Cultural Differences

[1HappyGuy 45]

I don't think you are getting the point here. In Russia and Ukraine the people have the opportunity to go on vacation for over 30 days a year. The costs, although comparable in relationship to countries, still seems to allow the people over there to do more things than we can. Whether that is a result of life styles, cultures, economic needs, or ability to pay, there is a fairly large difference.

I don't think Slim meant, nor did I to say that the women from Russia/Ukraine are unwilling to work, expect to be treated like princesses or any of that. It is just a fact that costs in America for just simple things are just a larger percentage of our income levels. I have always been impressed with how hard working the women from eastern European countries are and would never insinuate they were lazy or spoiled.

If I left that impression, I apologize.

I just got back from Ukraine where we put together a small family reunion for my wife's family. We are still adding up our costs but it looks to be over $11,000 for myself, my wife and her son. We did provide lodging for her father and brother and sister in law. There is of course the gifts to be considered but it was pretty pricey for a three week trip. Money does not grow on trees and all cultures understand this.

[CityCat 0]

My American opinion about the healthfulness of food - covering everything with gallons of mayonaise is probably worse for health than the small dose of hormones and toxins.

Sort of a burning issue - mayo. I love it to death!!!! I could sell my soul for a good mayo. But I am the ONLY person in my family and pretty much the ONLY Russian person I know who eats that much of it. And every time I enjoy my favorite sauce I get this dirty look from my hubby: "Ah, you crazy Russians and your love to mayo!"

Apparently, russ, since you mention mayo (and you are American and in Russia now with your wife (BTW, is it the same Galina who posted here? A bit confusing for me...) as far as I've understood reading older posts) it does mean some personal and cultural involvement to you too. Am I missing something and AW don't eat mayo ever? Does your wife and Russians you meet like it? Does it bother anybody? Or is it the heaviest sin in the world in the eyes of American men to eat a spoonful of it here and there? How dangerous is it healthwise?

[CityCat 0]

I don't think you are getting the point here. In Russia and Ukraine the people have the opportunity to go on vacation for over 30 days a year. The costs, although comparable in relationship to countries, still seems to allow the people over there to do more things than we can. Whether that is a result of life styles, cultures, economic needs, or ability to pay, there is a fairly large difference.

I wouldn't say so, not about Russia at least.

I don't think Slim meant, nor did I to say that the women from Russia/Ukraine are unwilling to work, expect to be treated like princesses or any of that. It is just a fact that costs in America for just simple things are just a larger percentage of our income levels. I have always been impressed with how hard working the women from eastern European countries are and would never insinuate they were lazy or spoiled.

If I left that impression, I apologize.

Exactly my point! Very hardworking and knowing right from wrong but this again depends on a woman...

I just got back from Ukraine where we put together a small family reunion for my wife's family. We are still adding up our costs but it looks to be over $11,000 for myself, my wife and her son. We did provide lodging for her father and brother and sister in law. There is of course the gifts to be considered but it was pretty pricey for a three week trip. Money does not grow on trees and all cultures understand this.

Yaieeks! Bites! We could afford it though, but I would never let such a some of money be spent on anything as insignificant as vacation under any circumstances! But that's just me...

[russ 1]

Am I missing something and AW don't eat mayo ever? Does your wife and Russians you meet like it? Does it bother anybody? Or is it the heaviest sin in the world in the eyes of American men to eat a spoonful of it here and there? How dangerous is it healthwise?

I like mayo. Love it with french fries, ketchup too. It just stood out to me how much was in the stores in Russia. In the states, 1 section of a shelf. Most large stores here, 3 aisles. Someone is eating it. Restaurants serve a lot of it too here.

[Nancy2015 2]

One small warning as well, watch out for Russian ice cream!

You are just unlucky, are you sure it was the ice cream? I love Russian ice cream. I think it tastes a lot better than the American kind. And the basic cone (very soft) went for just 3 rubles in 2004. Can't beat that!

