Canadian Citizen removed with 5 year ban - unique situation

[nightingalejules 678]

I'm certainly learning a lot by reading this thread. However, I am Canadian and familiar with Canadian laws, not US laws. In Canada if someone comes up here from the US to help someone without being paid, there isn't a penalty for it. I personally know many people who have helped friends and family do renovations etc from England, USA and other countries and they can still come back to Canada.

My friend in the US wasn't aware of this law either, and he should have done some research and informed me from what I'm gathering here.

Nonetheless there's nothing I can do. I can file a 212 waiver, but from what I researched it's like basically making a $585 donation because getting the waive is next to impossible and even with the waiver they can deny me entry without a valid reason.

It seems that no one can make a mistake and everyone from other countries needs to know US law before visiting the US. And you have no rights in the US if you aren't a permanent resident or US citizen.

Actually, the situation you describe is illegal in Canada, too. Work is work, whether you get paid for it or not. And of course us citizens can work for free in the us, since they are legally entitled to work. Again, work is work, in Canada or the US, whether or not you get paid.

Just because some people get away with it doesn't make it legal.

[Caryh 5,206]

Actually I know someone who was visiting friends in Canada from the UK. They were going to help with a few renovations in their home, CBP questioned the guy and he told them just that, no payment of any of the sorts. He was told that no matter what helping is still considered work if he wants to visit he must stick to visiting no helping or he will not be let back in.

Yah I'm sure if he showed up with a toolbox full of tools, all sorts of alarm bells would go off. After all they could hire a Canadian contractor to do that work.

[Ontarkie 14,193]

It sucks as we like to help friends but with friends on both sides of the border we must be careful. Heck I won't even let my dad help with cutting the grass when he visits, he's retired and it's hard to sit still.

I'm sorry you found out the hard way.

[webman 5]

But CBP still let him in the country and didn't ban him for 5 years. Canada is more lenient.

Actually I know someone who was visiting friends in Canada from the UK. They were going to help with a few renovations in their home, CBP questioned the guy and he told them just that, no payment of any of the sorts. He was told that no matter what helping is still considered work if he wants to visit he must stick to visiting no helping or he will not be let back in.

[Ontarkie 14,193]

No he didn't get banned but only because he got someone in a good mood. It goes both ways all depends on the border guy.

Edited June 11, 2014 by Ontarkie

[webman 5]

Thank you for the kind words. I never had any malicious intent or intended on taking anything away from a US citizen. However, I was guilty before I even went to the border crossing since I was intending on helping my friend set up his business for a few days without being paid for it. I guess my morals are screwed up because I was going there to help him with good intentions, and in the eyes of the law it's wrong. Unless I paid the fee to get a work visa to help my friend for free, that would have been ok. So it's about money. It's always about money. Free or not someone has to be paid!

I wasn't helping him to hopefully one day have a job there. If it happened then great. I would have gotten a work visa if that happened. I was helping him because he's my friend and I've known him a long time.

It sucks as we like to help friends but with friends on both sides of the border we must be careful. Heck I won't even let my dad help with cutting the grass when he visits, he's retired and it's hard to sit still.

I'm sorry you found out the hard way.

[Soul Mates 44]

A family member also can't come to the US to help take care of a baby, that takes away a possible job for a babysitter. Does seem a bit silly for some instances but that's the law.

[aaron2020 11,651]

But CBP still let him in the country and didn't ban him for 5 years. Canada is more lenient.

CBP let him in because he had not worked illegally. He has not violated any US laws.

You on the other hand have worked illegally and violated US laws. And from your first post, you were about to enter to do it again.

Big difference.

This is why you got a 5 years ban - for working illegally. What has the other guy done to deserve a ban?

How do you know Canada is more lenient? Because you don't know anyone who got in trouble for working illegally. Canada has the exact same policy as the US. Read this; http://www.newstalk650.com/story/international-students-university-regina-facing-deportation-nigeria/74922

[aaron2020 11,651]

Thank you for the kind words. I never had any malicious intent or intended on taking anything away from a US citizen. However, I was guilty before I even went to the border crossing since I was intending on helping my friend set up his business for a few days without being paid for it. I guess my morals are screwed up because I was going there to help him with good intentions, and in the eyes of the law it's wrong. Unless I paid the fee to get a work visa to help my friend for free, that would have been ok. So it's about money. It's always about money. Free or not someone has to be paid!

I wasn't helping him to hopefully one day have a job there. If it happened then great. I would have gotten a work visa if that happened. I was helping him because he's my friend and I've known him a long time.

You are guilty because you worked illegally, it wasn't like you were an innocent when you tried to enter AGAIN with your IT equipment.

It's not about money. It's about being authorized to work.

Under no circumstances would you get a work visa to come help your friend for free.

No one said you couldn't help your friend. US laws just said you can't illegally work to help your friend.

You are simply not getting that what you did was wrong. You think that you have the moral grounds here. You don't. You are simply using the line "I was helping my friend" to justify breaking US laws on working illegally.

[SBB 74]

In addition to what other posters have said about work being work whether or not you get paid for it, the US tends to look unkindly towards people "volunteering" for profit-making enterprises and sees it as a circumvention of minimum-wage laws.

[Krikit 1,164]

Just for sake of clarification, since the acronyms are getting confused:

Customs & Border Protection (CBP) = United States

Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) = Canada

[indiana_sweetie 120]

It sucks as we like to help friends but with friends on both sides of the border we must be careful. Heck I won't even let my dad help with cutting the grass when he visits, he's retired and it's hard to sit still.

I'm sorry you found out the hard way.

Even cutting grass?

[Mark88 183]

In the end it won't matter what you think or how you were treated: You signed a document admitting to working illegally. You can lawyer up, but it will take a lot of time and cost a lot of money until you can enter the US within the next 5 years again.

[Ontarkie 14,193]

Even cutting grass?

Well I don't want to take any chance of them not visiting.

[canadian_wife 1,818]

It can be a rude awakening for people to realize that they broke immigration rules unknowingly. Often Canadians think that the rules are different for them because we have such a close relationship with the US and many of our rules are relaxed (such as visiting). Sadly, you learned the hard way that what you did was against the rules. It is not a criminal offense, but there are consequences.

Sorry, but honestly, man up and stop blaming the system.

Good luck