in multiple locations, on multiple dates and with differrent family members as well as evidence of ongoing communication via email, letters, cards, chat sessions, and phone bills.

Further, you, the visa applicant will need to be prepared to answer questions about why you love your wife, and details about her family and life history. You'll need to show a preponderance of evidence that your relationship is bona fide to overcome the presumption that it is for immigration purposes only.

pushbrk,

I have many phone card invoices from onlne services. But they don't state the phone numbers I call - my beneficiary/wife-to-be. Will we fall through a crack there, do you think?

They will look at the total picture but those phone cards are not likely to help.