I'm so with you on that - I love Russian ice cream!! It's the best

I just got back from Ukraine where we put together a small family reunion for my wife's family. We are still adding up our costs but it looks to be over $11,000 for myself, my wife and her son. We did provide lodging for her father and brother and sister in law. There is of course the gifts to be considered but it was pretty pricey for a three week trip. Money does not grow on trees and all cultures understand this.

Yaieeks! Bites! We could afford it though, but I would never let such a some of money be spent on anything as insignificant as vacation under any circumstances! But that's just me...

I think my impression that most people on this board are fabulously rich was correct

[russ 1]

I'm so with you on that - I love Russian ice cream!! It's the best

I wish that I liked ice cream, I feel like I'm missing out on something great. There was a thing called the "Scooper Bowl" in Boston where I grew up, all you can eat ice cream. 14 ice creams in 2 hours. I've never wanted any more since (I was about 8 then).

[slim 1,514]

This is all very interesting and surprising for me - the way your wifes think about money and work and the ratio of the work done and money paid for it. I probably come from a different background or simply have different experience in life but gee, it has never been an enigma to me that one has to work hard to pay a living. Money tree, like slim mentioned? I didn't have such an image in my mind even when I was three!

And Russian women, from my first hand experience, have never hit me as dreamers, more likely as hard-workers, as women who never rely on anybody but themselves to get by in this life. So this seems a little strange for me when you, gentlemen, mention such concepts that you think your ladies have.

There is no other nationality more aware of the cost of living anywhere than Russian women. But it's just my opinion. I may be wrong...

My wife was willing to work hard for her money, but to her, hard work was to meet with a rich older man, (that was usually married with children) make interesting conversation, eat dinner, go to nice places, and let him pay for anything she so desired. (The actual "work" that was done....?) She has explained to me at length that this is something normal in the Far East, that beautiful girls who respect themselves MUST be paid for their time. Like you, I had to ask, "and you're not a prostitute how?" and she replied "if a man is willing to pay a prostitute $100 to only have sex, he must pay me $1000 and take me to nice fashionable places, nice dinners, and do luxurious stuff. It is for him lucky to be with me. He must pay me." I still don't get it. Something like an escort that's not really an escort? A hooker that doesnt' "charge"? Semantics aside, she was used to being wined and dined (and I'll omit the numerical postlude) by rich older gentlemen and had no problems covering her expenses.

Therein lies the problem. Now that we're married, the "sugar daddy" (or, sugar daddIES) doesn't pay her bills anymore. I've been told that I must be like Papa Karlo and take a second job so I can buy her nicer things because she deserves them and it's my privelege to be with a woman as wonderful as her. I however, find that to be complete and utter ####### and will not stand for it. So, she's working right now to pay our bills, and we're using both of our paychecks to cover expenses with all of my extra money going toward bills I had prior to our marriage. We've only been at it a week, so we'll see how it goes. Needless to say, the bulk of our relationship problems stem from the fact that I don't have enough money to take her to expensive restaurants and hotels to have sex with her. Maybe someday, we'll be rich enough to do that and she can feel "worthy" again. I can only hope!

I don't think Slim meant, nor did I to say that the women from Russia/Ukraine are unwilling to work, expect to be treated like princesses or any of that. It is just a fact that costs in America for just simple things are just a larger percentage of our income levels. I have always been impressed with how hard working the women from eastern European countries are and would never insinuate they were lazy or spoiled.

If I left that impression, I apologize.

I intentionally left that impression, and I don't apologize. I will clarify though; there are women like my wife, and there are women who are not like her; that know they must work hard and not sell their "looks" to support themselves. I will say she's making an honest effort at it by working a "normal job" now, and eventually, that's what all women must do (looks fade, after all) when they age or become involved in a monogamous relationship. I know not all women out there (from any country) are the kind that will use their looks to get ahead (or to support themselves entirely) but there are some (I'm married to one. She's trying to change, but it's hard!) still out there. You all know them.

Mayo, hell yes! I lived with a couple of Russian girls before, and we had the industrial size tub of mayo on hand for every meal. They also made me buy as much sour cream as I could get my hands on. Sour cream on Pilmini absolutely rocks!!! (Especially with a little mayo!)

[CityCat 0]

My wife was willing to work hard for her money, but to her, hard work was to meet with a rich older man, (that was usually married with children) make interesting conversation, eat dinner, go to nice places, and let him pay for anything she so desired. (The actual "work" that was done....?) She has explained to me at length that this is something normal in the Far East, that beautiful girls who respect themselves MUST be paid for their time. Like you, I had to ask, "and you're not a prostitute how?" and she replied "if a man is willing to pay a prostitute $100 to only have sex, he must pay me $1000 and take me to nice fashionable places, nice dinners, and do luxurious stuff. It is for him lucky to be with me. He must pay me." I still don't get it. Something like an escort that's not really an escort? A hooker that doesnt' "charge"? Semantics aside, she was used to being wined and dined (and I'll omit the numerical postlude) by rich older gentlemen and had no problems covering her expenses.

Well... To begin with, every pretty woman is tempted at least once in her life to be paid to just hang on somebody's hand, look cute and be paid for it. There is no set price for it, it goes like this (at least for what I know): "Baby, come to daddy! Gimme a kiss! Wanna new necklace? Here! To pay for your cell-phone? Here! Need cash to pay for your apartment? Here!"

I am 5'8" 34C, so I did have a sugar-daddy, a relationship with a rich and powerful man, older, with a family, but I was there 'cause I loved having sex with him, not for his money or restaurant going or clubbing, so it was a relationship after all. He was in love with me as it turned out years later... My point is, he'd give me some cash just for... I don't know why (I was a student but I tutored kids in English and did some other work and had a stipend so I wasn't the poorest one). He'd say: "Here, take this, I know you're going out with your girls to have fun, go to some place nice and drink for me!" Or:"I saw a great pair of shoes in the store, here is ... rubles, these shoes are made for you, go get 'em!" Did this automatically make me a hooker? I don't know.

Generally speaking, the line is fine. But just think about it for a second: would you like getting money doing nothing but smiling, eating, drinking and occasional sex every once in a while? Tempting, like I said...

Therein lies the problem. Now that we're married, the "sugar daddy" (or, sugar daddIES) doesn't pay her bills anymore. I've been told that I must be like Papa Karlo and take a second job so I can buy her nicer things because she deserves them and it's my privelege to be with a woman as wonderful as her. I however, find that to be complete and utter ####### and will not stand for it. So, she's working right now to pay our bills, and we're using both of our paychecks to cover expenses with all of my extra money going toward bills I had prior to our marriage. We've only been at it a week, so we'll see how it goes. Needless to say, the bulk of our relationship problems stem from the fact that I don't have enough money to take her to expensive restaurants and hotels to have sex with her. Maybe someday, we'll be rich enough to do that and she can feel "worthy" again. I can only hope!

As a woman I can assure you, REAL LOVE means more to the most materialistic of us than all diamonds or designers' clothes or restaurants in the world! If she doesn't get it now she will later - a diamond won't kiss you goodnight or have babies with you or it won't give you the most unforgettable orgasm ever! And feeling "worthy" has nothing to do with the size of your check... If she doesn't understand what's real gold, there can be some problems in the future. "Not everything shiny is gold" - old Russian wisdom, you may remind her of it - Не все то золото, что блестит!

I intentionally left that impression, and I don't apologize. I will clarify though; there are women like my wife, and there are women who are not like her; that know they must work hard and not sell their "looks" to support themselves. I will say she's making an honest effort at it by working a "normal job" now, and eventually, that's what all women must do (looks fade, after all) when they age or become involved in a monogamous relationship. I know not all women out there (from any country) are the kind that will use their looks to get ahead (or to support themselves entirely) but there are some (I'm married to one. She's trying to change, but it's hard!) still out there. You all know them.

"Normal" (honest) job is always a hard change after stuff like this.

But all pretty women use their looks to get ahead at least a couple of times in life (it's almost inevitable in the sexist male-dominated society, and there is nothing bad in getting into a night club ahead of the line, for example, just 'cause you're cute as hell! or not getting a speeding ticket for the same reason!) Career-building is a different sphere though. Anyways, some of us stop at just tickets and clubs other go further and pay for everything with their looks, there is a category of women that only open the door with their perfect breasts but stay in the room by their smarts (it's in the case of a rare combination of those two) That's the way it is.

If she loves you deeply she'll find her way!

Mayo, hell yes! I lived with a couple of Russian girls before, and we had the industrial size tub of mayo on hand for every meal. They also made me buy as much sour cream as I could get my hands on. Sour cream on Pilmini absolutely rocks!!! (Especially with a little mayo!)

Interesting! I though I was the only one who buys mayo at Sam's Club! It is fantastic with Pelmeni, you are right! Thanks for support on this one!

Hold on there! It's gonna be alright!

[Visa4habibi! 0]

I'm from Russia and I only use Mayo on a sandwich - never liked it too much! But there's some 'russian' salads that need Mayo, I use it for that.

Russian ice cream was the best I've ever eaten (not too many flawors though). I like ice cream here, but to me most of it is too sweet.

Never had a 'sugar daddy' but that's cause I got married too young.

And about Russians being inpolite - it's just a choice some people make. I'm very polite and always was.

[Nancy2015 2]

Well... To begin with, every pretty woman is tempted at least once in her life to be paid to just hang on somebody's hand, look cute and be paid for it. There is no set price for it, it goes like this (at least for what I know): "Baby, come to daddy! Gimme a kiss! Wanna new necklace? Here! To pay for your cell-phone? Here! Need cash to pay for your apartment? Here!"

Maybe I should be happy that I'm short, overweight and have zits all over my face. After all I'm sure that no man has ever liked me because of my looks. I'm glad people could see through that and appreciate my personality above all else.

I think what you are saying is horrendous, but maybe it's just because I'm not used to stuff like that - I used to hang out with a different crowd. People who read books, discussed Fellini's movies and were concerned about global issues. A woman who openly admits to going out with old farts for money is a creature from another world to me.

I'm not saying it's wrong - I don't think I have the right to judge people. All I'm saying is that I don't get it, I don't want to get it, and I will try to stay away from people who think it's okay.

I understand that I may have offended someone, and I apologize - I didn't mean to. I was deeply shocked by what Slim and noone wrote, and I just couldn't help expressing how I felt about it.

Hope there's no harm done and peace

[dmhweb 0]

"Not everything shiny is gold" - old Russian wisdom, you may remind her of it - Не все то золото, что блестит!

This is more Shakespeare...

"All that glisters is not gold." from "The Merchant of Venice", (Act ii. Sc. 7.) 1596

Shakespeare made it popular but it looks to be much older:

The 12th century French theologian Alain de l'Isle wrote "Do not hold everything gold that shines like gold".

Cheers

[CityCat 0]

Well... To begin with, every pretty woman is tempted at least once in her life to be paid to just hang on somebody's hand, look cute and be paid for it. There is no set price for it, it goes like this (at least for what I know): "Baby, come to daddy! Gimme a kiss! Wanna new necklace? Here! To pay for your cell-phone? Here! Need cash to pay for your apartment? Here!"

Maybe I should be happy that I'm short, overweight and have zits all over my face. After all I'm sure that no man has ever liked me because of my looks. I'm glad people could see through that and appreciate my personality above all else.

I think what you are saying is horrendous, but maybe it's just because I'm not used to stuff like that - I used to hang out with a different crowd. People who read books, discussed Fellini's movies and were concerned about global issues. A woman who openly admits to going out with old farts for money is a creature from another world to me.

I'm not saying it's wrong - I don't think I have the right to judge people. All I'm saying is that I don't get it, I don't want to get it, and I will try to stay away from people who think it's okay.

I understand that I may have offended someone, and I apologize - I didn't mean to. I was deeply shocked by what Slim and noone wrote, and I just couldn't help expressing how I felt about it.

Hope there's no harm done and peace

Your look is something you can't easily get rid of!

Personality should always be taken above looks, that is totally true.

I am afraid you've jumped to conclusions based on what I mentioned - I didn't try to say it was good or bad to be such a woman I was just stating that anthropologically it's possible to subtract such categories of ladies. Besides, I wanted to make it clear that it's not good or bad to be such a lady because historically the stereotype of accepting a woman socially as an object of sexual attraction has settled a while ago and is not going to break down soon... Nothing offensive, it's just true!

Felinni, being married to skinny tiny Mazina for his all life (you know her, right? The leading part in Kabiria Nights and many other movies of his), loved having tons of affairs with tall, busty voluptuous beautiful women (in his case it was explained by his special relationship with his mother and a small psychological trauma in his childhood)... Not an icon of morale exactly, although one of my favorite directors together with Kubrick and Tinto Bras and a couple of others.

Pretty doesn't automatically mean stupid or spoiled or bitchy or materialistic, just think about it for a moment...

That's how the world turns around.

[CityCat 0]

"Not everything shiny is gold" - old Russian wisdom, you may remind her of it - Не все то золото, что блестит!

This is more Shakespeare...

"All that glisters is not gold." from "The Merchant of Venice", (Act ii. Sc. 7.) 1596

Shakespeare made it popular but it looks to be much older:

The 12th century French theologian Alain de l'Isle wrote "Do not hold everything gold that shines like gold".

Cheers

Ooh, thanks for reminding! How could I not have mentioned my favorite Shakespeare here!?

And it is as old as the world itself. And true as much!

[CityCat 0]

Maybe I should be happy that I'm short, overweight and have zits all over my face. After all I'm sure that no man has ever liked me because of my looks.

I am also afraid you are very wrong about that...

[slim 1,514]

Maybe I should be happy that I'm short, overweight and have zits all over my face. After all I'm sure that no man has ever liked me because of my looks.

I am also afraid you are very wrong about that...

I'll support that. You're wrong. A man can find something attractive in every woman. Even if you don't see it, he will!!! Don't kid yourself, no matter what you think you look like, your man is physically attracted to your looks. We're hard-wired to do that, you know.

As for the rest of the stuff, sure, I can see why my wife or other women do what they do. I'm not knocking it one bit. (If I could, I'd do it too!..... for a while, at least.) I'm just saying it's not going to fly here now, and it's not going to fly in our relationship. Like noone stated above, a sugar-daddy is great, but he's not a loving husband.

My wife wasn't like that when we met. She was too young and inexperienced to be "trained" into thinking that way. After six years of it while we were apart.... it comes as second nature now. An "expectation" if you will. I've met plenty of girls like this, and they don't appeal to me at all. I was unaware she had become like this until she was here, and it really wasn't that bad until recently. Previously, she was the nice, innocent, shy young girl that I was dating back in 2000. Now, she's the woman that gets everything she wants because she's that attractive. Or, at least that's what's in her head.

She is being a good wife, and I believe it's because she knows it's a better deal in the long-term (whether that's emotionally or monetarily remains to be seen!) but it's so hard for her to give up this mentality that everyone should be kissing her @$$ because she's so attractive.

To me, that's a horrible attitude, and there's no way I would have a serious relationship with someone that thought that way. But, I can see, it's not so much that this is how she really feels, as it is what she's grown accustomed to. I think over time, she'll develop a more sensible (humble pie, anyone?) approach to interaction with, and expectations of, the men around her. Including me!